Tuesday Applesauce

by Eric Simon on Dec 2, 2008 10:46 AM EST in Link Dump Comment 13 comments

Nick Evans strained his right quad playing winter ball in Puerto Rico and has been sent home for rehab. Reports indicate that Evans was a sad little puppy without his best bud Dan Murphy by his side, so the injury comes as something of a mixed blessing for him.

Mets Tailgate likes Bob Howry, now more than ever in light of the Cubs declining to offer him arbitration last night.

The Mets are pretty interested in Brian Fuentes, and reportedly plan to meet with him in Las Vegas next week. Signing Fuentes would cost the Mets their first round pick next June, which should certainly give them some pause.

At MetsGeek, Mike Newman looks at some hypothetical trades and James Kannengieser makes a case for some former Mets who will appear on this year's Hall of Fame ballot.

Bob Klapisch doesn't think the Mets got their money's worth out of Pedro Martinez, arguing that the $53 million they gave him over four years included considerable time on the disabled list, a disappointing 2008, and nothing closer to a World Championship than falling in seven games to the Cardinals in the 2006 NLCS.

At RotoGraphs, Peter Bendix looks at Johan Santana from a fantasy point-of-view, and concludes that he is good, but not that good.

At FanGraphs Eric Seidman evaluates Carlos Beltran and figures that the Mets could reasonably pay him $10 million more per season and still get their money's worth.

Also at FanGraphs, Dave Cameron analyzes Aaron Heilman's candidacy for the starting rotation.

Speaking of FanGraphs, they're now carrying wOBA for every player/year in history. Awesome.

At Beyond the Boxscore, R.J. Anderson crunches some SQL in comparing Barry Bonds's and Ted Williams's astonishing offensive accomplishments.

Ted Rogers, telecom magnate and Blue Jays principal owner, died last night of congestive heart failure.

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tangotiger on whether pedro was worth it

short, informative and pretty neutral post

by kendynamo on Dec 2, 2008 11:52 AM EST reply actions 0 recs

Nice article

Financially, Pedro was an $18 million net loss over the life of his contract. If we consider that he (a) facilitated the arrival of Carlos Beltran by making the Mets a more attractive brand, (b) put butts in the seats, © improved the Mets’ image abroad and was a huge reason that Fernando Martinez signed with the Mets, and (d) other things that didn’t involve his direct contributions on the field, I don’t think there’s any question the Mets got their money’s worth.

by Eric Simon on Dec 2, 2008 12:02 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Word

As much as we try, a player’s value cannot be measured stricly quantitatively.

by Sokojoe on Dec 2, 2008 12:19 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

true.

but many of the things Eric listed CAN be measured quanititatively

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Dec 2, 2008 8:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

we just don't "remember" to include them enough (or know how to)

Beyond the Boxscore // Calling BJ Upton lazy is lazy.

by Sky Kalkman on Dec 2, 2008 8:24 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Concur

Which is why work continues. Can’t wait until we can quantify a player’s value on a team’s branding, I’m sure Bora’s would be all over that.

by Sokojoe on Dec 2, 2008 8:29 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I agree with this

and I also hate when computers turn ( c ) into ©

by cjmulrain on Dec 2, 2008 1:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

I disagree

Like with Martinez, Beltran signed because the Mets gave him more money and more years than anyone else. If Pedro was such a lure, why didn’t Beltran give the Mets the “Yankees discount”?
The Omar/Pedro combo was supposed to give the Mets the edge in the Latin American market. F-Mart aside, the Mets have not made much of an impact. With the exception of Wilmer Flores, the Mets top prospects have been North American draftees.

Pedro did generate buzz and give fans a reason to come out to Shea, but any winning team would have done that. And Derek Lowe likely provided a similar return on investment in 2005 and a better return over the life of his contract.

Bottom line: The Mets paid for four years to get two years out of Pedro and ended up with 1.5. I don’t like to agree with Klapisch but I think he is right on this one.

by Reg Dunlop on Dec 2, 2008 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Don't forget

Deolis Guerra also signed with us because of Pedro. He was a big part of getting us Johan, being the pitcher with the most upside but really had an awful season last year. In addition to Flores, Jefry Marte had a huge season.

I agree with you that fans will come out to see any winning team. But you have to remember in 2005, we were not a winning team yet Pedro starts routinly sold out. I know people wouldn’t have walked-on sold out Derek Lowe starts. The atmosphere at Shea for his starts was something I didn’t feel since 2000, which doesn’t sound that bad but those 2001-2004 seasons felt very long.

by Sokojoe on Dec 2, 2008 3:12 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Obviously, they didn't get a $53 million return

But he was our savior in 2005. I remember a few 12:00 games on Thursday afternoons where 40,000 fans showed up to see him. If Pedro hadn’t been starting, it probably would have been around 25,000. He was also our gateway to Beltran and several Latino prospects. In that sense, his value is hard to overstate. So was he worth $53 million over four years? Of course not. Was his acquistion regrettable? Not really.

"When the little children start to speak they once said 'Mama' and 'Papa', but with the fans we got they say the first thing, 'Metsie, Metsie, Metsie'." - Casey Stengel

by Prince on Dec 2, 2008 3:31 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Fernando!

The Padres reportedly offered Fernando Martinez a larger signing bonus than the Mets did, for what it’s worth. Fernando himself credited Pedro with finalizing his decision.

by DannyMetsGeek on Dec 2, 2008 6:11 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

speaking of F-Mart

what’s the word on him for ‘09? i assume he’s starting the season in triple-A, but is there any chance we see him in the big leagues this year? guess it all depends on his spring training/minor league performance this year…

by englishgrey on Dec 2, 2008 9:04 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs

Word is

he will be starting the year in AAA and the Mets have proved in the past that they are not afraid of calling prospects up even if they’re quite ready. But I would think his performance as well as his health would dictate when we’ll see him in the majors.

by Sokojoe on Dec 2, 2008 10:56 PM EST up reply actions 0 recs