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Around SBN: The End Of Sabanball: Details, Barbarians, And Precision

Suck It, Bright Side

If you're one of the many folks calling for Willie Randolph's head, it looks like you can keep your pitchforks out for little while longer. Randolph met yesterday with Omar Minaya, Fred and Jeff Wilpon, ostensibly to discuss the manager's comments from the other day during which he implied that certain negative analyses of his managing might have been racially motivated. Since when has shoddy bullpen management been strictly the domain of white skippers? For his part, Minaya claims that the Mets never intended to fire Randolph during the meeting, though I can't help but be amused picturing Willie Randolph as Albert Brooks's character in Defending Your Life, complete with white robe and self-deprecating Jewiness.

It's gotten to the point where I can't even bear to watch Mets games anymore. I just ordered my folks an HDTV, and when I told my dad the good news all he could say was, "Maybe by the time it arrives the Mets will stop stinking." Don't hold your breath. I still contend that the Mets are hitting into some bad luck, but I can only pitch that tent in so many places before their luck turns around or I inevitably hit pavement. Carlos Beltran can pound liner after liner into an infielder's mitt, but no table of stats is going to plate more runs or win more ballgames.

I honestly can't remember the last time I was so frustrated with a Mets team. I guess it was the early aughts when we were misled into believing that Mo Vaughn and Jeromy Burnitz would bring a modern-day Murderer's Row in Queens. Back then, Steve Phillips sold us a rotten bill of goods, and a lot of us bought into it because we didn't know any better. Has Omar Minaya done the same thing a half-dozen years later? I'm not so sure. These Mets have their flaws -- perhaps the most glaring is the lack of any viable contingency plans for injuries incurred to starters, especially those with vast histories of unhealth -- but this team has a lot more young talent (actual talent!) than the 2002 club. That team relied on thirty-somethings like Burnitz, Vaughn, Roberto Alomar et al; this one can still count several twenty-somethings among its nucleus. That should be enough to send the analogy to a grinding halt.

Pedro Martinez may be a week away from returning, and I had really hoped that Mike Pelfrey would have shown more consistency to this point to make the decision to send Claudio Vargas back to New Orleans an easy one. Yet, as much as I champion Pelfrey as a future star, he simply hasn't been putting the Mets in a position to win many ballgames of late, and Vargas -- aside from the start in Atlanta -- generally has. I still think Pelfrey should be the one to stay, but I can't say it's obviously the best decision for the short-term benefit of this team. Most decisions should be weighted for short- and long-term profitability (production-wise), but we'll have to see where the Mets go with this one.

Nick Evans had a nice debut in Colorado and he almost hit one out of the park last night, but the Mets are going to have a tough time scoring runs with he and Endy Chavez manning the corner outfield spots. I suspect that Ryan Church will be back any day now, but the Mets are really giving it up in the corners without him.

Johan Santana goes at it on Tuesday against Andrew Miller. Miller has been terrific over his last four starts, and the Mets have been dreadful for a week now.

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and so it goes

Bob Klapisch seemed downright insulted this morning that the Wilpons didn’t fire Willie yesterday afternoon:

http://www.northjersey.com/sports/Better_to_let_Randolph_go_now.html

Of course, to me, it seems odd that Klapsich mentions “overpaying” for guys like Pedro, Beltran, Wagner and Santana but has nothing in the way of strong words for Omar. Then again, I’m not on the “Fire Omar” bus quite yet. Reminiscing about Steve Phillips here keeps me far away from those thoughts.

by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on May 27, 2008 9:03 AM EDT reply actions  

I still don’t get how it is that Omar seems to be getting a free pass here.
Does Willie misuse the bullpen? yes, but what does he really have down there? Heilman’s suckiness has really hampered an already thin pen. A pen that Omar knew was a problem from last year, and the only player he brought in was Matt Wise!
Omar gave Castillo a 4 year deal, need I say more on that?
I won’t kill him for acquiring or not replacing Delgado, but to not have a player capable of playing first base as a back-up is inexcusable. Can Willie sit the big guy for a week? no because who is going to play first in his absence?
In my opinion Omar has made more bad moves then good moves over the last few years. I’m not saying that he should be fired, I just don’t get how it is that he doesn’t feel any heat.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on May 27, 2008 9:42 AM EDT reply actions  

Not sure I agree 100%

“Does Willie misuse the bullpen? yes, but what does he really have down there? Heilman’s suckiness has really hampered an already thin pen. A pen that Omar knew was a problem from last year, and the only player he brought in was Matt Wise!”

Wagner, Heilman, Feliciano and Smith were all pretty good last season. Schoeneweis was miserable but showed promise as a situational lefty (and has actually exceeded that promise this year). I would argue that Omar was right to think that the bullpen could be a strength with a few minor tweaks, though I’m not sure why Matt Wise (very average and 32 so it’s not like he could be expected to improve) was the way to go.

Regarding 1B, I think if our regular outfielders are ever all healthy at the same time, we’ll see Evans getting some starts at 1B (I believe that’s his natural position) against lefties, since Delgado has been (while still not good) better against righties.

You’re right, though, about Castillo. I have no idea why anyone thought he deserved 4 years.

by JoshNY on May 27, 2008 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions  

Bullpen

- Smith was sent down to the minors, I don’t know that the Mets were sure what they would get out of him at all.
- I began to turn on Heilman towards the end of last year. I guess Omar had more faith in him then me.
- Pedro 2 and Wagner you could have expected status quo from them.
- Mota was addition by subtraction.
- Show had to get better.
After that you can’t tell me Omar didn’t see a need for more then Matt Wise.
I can rattle of at least 5 moves that Omar has made that have really hurt this team, I’m just not sure firing Willie helps anything.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on May 27, 2008 11:27 AM EDT up reply actions  

I knew we needed to make bullpen moves

Did you think we’d be fine if Omar did nothing? I desperately wanted Cordero or Linebrink. Heilman has never been trustworthy in the setup role. Joe Smith was pretty good last year, but it would be unrealistic to have similar expectations for him this year. I was ecstatic when he signed Johan, but disgusted that he didn’t get any bullpen help.

Fight J-Roll the A-Holl!

by Prince on May 27, 2008 2:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

The butcher and the baker and the people on the street, where did they go? To meet the Mets!

by Rod Gaspar Fan Club on May 27, 2008 10:28 AM EDT reply actions  

yes

“It’s gotten to the point where I can’t even bear to watch Mets games anymore.”

Same here, Eric. I’m done with school, and I’ve got all the time during the evening to watch them, and I just don’t want to. Hell, I barely want to go to the games I have tickets for (against Texas in June and Colorado in July).

At this point, the only thing that’s keeping me interested at all is the fact that in recent years, there have been a lot of teams who played dreadful ball for 2 months who then ignited at the right time and made the postseason (2003 Marlins, 2004/2005 Astros, 2006 Twins, 2007 Yankees) so I can only hope the Mets will follow in their footsteps.

Flushing, Queens: soon to be known as Johan's-burg!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on May 27, 2008 11:59 AM EDT reply actions  

I feel your pain Ian

Part of the reason that I would like to see Willie fired is that at least it might create some interest in seeing how the new manager does. It is still early and anything can happen, but last year’s collapse, age, bad chemistry in the clubhouse recently make things look bleak. I disagree with Doc who doesn’t put much stock into team psychology, but I view this as a joint nervous breakdown.

Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on May 27, 2008 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ditto for me, Ian

School just ended for me, and while I am trying to secure a summer internship, I still have a lot of time on my hands. I was fighting myself to watch the game last night instead of playing Wii or reading or whatever.

by SQUAD on May 27, 2008 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bonds

We can’t depend on Delgado and Alou any longer for various reasons. Omar, please do the following:

Release Alou/Delgado
Sign Bonds for LF
Call up Carp to platoon with Evans at 1B.
Release Easley
Release Cassanova
Call up Anderson Hernandez
Call up Val Pascucci

This team needs an infusion of young talent and some power. Plus, having a backup MI who can actually move laterally would help spell Reyes and Castillo. Pascucci can become the main RH PH off the bench.

Lineup: Reyes, SS; Castillo, 2B; Wright, 3B; Bonds, LF; Beltran CF; Church, RF; Carp/Evans, 1B; Schneider, C

Bench: AHern, Endy, Tatis, Pascucci, Castro

by SQUAD on May 27, 2008 1:31 PM EDT reply actions  

Yes, seriously.

Right now we have no one, NO ONE, who can play credible MI defense on the bench, let alone SS. In my eyes, AHern replaces Easley, who has looked TERRIBLE in the field. He hasn’t been getting it done with the stick, so, imo, I would rather have someone who does SOMETHING well coming off the bench and AHern plays fantastic defense. Easley as our backup SS is a joke.

by SQUAD on May 27, 2008 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Omar deserves more heat

There was a lot of fire around here over Ruban Gotay but don’t forget about Xavier Nady, Jeff Keppinger, Heath Bell and Matt Lindstrom. All of these guys could have helped the team far more than Roberto Hernandez, Luis Castillo, Damon Easley or Marlon Anderson. Throw in Jesus Flores who was given away for nothing. How about not signing Livian Henanadez or even Kyle Loshe as insurance in case Pelfrey went south? How about not trading Heilman, maybe in a package with Lastings for a hitter at a time when his value was at its highest and then not even using Heilman as a starter his best role. There were reports that had him and/or Lastings as the centerpiece of a Manny Rameriz deal!! Omar has done some good things but he has also missed a lot of good deals and/or gave away too many good players.
Make Heilman a starter now, its his only hope and he can’t be much worse then Pelf. Other than that, I have no idea what can be done other than wait for some folks to play better and/or get healthy. Maybe have Reyes, Wright and Delgado do infield practice before every game??!!

by Endys Game on May 27, 2008 1:36 PM EDT reply actions  

if duaner doesn't get in a cab at 2 am

nady doesn’t get traded. blame duaner, not omar.

and heath bell was meh while he was with the mets, so i don’t really give a shit about how he’s doing now.

by gogomets on May 27, 2008 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Uhh

The Mets got Oliver Perez for Xavier Nady. I don’t see how that’s a bad deal for the Mets.

Also, you can’t bemoan the loss of Ruben Gotay AND Jeff Keppinger, since one was swapped for the other.

Omar’s biggest transgression was failing to have viable contingency plans in place for Alou’s inevitable injury time and Delgado’s seemingly-inevitable regression towards fecklessness.

by Eric Simon on May 27, 2008 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bonds

I don’t care if he comes here and hits 500 homeruns as a Met!! If they sign Bonds I am no longer a fan of this team. You have to have some dignity and respect for the game even if it means you lose.

by Endys Game on May 27, 2008 1:39 PM EDT reply actions  

sigh

if the mets won a world series with bonds on the team, you wouldn’t be happy? yeah, i’m sure.

by gogomets on May 27, 2008 3:12 PM EDT up reply actions  

Eric gogomets and others

The Pirates gave Perez away and Omar was not, unless you have info to the contrary that I don’t know about, really looking for a starter at that time. We did not need to give up Nady for Perez. We gave him up for Hernandez. And you know what, this year I’d rather have Nady than Perez.
I don’t bemoan the loss of Gotay , never did. I never thought Gotay was anything great, that was your pet peeve. I thought at the time that losing Keppinger was a big mistake because he had a proven record of hitting 300 in the minors and that almost always translates into major league success. and that is exactly what happened.
gogomets: I like your posts normally but you are being silly here if you think adding Bonds get this team into the World Series let alone wins it. But yes, even if he won a title with them, it would be tainted in my eyes, you bet. I am not so fake as to act as if someone who I think has embarrassed and disgraced the game as badly as he has can be given a free pass just because he wins a ring.

by Endys Game on May 27, 2008 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions  

Singling out Bonds is Ignorant

Bonds wasn’t the only one who took PEDs… far from it, in fact. I’m not exonerating him because there were many others, but the way people want to crucify this guy is just ridiculous.

by SQUAD on May 27, 2008 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

You are entitled to your viewpoint

but there is nothing ignorant about mine. yes, many players took PED’s but only one broke the all time home run record while doing it. And is facing a federal charge for repeatdly lying about it to a grand jury. Plus he is a jerk. This is the guy you want to bring into an already divided clubhouse? and for what/ Two to three wins at most assuming he can stay on the field more than Alou? No thanks.

by Endys Game on May 27, 2008 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

What does the HR record have to do with it?

So breaking the HR record somehow makes Bonds taking PEDs worse than FP Santangelo taking them? I didn’t realize there was a sliding scale of culpability based on who is a jerk and who isn’t.

Plus, bringing in Bonds could serve as a lightning rod to take some of the focus off the rest of the team. Things can’t get much worse for this team and they could use a power bat. Bonds costs nothing but money and is the perhaps the best hitter in baseball history.

by SQUAD on May 27, 2008 4:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

i didn't say that adding him would automatically get us in

just presenting a hypothetical situation.

but you can’t say “i’d rather have nady than perez.” duaner got hurt, we needed middle relief help, omar saw a good offer from the pirates to get a middle reliever and a LHP with disgusting stuff. all of that for xavier nady? not a bad deal.

by gogomets on May 27, 2008 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Here is a poll question/conversation starter for you...

If the Mets fired Willie and brought back Bobby Valentine right now you would be:

A) For it.
B) Against it.
C) Just waiting for the ‘stache.

Fear the ‘stache

by Doc's Sports Picks Guru on May 27, 2008 3:10 PM EDT reply actions  

Best 2 out of 3?

Can’t I pick both A) and C)?

Can I couch the Bobby V pick based on whether Beeny Agbayani is in the deal? Cos I’m not sure that I could handle another Benny tenure.

by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on May 27, 2008 3:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

A

But he has to manage with the stash.

The time has come for someone to put his foot down. And that foot is me.

by sireric on May 27, 2008 5:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

You're wrong.

Kingcritical says so. Don’t be so negative. The Mets will win 100 this year,

David Wright MVP Watch: .311/4/14! (through 12 games)

by ZaBlanc on May 27, 2008 3:17 PM EDT reply actions  

and yet another one

So I was out of the country for 10 days and not around the site as much as usual.

When I had occasion to check in, I see that you’ve hit a number of threads with comments that call me out by name.

You have yet to respond to one of my replies. What’s the deal?

We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!

by kingcritical on May 28, 2008 4:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

Joe Sheehan has a good article on Big Willie today in BP

basically willie can only be blamed for so much, since its omar’s blunders that willie must deal with, but since omar is not going to fire himself, somebody’s got to be the fall guy.

sheehan also points out that alou, delgado and pedro are a bunch of fat zeros. so theyre eating up 30mil in payroll to sit around like a holes.

by kendynamo on May 27, 2008 4:37 PM EDT reply actions  

Willie

I don’t want to see him go! I like him and it’s not his fault they’re not winning…at least not totally. He’s taken them to the show before….I think we need to let him manage without worrying about his job!

dfsmetsfan

by dfsmetsfan on May 27, 2008 5:54 PM EDT reply actions  

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