Mets Sign Freddy Garcia
Apparently Garcia could be paid as much 9 million if all incentives are met.
Eric's Take:
The interesting question here is whether the Mets expect Garcia to make the team out of spring training. If we assume good health, the rotation looks like this:
Johan Santana
Mike Pelfrey
John Maine
Tim Redding
If Garcia makes the club then they're already at a five-man staff. I don't know that this precludes them from signing a more establish arm (Ben Sheets anyone?), and if not then does Redding or Garcia go to the bullpen?
about 3 years ago
Gina
103 comments
0 recs |
Email
PrintComments
I'm okay with this
as a minor league deal. Probably not a bad move on those terms.
'Oh yes, I know all about that duty-of-a-citizen stuff. It doesn't go. There are exceptions to every rule, and this was one of them. When a man risks his liberty to come and root at a ball-game, you've got to hand it to him. He isn't a crook. He's a fan.'
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 22, 2009 8:48 PM EST reply actions
Provided, of course
that we’re not finished with the rotation.
'Oh yes, I know all about that duty-of-a-citizen stuff. It doesn't go. There are exceptions to every rule, and this was one of them. When a man risks his liberty to come and root at a ball-game, you've got to hand it to him. He isn't a crook. He's a fan.'
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 22, 2009 8:56 PM EST up reply actions
You know what would be scary?
If Omar sees the rotation as:
Santana-Pelfrey-Maine-Redding-Garcia with Niese as the backup plan. I don’t think this is true, but who knows.
by James Kannengieser on Jan 22, 2009 10:05 PM EST reply actions
Good lord, let's hope he doesn't
It’d be indefensible.
not me.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 22, 2009 10:48 PM EST up reply actions
the Metsblog crowd?
Don’t they think we should be signing Manny, Perez, and Sheets?
Some of them do
But a good portion of them also think Omar is a genius/everything the mets do is gold, and we can do no wrong.
Oh well
Guess I’m glad I never read the comments over there. Do they like the patch, too?
*ZINGER!*
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 23, 2009 12:54 AM EST up reply actions
And the other portion
thinks Omar is an idiot with a Latin bias who works for a cheap owner. So pick your poison.
low risk, decent upside
sounds like a good deal if we sign another pitcher (sheets, please) and garcia competes for the fifth spot. otherwise, we’d have redding and garcia as our four/five starters, which would kinda suck.
well, that would mean santana only pitches every sixth day
plus with the eventual injuries, a six-man rotation is bound to end up a five-man rotation at some point in the season
by englishgrey on Jan 22, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions
We need more.
This just does not qualify as a solid rotation. Sign Sheets or Perez in that order and get to work on another bat. We’re far from done.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 22, 2009 10:50 PM EST reply actions
Lot of
Hudson hate in AA land Major, but your idea is plausible to me.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 22, 2009 11:28 PM EST up reply actions
Where are said haters?
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
They are below your honor! ;-)
robcast23 – i agree that hudson has gotten overrated and overpriced / Jan 11, 2009.
BobbyV (Sorry BV) – Hudson – Have you seen his defensive numbers lately? Three consecutive season with a negative UZR, bottoming out this year at -6.1. Also, he seems to be losing range / Jan 9, 2009
Gina – we’d be better off with Castillo at 2nd and someone else in lf than Jones at lf and Hudson at 2nd / Dec 29, 2008
Black Ops – And we should stay away from Orlando Hudson. We don’t need to be paying our second baseman in the area of 50+ million for pretty average play when we have a young player for free to do the job / Dec 6, 2008
Endys Game – Hudson is overrated and not worth the money he is seeking / Nov 23, 2008
Need I go on?
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 23, 2009 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
nice work, Uncle Lou.
Good researchin’.
We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!
by kingcritical on Jan 23, 2009 1:03 AM EST up reply actions
Thanks
But I have this feeling that these five lovely people are going to put me on a blacklist for future Christmas parties.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 23, 2009 1:15 AM EST up reply actions
no way
I’m sure they would stand right by their original assessments. Or at least they would be able to explain why they changed their minds.
We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!
by kingcritical on Jan 23, 2009 1:19 AM EST up reply actions
I am honored to be cited
and I stand by my comments.
I am also honored to be quoted.
Nice research, Lou. That must’ve taken a considerable amount of thread searching.
by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 23, 2009 6:14 PM EST up reply actions
I think you're confusing haters with detractors
I just don’t see how the benefits outweigh the costs/risks with Hudson. Especially considering I see no way we could trade Castillo without either taking on a much worse contract or paying the majority of his contract.
Perhaps
Haters was the wrong word.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 23, 2009 12:51 AM EST up reply actions
The benefits?
Hudson is a better player. What Hudson lacks in stats he makes up in clubhouse leadership which the mets need
If Castillo doesn’t start out well his demeanor could ruin the clubhouse. He was benched for his continuous pouting and bickering by Manuel, who favored A.Reyes over Castillo. If that doesn’t tell you Castillo could be a huge issue then I don’t know what does.
The benefits of getting rid of a potential cancer in the clubhouse and replacing that energy with a slick-fielding, solid player who is a good guy, far out weighs the financial losses the mets will endure.
Clearly the mets think they need stability at 2b by signing Cora and resigning A.Reyes, Hudson would be at the very least a 3yr solution while all other candidates are day-to-day at best.
The mets need to solve problems not placate them. Castillo is our Marbury in contract and personality.
I'm all for dumping Castillo
But what is the basis for Hudson being a “clubhouse leader”? And is this supposed leadership worth the type of money and years Hudson would want?
It would seem to me that with Cora and A. Reyes already signed, if the Mets were to dump Castillo, the money would be better spent on a left fielder who can make up for the offensive deficiencies at 2B.
Well 1st you don't know much about Hudson.
He is highly regarded in the Dback clubhouse. Just read up on him before you doubt him.
Cora is not the solution and neither is A. Reyes for any length of time.
I'm not sure
Hudson is a slick fielder anymore, defensive metrics are pretty split on him and his offense is pretty meh, and that’s been in a hitters park. So I definitely wouldn’t call him anything close to a 3 year solution, in fact I think he has a decent chance of turning into Castillo part 2.
how about one year with an option?
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
One year with an option would be fine
If we found a way to dump Castillo’s contract without taking on an even worse contract, for example trading Castillo for like Jose Guillen just so we could pay Hudosn 7 million per would be a terrible idea IMO.
WOW Hudson=Castillo part 2?
Gina, you make very well thought out arguments on this blog but that statement is crazy.
Let this fact weigh on you. The Yankees gave Cano a rich deal too soon, now they have actively tried to trade him so they could sign “Castillo 2.”
How funny would it be if Cashman trades cano and signs Hudson and Manny? Then we could watch Hudson play instead of crunching stats on him. Hudson is a ballplayer but if you’d rather Castillo hey!
"Hudson is a ballplayer"
So is everyone on a major league roster. I’m a ballplayer on my company’s baseball team. I’m assuming you mean like “gamer” or whatever but that’s besides the point.
Obviously no one would rather have Castillo over Hudson, but this isn’t like comparing Castillo to Chase Utley or Dustin Pedroia. Hudson is not young anymore and his much heralded defense looks to be overrated, statistically. Plus he has benefited greatly from hitting at Chase Field and has injury risks. No reason to give him like $9-10 million.
by James Kannengieser on Jan 23, 2009 10:37 AM EST up reply actions
Hudson is a ballplayer
Castillo is actually a curler, can’t believe the Mets didn’t realize that when they signed him. From now on, the Mets should sign only baseball players to play on their baseball team, the New York baseball Metropolitans.
I disagree
I think they should sign professional wrestlers and then try to play full-contact baseball instead of the pansy variety they play now
we have a full contact guy already in right field
he’s just unclear on the concept and keeps running his head into their other body parts
I.M. Forme
"When you get yourself into trouble is when you feel you have to do something, and then you get yourself in trouble." --Omar Minaya
by itsmetsforme on Jan 23, 2009 3:56 PM EST up reply actions
Where did you get 9-10mil?
BTW the 31 year old Hudson(grandpa he’s SOOO old), Had a .450 slugging pct, 29 dbls a .305 avg with a .367 obp in 107 games.
Castillo played in 87 games and I won’t post his stats because I care about the health and well being of those ready this post. But when you have the time, compare both players and tell me who is better.
No where have I read that Hudson wants 10mil per. And if you don’t know what I mean when I say “ballplayer(yes a cliche kill me)” then this is for you. Carlos Beltran is a ballplayer, Ryan Thompson is not.
Yikes
Are you trying to say that the reason Carlos Beltran is really really good and Ryan Thompson was not so good is because Beltran is more of a “ballplayer”? Because that’s a joke. Beltran has more natural ability stored away in his left pinky toe than most players could even dream of having.
Next comparison: Willie Mays versus Wily Mo Pena. One’s a ballplayer and one isn’t!
You're completely missing the mark.
Ballplayer=talented/skilled player. I guess you don’t know typical sports cliche’s because the talent in Beltran’s “pinky toe” is exactly what would make him a ballplayer. “Yikes” is accurate.
So basically
you just stated the most obvious point of all time. Good players are “ballplayers” and bad players aren’t. Perhaps you could enlighten me as to the purpose of that particular cliche, because I don’t see one.
His home/away splits are pretty ugly
I don’t put huge stock in that, because players are usually worse on the road, but considering Chase is a hitters park and considering the HUGE split it’s definitely not something to look at lightly. .337 obp and a .381 slugging. And his obp is somewhat avg heavy, not incredibly though, so the fact he’s coming off consecutive injuries on the same wrist would be a major worry, especially since his contact rates fell a bit from 07 to last year.
Basically to me there’s just a whole lot of red flags that say he’s declining, and it’s been somewhat covered because of the park he’s playing in, and his numbers could have a rapid drop off.
I can't see him declining at 31.
He easily could though and so could Manny Ramirez who is 37. If the ballpark skews the numbers then what do you think of Brian Roberts numbers playing in Camden Yards?
I don’t care who plays 2b as long as its not Castillo or Cora or A. Reyes.
The 7-9 slots in our order a black hole. A player like Hudson or Roberts could hit 2nd.
IMO, none of the concerns for Hudson make me cringe more than
7. Castillo
8. Schneider
9. Pitcher
Dude
He already is declining. That’s the point.
Yes, that's true
He’s better than Castillo, but at what cost? If the Mets have to take on a significant obligation elsewhere (see: Guillen) to dump Castillo, and there’s nothing to indicate otherwise – it’s quite clearly not worth it just to grab Hudson.
Not in this case
Because Omar can make the team better by signing, say Dunn or Sheets. This, as opposed to jumping through hoops to get rid of Castillo (and be forced to take on someone else’s headache) and then overpaying for Hudson, is easier and better.
Why would he overpay for Hudson?
Where is Hudson’s market? Other than the Yankees trading Cano(which they want to do) to sign him he has no takers.
Sure the Pitching will be better but when the mets are losing a 2-1 game in the seventh inning and 7-9 is up, the team will need a hit. So Jerry Manuel will have to jump through hoops with his bench to get a clutch hit.
You’re right better pitching is what they want but that doesn’t translate to the lineup. BTW after the signing of Sheets or Perez many insiders say the Mets are done after that. If that is true, I don’t know how much better the Mets are.
I don't think the Mets should rest on their laurels
but the Putz and K-Rod acquisitions alone, plus the fact that, even assuming a decline in their individual productivities, Murphy and Tatis will play LF the whole year — instead of a Pagan, Evans, Endy mishmosh — mean the Mets have improved considerably.
also
keep in mind that this is a team that scored 799 runs last year, with crap at the corner OFs and 2B for most of the year. While I think they should be pursuing a better corner OF option, let’s be mindful of the fact that this was a fairly potent offense.
Delgado won't hit like he did last season.
Plus the Mets were one of the worst teams in the league scoring runs in the 7th-9th innings.
I'm not sure Delgado will hit like he did last season either
But replacing Hudson with Castillo isn’t going to make up the difference in having a true clean up hitter and not having one.
That strikes me as random variation
rather than some “the Mets are not clutch and can not hit late in the game” crap, and that’s what I will continue to believe unless someone proves otherwise.
Also
for all intents and purposes, a run is a run is a run, no matter when it is scored. You just have to score more of them than the other guys.
Not true, jason
Runs scored in the late innings count double. Sorta like how wins in September get triple bonus points.
'Oh yes, I know all about that duty-of-a-citizen stuff. It doesn't go. There are exceptions to every rule, and this was one of them. When a man risks his liberty to come and root at a ball-game, you've got to hand it to him. He isn't a crook. He's a fan.'
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 23, 2009 2:54 PM EST up reply actions
to be fair
a few extra late innings runs might have taken some of the pressure off the bullpen. I think with a decent bullpen, a run is a run is a run, no matter when it’s scored, but with our bullpen, late runs would have been nice.
True
But, a run is a run. I’d take my chances with a team that could score 10 runs a game even if they couldn’t score after the 6th inning.
'Oh yes, I know all about that duty-of-a-citizen stuff. It doesn't go. There are exceptions to every rule, and this was one of them. When a man risks his liberty to come and root at a ball-game, you've got to hand it to him. He isn't a crook. He's a fan.'
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 24, 2009 11:13 AM EST up reply actions
People couldn't see Roberto Alomar declining at 33, either.
Just because he’s the ‘best’ available 2B doesn’t mean we should go for him. As others have stated several times already, we’d have trade Castillo to make room for Hudson. That’d mean either taking someone else’s crap contract, or eating most of the money. And just because the Yankees are trying to trade their second baseman to make room for Hudson doesn’t mean we should, too. The Yankees also overpaid for a first baseman and an oft-injured pitcher, too. Should we do those things, too? Frankly, I couldn’t care less what the Yankees are doing, and nobody else here should care, either.
If we’re not going to get better production out of our second basemen, we might as well shore up production elsewhere, either by signing a LF, or a good #2/3 starter.
by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 23, 2009 6:31 PM EST up reply actions
I'm probably wrong about the 9-10 million
I don’t hate Hudson, believe me I’d want him on the Mets. And J.C. I know he’s better than Castillo, but there is more at play than just “OMG Castillo sucks let’s get Hudson”. Mets payroll is about $127 million with the Garcia signing give or take a few mil. This leaves probably $20 million for them to spend, maximum. I’d rather use the $$ to get a starting pitcher (which is inevitable) and a corner OF bat.
Let’s play a game – ballplayer or not a ballplayer? Here is the list:
1 – Alex Rodriguez
2 – Stephon Marbury
3 – Tim Teufel
4 – a ham sandwich
5 – Joe Orsulak
5 -
by James Kannengieser on Jan 23, 2009 11:38 AM EST up reply actions
Its not getting Hudson. It is getting rid of Castillo.
Hudson just happens to be available and if not for Castillo’s contract, he probably would be a Met by now. The bottom of the lineup will not change if we get another hitter. 7-9 will still be what it was last year.
As for your list. I loved Tim Tuefel so ballplayer
ham sandwich(in comparison to castillo) ballplayer
AROD reg season ballplayer
Marbury high school ballplayer
Easy
A-Rod = not a ballplayer, only hits homers in blowouts, will never be a True Yankee like Jeter
Marbury = tattoo on head indicates potential ballplayer status
Teufel = ballplayer. why? no idea. his name just sort of sounds like he’d be one and i remember him having lots of grit and stuff.
ham sandwich = depends. what kind of ham?
Orsulak = ballplayer. see Tim Teufel.
I'm a big Tim Teufel fan for whatever reason
I think it’s his name mostly. I sponsor his Baseball Ref page, I think it cost $10.
by James Kannengieser on Jan 23, 2009 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
The ham sandwich might be a ballplayer
it depends on factors such as bread, mustard, cheese, veg and curing. The bacon metric is also relevant to the ham sandwich’s “ballplayer” status.
No one else on the list is a ballplayer.
'Oh yes, I know all about that duty-of-a-citizen stuff. It doesn't go. There are exceptions to every rule, and this was one of them. When a man risks his liberty to come and root at a ball-game, you've got to hand it to him. He isn't a crook. He's a fan.'
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 23, 2009 12:09 PM EST up reply actions
According to metsblog
The mets either only have 10 million left to spend, though I agree with your math and I don’ see any way it could be true, or they only plan on spending ten million more.
Please sign Sheets or Perez
I wanted to see Lowe here cause I was sick of the whole pre-game Perez prayer that he wouldn’t collapse early…but god give me Perez so at least we have some holdover stability. What’s the point of K-Rod and Putz if we have 1 less quality starter. It offsets in my eyes.
The 2008 NY Mets: Pedro hurt already. Delgado still sucks. Mets still can't beat the Braves. Beltran only plays 6 innings. WTF with Pelfrey?? Mets win 60 in a row. Freakin' Wagner. PLAYOFFS, NO WAY?!
Anyone else wish the Mets could un-sign Cory Sullivan
and put the proceeds towards the “Ben Sheets Fund”?
by James Kannengieser on Jan 23, 2009 12:28 AM EST up reply actions
That sounds
like an amazing idea.
"But it's not over yet, everybody thinks it over, but if we can just get the Earth to reverse rotation...this thing can be played again. So there you go, New York Mets......motherf*ckers." - Jon Stewart
If we had that madden card
we’d use it on a certain Luis Castillo, of course.
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
Nice signing.
Fairly low risk, good upside. And it tightens the screws on Perez a little. This stuck out at me:
The Mets have a sense that the victory total Perez is likely to amass isn’t significantly greater than what Sheets or Wolf might produce. And neither would be so expensive.
Thank god, Omar may have a sense of Ollie’s true value after all. And if his price doesn’t drop enough, he may even be willing to look elsewhere.
by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 22, 2009 11:39 PM EST reply actions
"victory total"
Yea there’s true value for you. I guess I’ll take it.
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
I'm choosing to be charitable
and pretending that “victory total” really means WAR. Heh.
You think the Mets were also seduced by the “Redding won 10 games for the Nats, he must be good” meme?
To be fair, winning 10 games for the Nats is equivalent to winning like 15 on the Mets.
But still.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
And winning "x" number of games means what, exactly?
I must admit I have no idea if you’re being facetious.
ditto
the staff is still short one starter but nice add to the fifth starter/AAA depth mix. meantime, we’re what, three weeks from pitchers and catchers? the dominoes should start falling soon, one would think…
I like it.
Hopefully they sign Sheets/Ollie, Garcia makes the team out of Spring Training, and Redding goes to the BP. This gives the team some nice depth and more flexibility in the rotation.
hey who thought freddy's brother was awesome in this movie?
i am godzilla you are tokyo
HELLO HELLO MR WILPON. WE WANT THE MANSION NOT THE CONDO.
"It was just a little piece." - Treat Williams
Thank God! Someone who has seen this movie. It is perhaps the one movie too many people have not seen.
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 24, 2009 12:24 AM EST up reply actions
Come to think of it, your quote should be:
“I AM GODZILLA AND YOU ARE JAPAN!”
" PLEASE! CHANGE THE PATCH! "
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Jan 24, 2009 8:13 AM EST up reply actions
I used to be in favour of Hudson(When I thought he was 29 and could be had for cheap for The Mets)safe to say I am not in favour anymore.
But Garcia signing means Redding is our No4 right?
Thats bad…very bad and it could rise to 9 mil…jeez why not just sign Sheets or/and Perez
Gimme Ty Wigginton in Left Field or Give Me Death!
Seriously, why is Omar not looking at a low cost hard nose player like Wiggie for LF? Manny seems out of the picture and most other hitters appear to be left-handers.
Pitching is a concern but even if we sign Perez or Sheets the Braves, Nats and Phillies all seem to have improved their pitching and offense. We have secured ourselves a good bullpen but our offense will not be as good as last seasons. So get me someone who hits right-handed, plays hard and is liked in the clubhouse.
by scott from peekskill on Jan 25, 2009 12:19 PM EST reply actions
I would have liked Wigginton as a bench/super utility player
But I’m not sure he’d be a better choice as a starting left fielder than our current options. His offensive numbers last year were pretty far above his career norms, and his home away split was insane.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Certain photos copyright © 2012 by Associated Press or Getty Images. Any commercial use or distribution without the express written consent of Associated Press and Getty Images is strictly prohibited.
