Benson-for-Julio talks revisited consummated

by Eric Simon on Jan 21, 2006 7:25 AM EST in News Comment 54 comments

According to a story in today's Newsday, the Mets and Orioles are once again discussing a trade that would send Kris Benson and his salacious but misinformed bride to Baltimore in exchange for the poor man's Armando Benitez, Jorge Julio, and an unnamed prospect. Such a move would likely open a rotation spot for Aaron Heilman, but could very well weaken the Mets' bullpen and rotation simultaneously.

JULIO
YEAR  AGE  ERA  G   IP    SO   SO/9  BB/9   HR/9   H/9   SO/BB
2001  21  3.80  18  21.1  22   9.28  3.80   0.84  10.55  2.44 
2002  22  1.99  67  68.0  55   7.28  3.57   0.66   7.28  2.04
2003  24  4.38  64  61.2  52   7.59  4.96   1.46   8.76  1.53
2004  25  4.57  65  69.0  70   9.13  5.09   1.43   7.70  1.79
2005  26  5.90  67  71.2  58   7.28  3.01   1.76   9.54  2.42

Julio has been extremely erratic and inconsistent throughout his career. He actually seemed to settle down a bit last season, posting the best walk rate and, subsequently, his best K/BB rate so far. His strikeouts dropped a bit from his 2004 level, but it may be that he has settled down a bit and is simply throwing more pitches for strikes.

Further evidence that Julio might have ratcheted things down a notch or two is provided by his hit rate, which spiked from 7.70 H/9 in 2004 all the way up to 9.54 H/9 last season. When a pitcher starts hanging around the strike zone with more frequency he also tends to get battered around more often. At first I thought he might have had an abnormally high BABIP last year, but that doesn't appear to be the case.

I would hope that the prospect included in such a deal is an impact one, as Benson-for-Julio doesn't make much sense.

UPDATE: This is apparently a done deal, according to Newsday. The Mets send Benson to the O's in exchang for Julio and 24-year-old RHP John Maine. Maine is a starting pitcher by trade and posted terrific peripherals in the minors, compiling a 384:104 K:BB ratio in 337.2 MnL innings and just 19 homeruns over that span. He also only allowed 257 hits in those innings.

His big league numbers in 43.2 innings aren't too hot: 6.60 ERA, 5.15 K/9, 5.56 BB/9 (!), 1.85 HR/9 (!) and 9.48 H/9.

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Comments

Anna

Eric can you please tell me what Anna said that was misinformed. Not counting her form of LOL about her sex talks with the whole team and stuff like that there. Because her political stuff is right on line.

"Kris Benson and his salacious but misinformed bride"

By the way if Heilman starts it would cut down somewhat of the need for the bullpen, because I believe he will go into the 7/8th inning very often.

And I also feel that he should win more then 15 games, and play around with the 20 area.

He would be the 3rd pitcher (Pedro & Glavine) to do good in the playoffs and the Ws.

by fredisright on Jan 21, 2006 9:01 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Benson

She writes some interesting rants in her Scarlett Letters feature on her website. Feel free to read them and draw your own conclusions.

by Eric Simon on Jan 21, 2006 10:49 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Interesting rants, but bascally she was not wrong.

by fredisright on Jan 21, 2006 12:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

right

violent murder fantasies about your political opponents is a hallowed American tradition.

Mr Koufax, don't you think Flanders is a big jerk?

by peteyfan45 on Jan 21, 2006 1:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Fred, has anyone ever told you

that you're a furry-brained freak?

by Mr. Met on Jan 21, 2006 4:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

What ever the radical left says is OK, isn't it!

She is not going to kill anyone, silly boy.

by fredisright on Jan 21, 2006 5:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Anything goes

Clearly it's radically left-wing to be appalled by violent, murderous fantasies. What ever happened to decency and personal responsibility? Clearly, on the right these days, it's "anything goes."

by DavidNYC on Jan 21, 2006 6:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

what exactly does micheal moore say

that is
a) all that radicial
b) and deserving of violent death

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 21, 2006 6:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Liberals

Don't you know? Liberals are traitors and deserve death. Anne Coulter said so.

by DavidNYC on Jan 22, 2006 12:01 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i missed the memo

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 22, 2006 1:26 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Traiters that =destroy our nation should=death!

Don't you think so?

And it is not just Anne Coulter that feels that way about it.

And the left is not just kind of moderate, for too many of them are zealots extreme left who do want to hurt our basic nation.

Hmm, are you one of them???

Or if you look up the word moderate in the dictionay you will see a picture of Carl Marx

by fredisright on Jan 22, 2006 9:31 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

You're a caricature

right down to the misspellings.

It's a "basic" nation, indeed, that your ilk comprise.

Civilization, on the other hand...

Back to baseball.

by peeder on Jan 22, 2006 11:51 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

hurt our basic nation???

And by doing what, being against a war that is of dubious neccessity and has killed 2000+ soliders and countless Iraq's(100000?), while distracting us from the catching the evil mass murderer who left 3000+ of our citzens dead on Chambers Street and Vecey right in Manhattan and taunts us with video and audio tapes every few months? Or wanting to tweak our economic system so that works well for more of our country's citzens? Wanting to enforce regulations so people are safe in their jobs? Wanting everyone to be treated fairly under the law?

Speaking of moderation. Is Pat Buchannan moderate, he of stop immigration completely? Or the wonderful Fred Phelps, running aroung the country protesting at people funerals? Or the wonderful people running around the country trying to get Biology classes basically teach "God Created Heaven and Earth" which would leave high school students without and basic understanding of how we got here? How about the warrentless spying on American citizens? Is that an act of moderation? Torturing people in secret CIA jails? Is that an of moderation? Holding people with out Habeus Corpus or trial. Is that a moderate American principle?

As for who I see when I open my "dictionary"? I see Franklin Roosevelt, who created the ground work for the last 60 years of middle class prosperty we have seen in this country, integrated the military setting the stage for the civil rights movement. Oh and he managed to kick some Axis ass too when he needed too. I see Martin Luther King preaching about equaility and justice. I see Thomas Jefferson, who wrote about the government looking out for the common welfare everyone. Not Karl Marx.

You never answered my basic question there Fred? What has Micheal Moore said that is all that radical? and deserves death? I'll pose another simpler one, have you read any of his books? Seen any of his movies? Or you just taking Sean Hannity's word for it?

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 22, 2006 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

please...

Please, please, all of you, stop. You're being trolled. This is a baseball site. Don't we have a stupid trade to complain about?

(Not that I don't agree with you completely, but come on...)

by anonymous on Jan 22, 2006 12:32 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i know

but sometimes can't let these people just go unchallenge

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 22, 2006 12:35 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well played.

Here here, my friend. I second that.

"They win the damn thing by a score of 10-9!"

by ZaBlanc on Jan 23, 2006 12:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

thanks for the complement

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 23, 2006 9:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Reality check.

Fred, why are you on this forum? Certainly a multi-billionaire has better things to do than "squash the left rebellion?" Being anti-worker, and thus anti-family, certainly can't separate out baseball fans from non I guess.

Still, since your dire prediction of certain death at the hands of "the terrorists" is so serious, you must surely be posting this from Iraq or Afghanistan using your military Internet access, right?

Hows the desert heat out there these days?

Still, glad to see people off all sorts of persuasions are involved here.

"They win the damn thing by a score of 10-9!"

by ZaBlanc on Jan 22, 2006 11:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Is it fred Wilpon that is right?

I guess you believe that he who has the money is he who deserves the say.

by peeder on Jan 21, 2006 7:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Orioles minors

Yeah, that would have to be a really good prospect for this deal to make sense, especially if the Mets end up sending any money in the deal (something that would make sense if they could buy their way into a serious prospect rather than a B-lister).

http://www.orioleshangout.com/2005/farm/Top10_2005list.htm

This site's ranking is a little weird (Loewen as low as #10?) but I'd guess the best few guys, Markakis and so on, are completely off the table. The focus should be on getting the 5th-10th best prospect with the best potential. The Mets actually might have their organization more rationally organized than the team they're dealing with, for a change.

by anonymous on Jan 21, 2006 10:55 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

of course the mets

could really be bold and trade benson and sign Jeff Weaver and slot him in the rotation. Wouldn't be losing much performance wise and make your system and bullpen stronger.

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 21, 2006 11:36 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I don't like it

They traded Seo, so are not exactly flush with starters anymore.

As much as I disagree with his wife, I'd just as soon see him stay here, unless we have a suitable replacement.

I hadn't heard anything about Weaver, but I think that he is comparable to Benson.

If they do sign Weaver, then a Benson/Julio trade makes sense. But please can they get some decent prospects in return?

Mr Koufax, don't you think Flanders is a big jerk?

by peteyfan45 on Jan 21, 2006 11:46 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

I'm not sure if Weaver is any more

mentally balanced than he used to be, but I'd be wary of letting him pitch in NY again.

by Mr. Met on Jan 21, 2006 4:07 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Yankees and Mets

are not the same. The pressure at that dump in the Bronx, from the fans, the media and especially the organization itself is greater than it is at Shea.

At any rate, I don't know that he was really there long enough to make that assumption.

Also, could he be more mediocre than Benson?

Mr Koufax, don't you think Flanders is a big jerk?

by peteyfan45 on Jan 21, 2006 5:46 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

he is a couple of years older

and hopefully wiser too, plus he would be coming here to be the 3rd starter not a front line starter like when they got him in the bronx, assuming boras can be reasoned with, i'd do it

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 21, 2006 6:53 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

bad bad move

This is just plain stupid...you will be killin this guy Julio when he blows a few in April..plus, Benson's wife was nice eye candy for the fandom...

by Grouchoman on Jan 21, 2006 4:31 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

Anna

I agree on the baseball side of things. But on the non-baseball side, getting rid of Anna is a good move. She was a distraction to the team, and in NYC, her brand of politics just doesn't play.

Besides, if you still enjoy her as eye candy, that's what the Schminternet is for.

by DavidNYC on Jan 21, 2006 6:05 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

as much as I disagree

with her politics, she certainly has a right to her (IMO bordering on pathological) opinions.

What I thought was much worse was that she was wiilling to bash one of her husband's (now former) teammates in the press.

I wouldn't be at all surprised if that had something to do with her husband's ticket out of town.

Also, New York is a big town, and I'm sure that there is a segment of the population who like knee-jerk jingoism and grisly eliminationist fantasies. After all, New York is the home of Fox News....

Mr Koufax, don't you think Flanders is a big jerk?

by peteyfan45 on Jan 22, 2006 10:40 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

i think that basically what made this trade happen

The shot at Delgado did Benson time in NYC. Even if the Mets wanted to let bygones be bygone with the initial shot. Who is to say she wouldn't do it again and create headache on the team during the season. Mets couldn't take that risk.

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 22, 2006 5:37 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Bye bye Anna

Basically, Kris Benson had to go if the Mets were going to be able to dump Anna Benson on another team. No one was going to take on Anna's idiot mouth without some compensation. Kris had to be included on the deal, unfortunately.

Well, the Zambrano/Benson deals of 2 years ago sure look like a failure. But, we're out of that era now. Still, interesting to come up with a deduction.

As for Anna, her move out of a state which obviously hates America (see its blue voting record) should help her a bit. Those New York America-haters who believe in pro-terroist ideas like workers' rights, womens' rights, and the right for a country not to get the sh*t bombed out of them because they pray 5 times a day to a different God...and who still get regular friendly messages sent to them by the bastard who DID attack them....yeah, she doesn't have to deal with them anymore.

Which is a good thing, seeing that she has a mental capacity just below that of Terri Schiavo.

We'll miss ya Kris (OK, I will). Later bitch.

"They win the damn thing by a score of 10-9!"

by ZaBlanc on Jan 22, 2006 11:45 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

maryland is also a solid blue state

her ignorance won't be loved there either

why does Kris put up with that I don't know she isn't even an attractive woman.

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 22, 2006 11:50 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Well...

Well, she's screwed now, isn't she? ;-)

"They win the damn thing by a score of 10-9!"

by ZaBlanc on Jan 22, 2006 11:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Sign Weaver

then, I love this trade- rumor is that Weaver might be willing to do a one year deal to re-establish himself, then go back on the open market.

BTW, for all those who need to inject politics into a baseball site- you want to say that Kris needed to be traded because of what Anna said about Delgado, that makes sense. To say Kris needed to be traded because of what Anna said about Michael Moore is ludicrous, who cares?

by johnnyc on Jan 23, 2006 11:20 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

inject it?

I think Anna (and Delgado) did that well enough, no one had to contrive a baseball/politics connection.

I think that Anna's comments about Moore just confirmed the opinion that she is a publicity-seeking sociopath who will say anything for attention, regardless of the effect it might have on her husband's team.

I had no problem with trading Benson before I knew Anna's politics, so long as the Mets made a good deal. And while it would certainly lower my estimation of her intelligence and humanity, if Pedro Martinez' wife (does he have one?) had a website where she published graphic fantasies about the torture and murder of people who did not share her political opinions, that doesn't mean I would start to think that the Mets should trade Pedro (unless, that is, they got someone of comparable value in the deal.)

What I would like to ask you is, was anyone actually saying here that Benson should be traded because of what she thinks of Moore?

It seems to me that no one really noticed Anna's unfortunate comments to Michael Moore until after she had already blasted the GM, the organization, and especially the first baseman in the papers. And we had all heard and commented on the Benson rumors before that.

When I first heard of this deal, I though it was a bad move, especially since the Mets had already traded a starter for a potentially questionable middle releiver. However, since I've realized that my misgivings aren't going to change the situation, I'm at least reconciled the hope that Omar has some kind of plan, and to the fact that at least the team I root for is no longer associated with someone as distasteful as Mrs. Benson.

Mr Koufax, don't you think Flanders is a big jerk?

by peteyfan45 on Jan 23, 2006 5:03 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Seemingly, yes

"What I would like to ask you is, was anyone actually saying here that Benson should be traded because of what she thinks of Moore?"

This can be inferred from several of the comments below the first post.

It was directly stated by DavidNYC above, that Benson needed to be traded because Anna's politics aren't in line with liberal New York.

And, to my mind, that's nonsense.

You don't think there are more than a few guys in the clubhouse who have no use for Michael Moore, and who love George Bush?

It's been noted elsewhere that Piazza was a big Rush Limbaugh fan- never seemed to hurt his popularity with Mets fans, I saw plenty of Piazza jerseys at Shea.

But, my main point went to the whole thread that sprouted from the first comment above, which was devoid of baseball entirely, although I now see stuff below in the "George Bush for Commissioner" thread.

I recognize that politics and baseball end up mixing, but not to the extent that you see here, where some of the posts are devoid of any relevance to baseball.

But, to each their own.

by johnnyc on Jan 24, 2006 1:47 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Regardless of who she said what about...

It starts to be distracting when it gets publicity. So when Anna Benson's comments (whether they were about Michael Moore or Bill O'Reilly) suggesting violent torture and death fantasys about a public figure get play, its not exactly the image the mets want to project. Especially when her husband is 10-8 with a plus 4 era and it doesn't hurt that your team is in NY instead of Texas.

by thekickingdonkey on Jan 25, 2006 11:19 AM EST up reply actions 0 recs

politics + baseball

I know that sports is where people come to get away from politics. So to those who felt there peace was disturbed this weekend, i'm sorry. However, we are living in a time(not since the 60s) where politics is on a lot of peoples minds, for a number of reasons(war,terrorism, ecomonic problems, etc). And baseball in general can't hide from these things right now. Look at some of the issues that have come up this offseason alone

Delgado being asked not engage in his "God Bless America" protest by the Mets.
Anna Benson comments on above issue.
The Cuba World Baseball Classic issue.
Alex Rodriguez having problems deciding if should play for DR or the US.
Goverment forcing baseball to adopt a revised steroids penalty.
Stadium issues here in NYC with both the Yankees and the Nets.

Furthermore, I felt I was personally challenged by Fred with his comments. I felt like I had to stand up for what I believe, regardless of forum.

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 23, 2006 9:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

you want a mix of politics and baseball?

Try this on for size, Jon...

Over the last few years, I've heard speculation about what our lame-duck president will do when he is out of office.

I swear that more than one commentator has said that he should be the commissioner of baseball(!). You know, since he "loves the game" and "has experience in the business."

I'm sorry, but it would be a national outrage if Bush gets that job. I think I'd boycot the MLB entirely.

by kingcritical on Jan 23, 2006 10:33 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

supposedly he was almost made commissioner

when Bart Giamatti died, i doubt MLB would do this considering how many people it would irritate, plus has this man ever run a successful business

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 23, 2006 10:40 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

He's too intellectually lazy to take an actual job

when he leaves office. He's going directly into retirement, to be trotted out for the occassional campaign speech or disaster relief effort, just like his daddy.

He may be enticed to give the occassional speech for hundreds of thousands at a pop. I can't imagine him doing anything in an actual business", write books (or even read books), or support charities.

by Mr. Met on Jan 24, 2006 12:51 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

yeah olny way he is commish

if they let him run it from the 17th green @ a West Texas country club

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 24, 2006 11:58 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Item: Clemens, pitching for the Rangers,

beans Piazza, batting for the Yankees.

Commissioner Bush issues his ruling:

"A suspension, in this case, would not be warran-ted, because it wouldn't be com-pash-a-nut. Roger's a good Texan. I've looked into his soul, and I can tell you, it's pure. I order Piazza to take some anger management classes. Roger's welcome to sit on the porch with Trent Lott and me or come down to Crawford to clear brush any time.

Now watch this drive..."

by Mr. Met on Jan 25, 2006 8:14 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

lol

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 25, 2006 9:55 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

His experience in baseball...

is trading Sammy Sosa. The Mets traded Nolan Ryan for an aging Jim Fregosi - did Joan Payson get to be comissioner? BTW, I'm not (AT ALL) blasting Ms. Payson. She brought baseball back to NY and that would overshadow any bad deal.

by thekickingdonkey on Jan 24, 2006 12:27 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

miserable failure

I know that Bush has no "real" baseball experience of which to speak.

Bush is a miserable failure. Family friends have handed him every job he's held, and he is an abomination, weaving a pattern on distruction through the years on everthing he touches.

But I could see some people thinking that he would make a great commissioner--as I've said, I've heard it thrown out there. And that scares me.

by kingcritical on Jan 24, 2006 1:15 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Don't forget Piazza

saying that meeting Rush Limbaugh was like meeting George Washington. That was the most gag-o-riffic thing I heard all year.

by Mr. Met on Jan 24, 2006 12:52 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

UID

Hey, Mets Rule. Your user-ID number is 86. How cool is that?

by kingcritical on Jan 24, 2006 1:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Thanks KC

I shoulda played the lottery the day that happened, huh? Although I suppose there's someone out there with 1986. And 1969.

by Mr. Met on Jan 24, 2006 1:41 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

oh by the way

count me in the first camp, i think Omar did this because he doesn't want to create a problem on his team. Anna Benson was becoming a Steinbrenner situtation, where every time something would happen on the team, the press was seeking her out hoping to get contraverial commentary. Her recent comments were bad enough, who knows what was coming next with her? Maybe the new Mrs. Delgado gets sick of it confronts her at a game or a charity dinner. Maybe Delgado tells Kris to have her knock it off and Kris doesn't like it. Plus the Mets specifically asked Delgado to tone down his protest, how would it go over if they allowed Anna to potshot him in the papers without reprussions. Your asking him to be company guy and then company doens't protect him? The person who really needs to look himself in the mirror today is Kris Benson. I am married, I would expect that my wife would not create an issue with one of my co-workers under any circumstances. And I would not allow it, I would ask my wife to respect my workplace, leave my teammates alone and not to damage my career. And a loving, secure spouse(husband or wife) would give the one he/she loves that courtesy and respect.

its a ground ball...trickling... its a fair ball, its by Buckner, rounding third Knight, the Mets will win the ballgame, the Mets win

by DoctorK16 on Jan 23, 2006 10:00 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Maine is the Wild Card

If he turns into a good pitcher, this will have been a good move for the Mets. Either way, Benson was overrated and it's good to get Aaron Heilman back in the rotation. The only thing that scares me is the idea of Victor Zambrano making (shudder) 33 starts.

I'd take Jeff Weaver over Zambrano, especially if he comes cheap, regardless of what happened in the Bronx. Javier Vazquez and (especially) Jose Contreras were able to recover from enduring a sentence in that prison.

by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 23, 2006 12:41 PM EST reply actions 0 recs

John Maine

As far as I can tell, John Maine is basically identical to Aaron Heilman (and maybe it's fair to lump Seo in here too): a promising, cheap starting pitching prospect who hasn't quite put it all together yet. It's nice to get back some of the depth of younger starters we lost by trading Seo, but premature to think that Maine might end up as a really valuable player. I'd be overjoyed, and the trade would be a net win, if he was about three-quarters as good as Benson. It should make for an interesting battle between him and Heilman in spring training (even though probably all of us would rather see Zambrano out and both of these guys in). And maybe Peterson really can help him succeed. But right now he looks a little like a throw-in to me, and I can't see Benson for Julio as anything but a salary (and wife) dump.

by anonymous on Jan 23, 2006 5:28 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs