Agreed Marty Noble, Signing Mike Cameron Is A Good Idea

by James Kannengieser on Oct 24, 2009 5:30 PM EDT in Analysis Comment 41 comments

In his most recent mailbag, Marty Noble suggested the Mets sign free agent outfielder Mike Cameron. This a smart proposal for a variety of reasons. Cameron has long been one of the most underrated players in baseball (his career worth is on par with some low-level Hall of Famers) and even at 36 years old he is still a well above average performer.

At the plate, Cameron is most known for his power and strikeouts. He can be counted on for 20-25 homers, a .200 Iso and 150 strikeouts a year. He can also draw a walk and a .340 wOBA seems like a fair projection for 2010. Considering he is one of the best defensive outfielders in the game, Cameron's bat is more than adequate. Based on UZR and +/-, it appears he's about a +5 defensive center fielder. Fangraphs WAR had him as a 4 win player in 2008 and 4.3 in 2009. Being conservative let's say he's a 3-3.5 win player going forward. He made $10 million in 2009, but given his age and the free agent market, a 1 year deal at about $8 million might be sufficient. This would, in all likelihood, be a steal of a contract. One other positive - he is almost universally praised for his clubhouse presence.

Cameron vs. Carlos Beltran defensively is a toss-up but I'd probably give the slight edge to Cameron right now. Given Beltran's injury concerns, it would be best to move him to left field if Cameron signed. An outfield of Cameron-Beltran-Pagan would bring a smile to the faces of Met pitchers, as all 3 are adequate center fielders. This alignment resembles the Franklin Gutierrez-Endy Chavez-Ichiro triumvirate employed by the Mariners earlier this season. It would be prudent to find strong defensive outfielders to take advantage of Citi Field's dimensions.

Matt Holliday would be a welcome sight in Flushing next season but recent talk of his potential contract is a bit troubling. A cheaper, short-term outfield solution might be a better move, and would allow for improvements in the rotation and 1st base. Cameron returning to the Mets seems unlikely, but hopefully the memory of his last game as a Met in 2005 wouldn't stop him from signing.

via sportsillustrated.cnn.com

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I could live with this...

but I don’t see it happening.

by fxcarden on Oct 24, 2009 6:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

I'm sure it's just me

but doesn’t it look like Cameron is kissing Beltran in that picture?

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Oct 24, 2009 7:00 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

It's not just you.

I thought the same.

by fxcarden on Oct 24, 2009 7:09 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

ya me too

by metsbaseball93 on Oct 24, 2009 7:33 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Maybe....

But Francouer is going to be back (platoon with Murphy at first?), and with Jerry back Francouer is going to start in place of Pagan. Heck with Jerry back, Jeremy Reed might start ahead of Cameron. Getting talent is obviously necessary, but unless or until the management issue is addressed, expect about 70% utilization of it.

by Cranky50 on Oct 24, 2009 7:57 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Manuel is not that stupid

Cameron and Beltran would easily be our top two OFers. Francoeur/Pagan/fifth outfielder would compete for RF.

by englishgrey on Oct 24, 2009 8:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

the heck?

A proposed switch of Francoeur to platoon at first? ?

ain't had enough...

by BlackOps on Oct 24, 2009 8:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Cameron

I’ve always been skeptical of Cameron because all I remember from his Met tenure was that he tended to strike out whenever the team needed a big hit. Of course, as James points out, Cameron’s stats tell us that he is a valuable and probably undervalued talent. If the Mets could sign him to a one-year deal, then I think it would be a great acquisition.

by englishgrey on Oct 24, 2009 8:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

cameron

been there/ done that. Maybe a cheaper option would be nyjer morgan, nady or byrd and spend the big bucks on pitching

by bob c on Oct 24, 2009 8:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

No

The Nationals are not going to randomly trade Nyjer Morgan (one of…three actual good players they have on the team) without getting players who are worth more than Morgan, collectively- especially to a league “rival”- Nady is almost as overrated as Bret Myers (He was an “Ace”? Yeah, in what world?), and Marlon Byrd is coming off of, arguably, what is a career year for him, monetary worth inflated, as well as our senses of what to actually expect if/when he gets here.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Oct 24, 2009 9:40 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

hey Bret Myers led the Phillies in Battery average

by KeithsMoustache on Oct 24, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Touche

But, I never got how, in the past, Philly fans considered Myers an elite, “ace”-type pitcher. He had an ERA under 3 TWICE in his career, and with both of those years, his ERA was in the high 3.00s (3.71 in 2005 and 3.91 in 2006). Calling him an “ace” is like calling Jeremy Gutherie an “ace”. But, I digress…

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Oct 24, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

"He was an 'Ace'? Yeah, in what world?"

In Jayson Stark’s masturbation material world.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Oct 24, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

oh God my eyes: the images

"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"

by firejerrynow on Oct 25, 2009 6:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

it burns it burns!!!!

by KeithsMoustache on Oct 25, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

The goggles, they do nothing!

"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez

by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Oct 25, 2009 1:47 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs

quick, get the eyebleach!

by KeithsMoustache on Oct 25, 2009 11:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Forget the eyebleach!

Stick my head in a fucking vice and squeeze hard enough to make my eyes pop!

Beer is good! And stuff!

by R_Adragna on Oct 26, 2009 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I really don't think Cameron would be that good of an idea

He’s getting old. He’s turning 37, is an injury risk (he has only played 150+ games only once in the past seven years). But, at the same time, he has the ability to provide around 15-30 home runs, around 50-75 RBI, and good speed and defense. And, he’ll come fairly cheap. I’m not sold, though. I don’t think, as mentioned, he’d want to come back to the Mets, especially with Beltran in Center, still. Not that I think he begrudges anyone, but…

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Oct 24, 2009 9:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Hey, Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan

I see you are quite new, so I’ll tell you now that we don’t use RBI’s very much here. And by very much, I mean never. Just a friendly, umm, is reminder the right word?

"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"

by firejerrynow on Oct 25, 2009 6:53 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

There are plenty of valid arguments against signing Cameron

but cherrypicking the 150+ games thing is a little silly. Here are his games played going backwards from 2009: 149, 120 (missed 25 games for stimulant usage suspension), 151, 141, 76 (collision year), 140, 147, 158, 150.. etc. He’s old but he’s not Moises Alou.

by James Kannengieser on Oct 25, 2009 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Please

take that collision pic down. Ouch. Sign Cameron

by TDJ on Oct 24, 2009 9:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Cameron, if not Francoeur...

If the starting OF is Cameron, Beltran, and Francoeur, given the Mets have said they won’t be players in the Lackey sweepstakes because of injury concerns, I think we’re looking at a win total in 2010 in the mid-80s. I’d be delighted w Cameron on a one- or two-year deal if we also picked up Holliday. That we have to accept Francoeur, at around 5 million, as a given in RF (particularly when Cameron, a better player who can handle CF, and whose downside is vastly higher than Jeff eff’s, would get only around 8 million) and will consider ourselves lucky if we’re stuck with him only for a year, is ludicrous.

Since we’ve barely touched on the subject, a 3 year deal for Francoeur is exactly like the 4 year deal for Castillo. If you’re very, very lucky he’ll be worth the contract. But most of the time he won’t, and the downside is frigging horrible.

Given Francoeur in RF, signing Cameron means we didn’t get Holliday OR Bay. That’s unacceptable, ladies and gentleman.

by SeanSchirmer on Oct 24, 2009 10:44 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

Harangatang 2010

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Oct 24, 2009 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Word

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Oct 25, 2009 1:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

I think Cameron in Left would benefit us more than Bay

seeing that Bay plays defense as well as I do.

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Oct 25, 2009 1:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

yeah. Cameron > Bay

ain't had enough...

by BlackOps on Oct 25, 2009 3:34 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

But Holliday trumps all.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Oct 25, 2009 10:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Rant, part 2

The cheaper, shorter contract we can live with is Bay, not Cameron.

And Holliday is not Teixiera. Why are people not discounting for Coors? Holliday was very good but hardly a superstar away from Coors, the park factor there was 110 and higher when Holliday was there, and his terrific hitting in St. Louis occurred in all of 270 PAs.

by SeanSchirmer on Oct 24, 2009 10:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

And Tex played in Arlington and New Coors

I stand by my Holliday>Teixeira statement in another thread.

Oh and over their careers, Holliday is a better left fielder, (6.2 UZR/150) than Tex is a first baseman (1.7 UZR/150). I’d love to see their respective +/- totals.

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Oct 25, 2009 2:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

Cameron would be nice, but I seem to remember him not being too happy the Mets moved him out of center.

I do like the idea of him on a one year deal, I just see him signing with a team that will play him in center.

"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green

by Schmidtxc on Oct 24, 2009 10:50 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

This

I love Mike Cameron, but someone is going to have to to convince either he or Carlos Beltran to play a corner outfield spot, and then convince everyone involved that doing so would be a good idea. Their collision a few years ago was a fluke, and is hardly irrefutable evidence that “you can’t have two centerfielders in one outfield”, but I would expect Cameron to nevertheless be reluctant to play a corner again, especially if some other team can offer him a spot in center.

by Eric Simon on Oct 25, 2009 2:27 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs