Maine for Hart? I'll Pass.

Hart had a great 2007 where he was worth 4.4 WAR. Since then he's had two seasons where he's been worth 0.9 and 0.7. I think Omar's best trading partner should be Kansas City, they gave actual matter for Yuniesky Betancourt. So maybe, just maybe, we could swing Maine and Francoeur (and probably a prospect) for Meche and DeJesus.

about 2 years ago Evan_S 33 comments 0 recs |

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If it were Bret The Hitman Hart

I would think about it

by deadspy3 on Dec 8, 2009 8:52 AM EST reply actions 1 recs

Replacing Maine with a more efficient pitcher wouldn't be a bad thing.

I’d take a flier on Corey Hart for him.

"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green

by Stephen Schmidt on Dec 8, 2009 11:14 AM EST reply actions

Yeah I'd definitely consider this

Hart may have been mediocre the last couple years, but at worst he’s a positional version of Maine in that way, and he does have the kind of skills that make him tempting as a buy low candidate. Defense, speed, some pop.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Dec 8, 2009 11:51 AM EST up reply actions

plus

hart wears his sunglasses at night.

but seriously, i dont make this move. i agree that hart is interesting, in fact i advocated a bobby parnell/corey hart trade in a post here a couple months back but the issue would be maine’s replacement. anyone we brought in who can pitch at maine’s level of effectiveness will certainly not cost the $3-4M that maine will. i know that said pitcher will probably be MUCH more of a sure thing than maine but i’m willing to take that risk rather than swallow the extra $6-8M (two to three years over) that a marquis/pineiro/wolf replacement would probably cost.

by Rob Castellano on Dec 8, 2009 1:06 PM EST up reply actions

Yeah, I'd probably come to the same conclusion

Its a deal that might be more tempting in a month or two, if the Mets are able to somehow find SP and not upgrade their outfield at all, but that doesn’t seem like the most likely outcome.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Dec 8, 2009 2:18 PM EST up reply actions

Who is available, at a similar price, to replace Maine?

by boom_roasted on Dec 8, 2009 12:34 PM EST up reply actions

Hart could definitely be a 4th OF on a good team

But he’s not as good as Angel Pagan so why give up Maine?

by TheBigStapler on Dec 8, 2009 11:30 AM EST reply actions

completely agree

i’d place hart in the same box as pagan except pagan is a better all-around player so why lose maine?

in addition, hart has had only 1 good season in ’07 and in that season there were numerous signs of unsustainable good luck (.330 BABIP, a truly terrible .36 BB/K ratio and an elevated 13% HR/FB rate)

by Rob Castellano on Dec 8, 2009 1:11 PM EST up reply actions

haha

you said Hart is not as good as Pagan, LOL that’s great.

by SAL R on Dec 8, 2009 4:02 PM EST up reply actions

Haha

you said something stupid that is totally disproven with stats. LOL, that’s great.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Dec 8, 2009 5:10 PM EST up reply actions

Pagan was better than Hart last year

But I’d put them in the same range. Pagan’s the better athlete, but at least Hart’s shown some glimpses of skills that could be sustainable. There’s really nothing in Pagan’s history to suggest he’s as good as he was in 2009, and the thing that really carried him was his BABIP and contact rate. His defense is good, probably better than Hart’s, so he has that going for him, but its not a monster difference, and Hart clearly has more power, and I’d probably pick him as the better offensive bet moving forward. He’s had three seasons with an hWAR over 2.0. Pagan’s only had one, and it took a career best .342 BABIP and 10.2% Swing-and-miss%. And since so much of Pagan’s value is derived from his ability to make contact, a BABIP regression hurts him quite a bit. The defensive difference makes them pretty close, IMO.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Dec 8, 2009 5:58 PM EST up reply actions

that's not what I'm responding to.

He said unequivocally that Pagan<Hart. Which IS disproven by stats.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Dec 8, 2009 6:05 PM EST up reply actions

Hah, fair enough

Wasn’t really disagreeing, just felt like digressing a little

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Dec 8, 2009 6:22 PM EST up reply actions

not sure Hart is the best outlet for Maine

especially when we’ve shown very few signs of life in the FA market this offseason so far. Hart has some potential value, sure, but unless we can sign a few pitchers this offseason I can’t see giving up what little depth we have for a flier on a guy who’s consistently declined the last few years. I’m not averse to trading maine in the right deal, i just don’t feel this is that deal.

by KeithsMoustache on Dec 8, 2009 12:10 PM EST reply actions

Cub fan here, with rooting interest on both sides

Brewers being an NL Central rival and geographically close to where I live, and the Mets being my Strat-O-Matic team . . . .

I think this would be a horrible trade for the Mets. Hart only had one really good year and the Brewers have been looking to unload him. Maine has had health issues, but I think that he could be a solid mid to front (not 1) rotation pitcher. Plus, there’s not a whole hell of a lot after Johan Santana.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Dec 8, 2009 12:25 PM EST reply actions

The Brewers have been looking to unload him?

by ol Pete on Dec 8, 2009 1:40 PM EST up reply actions

This offeason, yes.

I’d think that that news would have found it’s way to you.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Dec 8, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions

You sure know a lot of things that aren't true

by ol Pete on Dec 8, 2009 1:57 PM EST up reply actions

You sure are boring and predictable

But at least you’re showing some creativity by starting your little pissing contest here instead of BCB, where you usually do it.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Dec 8, 2009 2:13 PM EST up reply actions

he's been here before

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Dec 8, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions

He'll pop up at Bleed Cubbie Blue once in a while

Sometimes he contributes, but usually he just looks to stir the pot. When someone refutes what he says with evidence he disappears for a while.

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Dec 9, 2009 10:30 AM EST up reply actions

Refutes?

You mean when the goofball posts long tracts of text about college baseball umpiring and proclaims it as proof that umpires are required to walk backwards in the face of a Milton Bradley psychotic event? I don’t think pointing out that there is nothing in the text to support that and then iterating it and reiterating it is “disappearing.”

After questioning the advanced thinking of you and the council of geniuses that proclaim things like Alfonso Soriano is the best defensive left fielder, and getting the usual pouting and name calling, why should I care enough to repeat facts more than a few times.

What you monumentally lack is evidence. Declaring its existence seems to be the limit of your arguments.

by ol Pete on Dec 9, 2009 10:52 AM EST up reply actions

What should I say when you make things up?

Your personal attacks are predictable.

by ol Pete on Dec 9, 2009 10:46 AM EST up reply actions

I don't know whats going on

but i loled

by Gina on Dec 8, 2009 3:04 PM EST reply actions

I think a Cubs-Brewers fan fight just broke out

awesome.

"[The Giants] beat us down. We were beat by a grown-man team, a team we want to be like one day. They came in here and took it to us. Out-manned us, out-gunned us. ... It wasn't even close." - Raheem Morris, 9/27/09

by cjmulrain on Dec 8, 2009 5:07 PM EST up reply actions

IF

anyone actually thinks Maine is better than Hart and would’nt trade straight up, Your not a baseball fan and have no idea what you are talking about.

by SAL R on Dec 8, 2009 4:01 PM EST reply actions

Are you the pot? Or the kettle?

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 8, 2009 4:10 PM EST up reply actions

Ah, the whole "if you disagree with me you're a bad person" argument.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Dec 8, 2009 5:12 PM EST up reply actions

I wonder what the flame to non-flame rate is for the responses to these comments

I wonder if figuring them out would be false blog-hustle.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Dec 8, 2009 6:00 PM EST up reply actions

your

lucky if Maine gives you 5 solid innings, he’s a bullpen’s worst nightmare.

by SAL R on Dec 8, 2009 9:45 PM EST up reply actions

Thanks for setting me straight!

I'm singing, "GO CUBS GO! GO CUBS GO!" -- DrCrawdad on Jun 12, 2009 7:23 AM CDT

Facts are meaningless. You could use facts to prove anything that's even remotely true! -- Homer J. Simpson

by Shanghai Badger on Dec 9, 2009 10:30 AM EST up reply actions

Maine For Arroyo straight up

Cinncy would probably do this just to clear the $$$$

by scott from peekskill on Dec 8, 2009 10:11 PM EST reply actions

Arroyo is signed for 12.5m in 2010

if you’re assuming you don’t pick up his 2011 option. Any GM who gives up a real player for Arroyo is making a big mistake. The Reds want to clear payroll. They’ll essentially give him away.

by SeanSchirmer on Dec 8, 2009 10:19 PM EST up reply actions