I liked Milledge and I am not sold on Carlos Gomez although I guess I had better get used to him.

Like you said Eric, we replace Milledge with Church. Lastings is cheaper, younger and has a lot more upside.

Schneider is slightly worse or the same as Estrada and much, much worse than Lo Duca, who I don't even like but now looks like Piazza in comparison.

This is terrible. We have been getting progressively worse since the Nady trade.

Milledge could always make this one blow up in our faces but have you really seen anything to make you think he's going to be the player people thought he would be originally?  I've seen flashes but nothing substantive really.

I don't really like that we got rid of Milledge since he seemed likely to start in the OF this season. Church is a good player, albeit slightly older than Milledge. He is an OBP-machine, which I like (Moneyball-type fan here). The question I pose - "who is going to be our 3rd OF? Is Church going to start or Endy Chavez? I guess they might be sufficient, or similar to the production Milledge would have produced but I would have liked to see a larger upgrade here!

We're just not in a strong dealing position now because our minors suck from AA up vs. other teams like Boston and the Yankees.  We must put a lot of effort into rebuilding our system.  At this point, we're going to have to liquidate our system to get the pitcher we so badly need.  This team must win next year or maybe in 2009 because the window is closing fast!

What we'll get maybe one or two good years from these guys each.

Would have rather only taken one of them plus a very good graft pick. We need to stay young at all times even if only using for trade chips.

Scheider is what he is, but there's nothing wrong with having a guy who calls a great game and nails runners like Scheidner.  Maybe his bat is a bit light in the SLG, but a 330-340OBP isn't atrocious.

I think people declaring this trade a mistake are really overrating Milledge.  Sure he has great tools, and may well be a star someday.  But, if you think he could've brought more back in a trade, your kidding yourself.  Obviously he wasn't a key to any deal for an ace, or he'd still be here.  That's obvious on his face.  But Church is a better player for the Mets in 2008 and Omar whether we like or not is win now mode.  Because if we flounder next year, it won't matter to Omar that Milledge shines in 2009 if Omar gets canned in the winter of 2008.

Now they're doing the same in '08, going with old crappy guy Ryan Church, except they don't even have Milledge waiting in the wings, ready to blossom. Just a terribly run team.

By the way, this is not the first time Omar has traded for Church.

Lastings Milledge is still one of the better young outfield prospects in the game. By dealing him for an awful player in Brian Schneider, the Mets sold low on a former first-round pick with a lot of upside and committed two years and too much money to a catcher who can't hit.

The Mets get ... nothing, or close to it. Schneider will earn $10.3 million over the next two years to sit behind the plate when the rules call for it, and to make 300-odd outs at the plate while hitting .230/.320/.330 or thereabouts. He is the definition of replacement level -- his offensive production was roughly as valuable as what Guillermo Quiroz did in eleven plate appearances for Texas last year -- and paying him $10 million is bad enough. Giving up something of value to acquire that contract is horrible. It would be better to pay Johnny Estrada $3-4 million to be bad for one year than Schneider over $10 million to be worse for two years.

There's a small silver lining for the Mets in the acquisition of Ryan Church, a capable platoon bat in left or right field if you have a right-handed caddy for him. Unlike Schneider, he has value on a big league roster, but even swapping Milledge straight-up for Church wouldn't make sense because of Church's struggles against lefties, his long history of minor injuries, his age and his expense as a super-two player this winter.

Before Schneider's acquisition David Lennon of Newsday wrote the following about Estrada:

The Mets obviously were not satisfied with Paul Lo Duca - they didn't bother to make him an offer - and wanted someone who, along with Castro, would do a better job of handling the pitching staff. Based on his previous three stops with the Braves, Diamondbacks and Brewers, Estrada appears up to the task.

Starting with the Braves in 2004, each of those teams' ERAs improved after Estrada arrived. With Javy Lopez in 2003, Atlanta had a 4.10 ERA, which ranked 12th in baseball. That dropped to 3.75 with Estrada the following season, tops in baseball.

The trend continued in 2006 with the Diamondbacks. The previous year, with Chris Snyder the primary catcher, Arizona had a 4.84 ERA (25th). That dropped to 4.48 (13th) with Estrada.

The same thing happened in Milwaukee, where the Brewers' ERA went from 4.82 (25th) in 2006 to 4.41 (15th) with Estrada in 2007. The Mets had a 4.26 ERA - 12th in baseball - last season.

Of course, Estrada can be considered only one factor, but such a significant reduction should be noted on a catcher's resume. As for the criticism Estrada has endured for his poor success rate of throwing out would-be base-stealers last season, there are mitigating factors.

Estrada threw out 13 percent (11-for-84), but the 73 stolen bases he allowed still were fewer than Josh Bard (121), Jorge Posada (102) and Gold Glove winner Russell Martin (82). Nine catchers allowed between 68 and 74 stolen bases.

It's also important to consider that Estrada played last season with a bone spur in his throwing elbow. The spur was removed Oct. 4.

I hope the balls the Mets acquired in the proverbial bucket of balls for LM were at least autographed.
 

17 games a year where young Lastings steals a bag, makes a grab, and strikes out will be grating...

Can all of you who have been posting non-disgusted reactions to this trade please (a) explain your reasoning about how this makes the Mets any better, or indeed even not palpably worse, on the field?  Or (b) give a rationale of any kind about why this trade had to be made?

About point (a): this trade seems likely to hurt even the 2008 Mets, and virtually certain to hurt the team's future, as losing a talented youngster always does.  As was mentioned upthread, Milledge and Church were roughly equivalent hitters last year, and only one of them is likely to improve.  Schneider is no better as a hitter than Estrada or Castro, but he is well-paid, making him (moving on to point (b)) very low in trade value.  The Nationals ought to have sought no return at all for him in trade, treating it as a pure salary dump, and even then they might not have found a taker other than Omar.  Milledge's reputation was low right now, but he's a young and talented player; there was no earthly reason not to hang onto him, plug him into the major-league team for a year or two, and see how he adapted.  This is a classic case of selling low and buying high; when even stat-allergic Buster Olney can't find anyone in baseball who thinks the Mets got a good deal, it's a sad day.  Omar's looking more and more like a dumb guy who sometimes gets lucky, and less and less like an intelligent GM, with every passing minute: honestly, who can defend the intelligence of a guy who just got fleeced by Jim Bowden, of all people?