Why MetsBlog Sucks
I found Amazin' Avenue a few months ago from a link from Metsblog.com. I would always be amazed at how "off" the information contained therein was (like the attached link saying that Jenrry Mejia is 'playing' in the Futures Game) and how the opinions reflected those of a 12 year old without basic logic from both the writers and site patrons.
I've read a few things lately that said that the discourse on MetsBlog was a bit more "inviting" during some of the more heated discussions (Church-Francine as an e.g.). I would attribute that to the fact that you cannot recieve the level of discourse (nor the level of correct information) there that would here.
It still amazes me how SNY could be affiliated with this product that truthfully is no better than any one of us could put out.
Anyone who could dutifully put this on a website, simply does not deserve to have one:
...love the deal…the Mets needed to shake up the roster… the potential francoeur has is much greater than that of church, plus the Mets lose nothing on the defensive side…
…welcome aboard, frenchy…
Ugh...
Thank god for Amazin' Avenue!
over 2 years ago
AnthonyR
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Third Grade Playground Mentality
This is my first ever post on this site. I just wanted to throw my two cents out there, and this is just my opinion and everyone is certainly entitled to their own. The metsblog bashing on this site comes off as childish. If you do not like the site, do not go to it, no one is making you. So the guy thought the trade was a good one, so what? I disagree with him wholeheartedly, but there is a chance he could end up being right [I for one, would not bet on it]. The reaction to the trade around here has been hysterical, both in terms of comedy and overreaction. Neither Church nor Failtoseeballfoeur are going to play into the long term plans of this team. I really do like this website. I think the analysis and the perspective on the game and the organization as a whole are both interesting and enlightening. However, i think metsblog does a good job of everyday, up to the minute news about the team. The childish shots at that website are so bizarre to me and other friends of mine that read this site. Who cares? It comes off as third graders making fun of other kids on the playground. Just to clarify, I hate the trade, not because of the trade itself but what it reveals about the decision making and philosophy of the front office. I do not think this trade will rank up there with the Kazmir, Seaver, or even Mora trades. I do not even know why I really chose this time for a first post. Perhaps I fear that this site is starting to get dragged down a bit and become like political posturing as opposed to real discussion of issues surrounding the Mets, God knows there are enough.
MetsBlog doesn't offer an alternate opinion to that of the MSM
They regurgitate the same garbage from WFAN, John Harper, Joel Sherman and the like. Cerrone and his bloggers lack an intellectual curiosity that is so pronounced that they fail to offer a coherent opinion. For instance, check out Matt’s reaction to the Francoeur trade where he begins with “I don’t know what to think” and later ‘analyzes’ the deal by stating “Church has a slightly better OBP”. This is coming from the most visible Mets blog on the Internet. Every time he gives half-assed analysis or agrees with Evan Roberts from his highly visible perch, the folks at AA and MetsGeek (among others) have to work that much harder to gain exposure for interesting and informed Mets analysis.
Plus, ad hominem arguments are sometimes fun.
by All Shook Down on Jul 12, 2009 1:51 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
If
by good, everyday, up to the minute news, you mean caveman like opinions and stealing all of MLBTR’s Met related stories, then yes, they are on the money.
"It's like the old phrase goes.....The balls in your court now Mr.Church, so you take that ball, you dribble it up the court and....................................... get a layup"
- Keith Hernandez
If you feel that way, that's fine.
But please, continue to post other things as well. I don’t think any one has a problem with MetsBlog inherently, but their problem is the lack of opposite opinions. We all appreciate opposing opinions here, like in this case you with Metsblog. But if you continue to contribute more to the site, I think more people will be inclined to offer up positive and some negative feedback on your work as well. So…
Welcome :)
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
No, my primary grievance about it is that it is affiliated with the organization.
You would expect a higher quality of journalism from an entity that is affliated to a billion dollar organization’s media arm, wouldn’t you?
I just find it ridiculous that you can find more accurate information and engaging discussion at scores of other Mets related websites from people who just do it for “fun” rather than being compensated by the franchise’s media arm.
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.
Yeah, this is the thing
That they made it a formal arrangement, which must have been purely the brainchild of the marketing department. But the affiliation really damages the journalistic integrity of SNY. Not to hate on metsblog, but it’s so amateurish, in the neutral and negative senses of the word, and it should never have been formally made a branch of SNY. It doesn’t say anything good about the Mets organization and how they view things.
MetsBlog would still be idiotic garbage without the SNY affiliation.
Indeed, it was, and we made fun of Cerrone’s idiocy then too. But the SNY affiliation makes it even more worth mocking.
Honestly, I have a hard time believing people who don’t see why MetsBlog is idiotic enough to deserve occasional mockery. This idea that you need “balance” between smart and stupid, that you want to hear the “perspective” of a guy who can’t even assemble an English sentence, is like wanting to “teach the conflicts” about creationism or heliocentrism. If you want me to take MetsBlog seriously, you need to argue that it deserves it, not affect this pose of universal tolerance toward all ideas, no matter how illiterate or dumb.
True, I just think it compounds it exponentially
If it was some guy doing it for fun, I wouldn’t begrudge him the opportunity to write his mindless drivel.
The fact that it is endorsed by SNY should hold it to a much higher standard. To see that the quality of the content has remained the same after the affiliation is dumbfounding.
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.
The thing that winds up being offensive about it
Is that there’s something of a feedback loop that goes on between media like Metsblog and WFAN and the way the team’s management makes decisions. I’m not saying Omar Minaya is using Cerrone’s polls as the final kicker in close decisions, but its still who the organization has chosen to associate itself with despite buttloads of evidence that there are far better resources. If this was an isolated incident, it’d be one thing, but its not. I’d love to poll the “higher-ups” in the Mets organization and ask which baseball media figures they’re aware of and they’re comfort level on a scale of 1-10 of their ability to discuss each person’s contributions:
Mike Francessa
John Heyman
Matt Cerrone
Bill Madden
Bill James
Nate Silver
Dave Cameron
Eric Simon
I don’t think the results would gel of such a poll would gel with the reality of what each of these people has contributed, respectively. Culture has a way of building prophecies on self fulfillment, and Metsblog is the symbol of a glaring flaw in this particular community, which just happens to be a community that a lot of us wish we could be prouder to consider ourselves a part of.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 13, 2009 12:45 AM EDT up reply actions
I really don't get why SNY needs MetsBlog
Its just embarassing for them to be affiliated with a false “voice of the fan” website that panders to the slow-witted, thereby endorsing Cerrone et al. as their most prominent spokespeople on the web. Especially when they employ people like Ted Berg who actually know things about baseball.
Have to disagree with you.
I don’t think it’s the “false voice of the fan.” I have come to bedgrudgingly accept that the majority of fans do think this way. I threw something up on my Facebook status about the Franceour trade and most people took the Cerrone approach that “Church was nothing special and Francoeur is younger, more potential, etc.”
My take on Mets Blog is that Cerrone always did a decent job of being a news aggregator of Mets info while lacking on analysis and literary elegance. However, he has done a very solid job during the trade deadline over the past few years, so I will give him credit for that.
+1
This site is, in a sense, very elitist. I think most of the people commenting here are much smarter than the average baseball fan, and we know it. I have no problem with that, and I don’t even really have a problem with us congratulating ourselves over that fact (though I tend to prefer being humble), but the constant Metsblog bashing almost comes off as petty jealousy.
When people want to learn about World War II, a lot more of them will just read some Wikipedia entries than will pick up an Ian Kershaw book. Should Ian Kershaw write a book bitching about how dumb Wikipedia is? No, he should continue writing his well-researched, intelligent books knowing that they’ll only reach a tiny fraction of the people that a shoddily researched Wikipedia entry will reach. That’s just the way the world works, unfortunately.
regardless
you can’t expect the “unwashed masses” to flock to a site like this, and constantly bitching about it degrades this site a bit, IMO.
I don't disagree.
See my post above. I think people are entitled to their own opinions, and if someone likes the site, that’s fine. I have it on MY RSS reader. I just hate the comment section. But whatevs. It’s not like it’s worse than Wallace Matthew’s archives. Bleh.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
That wasn't really my point, that's just an extraneous fact
If Bill Madden or Wallace Matthews or Bart Hubbach made the type of errors that this site makes on a regular basis, they would get reamed consistantly (and they do sometimes and they get reamed for it).
The fact that they are affiliated with SNY holds them to a higher standard where you would expect there to be a greater degree of accuracy and discourse. My point is, if you look at the 2 sites, which one is more professional and accurate? I would say Metsblog is down the list a bit.
Doing what we all to in the Fan Posts by regurgitating things that we have run in to while scouring the internet for Mets related feedback doesn’t really reflect the level of access that they supposedly have to the club.
Like I said above, if this was some guy doing it for fun, I wouldn’t begrudge him the opportunity to write what he likes. That’s not really the case.
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.
Cerrone doesn't have an editor like those guys do.
Do you think Matthews and Hubbach pump out articles with perfect grammar? Doubtful.
But I'm sure...
they don’t…. type like…. william shatner…. speaks.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
i agree
most of the fans are too stupid for AA. keep it exclusive and away from the idiots like joe beningo.
by wrightnumber5 on Jul 13, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions
MetsBlog
I don’t get all of the hating on MetsBlog in general and on Matt specifically. I can understand why members of this community might elect not to read the commentary and analysis there; they take a different approach to player and team evaluation than we do, and even if it isn’t my cup of tea it certainly appeals to a lot of people. As much as WFAN and some of the folks on SNY, MetsBlog is the mouthpiece of the Mets fan. If it weren’t, it wouldn’t be nearly as popular as it is. This is why SNY has partnered with MetsBlog: it gives them access to 100,000 Mets fans every day who are interested in mainstream coverage of the team (the same sort of coverage that SNY provides). Even if they were inclined to provide different coverage, it’s the established content on MetsBlog that SNY was interested in associating itself with, so it can’t be surprising that MetsBlog’s approach to Mets writing hasn’t veered off into Saberland.
Whether or not you agree with everything written at MetsBlog, there’s no reason to disparage them for doing what they love and writing about what they believe. What should be patently obvious is that Matt works his ass off there and does enjoy the fruits of that labor. More people visit MetsBlog every day than any other team-specific sports blog (to my knowledge), which is an astounding feat. He may not employ cutting-edge analysis or use the latest in statistical numbers, but he’s a shrewd guy and he gives the people what they want.
Of course I think we do a better job of getting to the meat of important questions surrounding the Mets. I think we do that better than anyone; we work our asses off here, too. And of course I think the Mets would be better served by reading what we do here, because empirical evidence is almost always more meaningful (and honest and devoid of human bias) than anecdotes and intangibles-based wishcasting. If I didn’t believe all of that I certainly wouldn’t spend so much time writing about it.
I’ll echo some of the other sentiments here that slagging down MetsBlog makes us look petty and small. The percentage of folks who have embraced modern objective baseball analysis grows every day, but it’s an uphill battle to convince others that our way is the better way. You win them over by engaging them and arguing cogently, not by belittling or insulting them. Slandering MetsBlog might make you feel better, but it does come off as elitist and, frankly, a little mean-spirited.
I’d never object to MetsBlog users having a discussion about Amazin’ Avenue so I certainly have no intention of censoring this dialogue; all I ask is that before you go about maligning another site (or anyone, really), think about the battle you’re trying to fight and whether or not you’re going about it as constructively as you could be.
by Eric Simon on Jul 13, 2009 11:10 AM EDT reply actions 6 recs
very well said
that pretty much sums up exactly how I feel about the topic, but said much more eloquently than I could have put it.
Neat
There’s nothing else to say but well said.
by DannyMetsGeek on Jul 13, 2009 11:44 AM EDT up reply actions
yes but
what better way to feel better about yourself than to point out the shortcomings of others?
ok just kidding. excellent points but i would still like to see some slagging, if it was done humoursly and without invection and only at the most egregious examples of the rampant nincompoopery found on metsblog.
Lets hope that when gut check time comes again the Mets will pass it with flying colors.
Right
None of this is to say we shouldn’t call out shoddy journalism in all of its forms. If I write something ill-informed or poorly researched I expect to hear about it. Likewise MetsBlog, SNY, The Daily News, etc. But there’s a difference between hollow insults and constructive criticism and we should always be striving for the latter.
I'm glad you wrote this
was going to say something like this bt didn’t feel up to getting flamed, or whatever the kids are calling it, bc the atmosphere here can be pretty petty recently.
I have long thought the overboard personal shots at him (I’m not referring to what Anthony R has written here) have not reflected well on AA, and certainly not on its founder who I can’t imagine making such comments. Matt links to AA over and over again while there are posts devoted to disparaging him for failing something he clearly isn’t trying to do. It doesn’t look good. We can celebrate AA without attacking Matthew Cerrone’s dress shirts, I believe.
I.M. Forme
"When you get yourself into trouble is when you feel you have to do something, and then you get yourself in trouble." --Omar Minaya
by itsmetsforme on Jul 13, 2009 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
To be honest, even though I'm not a huge fan of the site...
The guy is my idol. He spends his days covering the Mets and getting paid for what I do for fun. I have no problem with him personally and as long as he keeps cashing those SNY checks, god bless him.
For me, the quality of the contents is more SNY’s problem than mine. I’ve just seen the accuracy as a problem.
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.
well
the fact that he always seems to wear that blue shirt is kinda funny, as is pointing out that the frequent use of ellipses makes his writing sound like William Shatner. I have no problem with that kinda stuff, but I think it sometimes goes over the top. Overall I think Cerrone seems like a really likable guy who loves the Mets as much as anyone, and while I wish he used a more statistical based approach, I actually respect the fact that he tries to stay positive about the team for the most part. I think a lot of the animosity only surfaced after he took the SNY sponsorship, but personally I can’t begrudge him that – any one of us would have taken the opportunity in a heartbeat, and if my favorite franchise was going to pay me to write about them, I wouldn’t mention any stats other than Batting Average and RBI’s if that’s what they wanted.
I've said it before
You’d be reading Dr. Porkenheimer’s Boner Juice Presents Amazin’ Avenue if only that esteemed company would step forward and offer their sponsorship.
by Eric Simon on Jul 13, 2009 10:17 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
well I'm taking a meeting this week with
Sheppy and Sons’ Artificial Limb and Deer Scat Solvent Emporium and I will put in a good word for you if they agree to my terms.
I.M. Forme
"When you get yourself into trouble is when you feel you have to do something, and then you get yourself in trouble." --Omar Minaya
by itsmetsforme on Jul 13, 2009 11:07 PM EDT up reply actions
That wasn't my intention with the post.
I’m not slandering anyone nor is it my intention to critize opinions. They put the work in and are entitled to have their writing reflect what their feelings are.
My point was that “the mouthpiece of the fans” is often inaccurate, not from a perspective point of view, but from a factual point of view (like the example linked above). I’m surprised at that.
Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.
ONly think I'm gonna say in regards to this
is that he chose the perfect name for his blog. That’s the only reason it got so big to where he was able to be apart of SNY. It’s a fine Mets information aggregate, but as far as journalistic, it’s pretty crappy.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
Many people argue this
But why aren’t there successful sites at Yankeesblog.com, yanksblog.com, cubsblog.com, soxblog.com, redsoxblog.com, dodgersblog.com, etc.?
that's a really good question
tell me if this doesn’t make sense, but isn’t the answer to that something like “why is there only one David Eckstein?”
I think Metsblog has value — or could have value — but the …analysis… is just kind of killing it. For me, at least.
my guess is those blogs were total crap
for all the abuse heaped on the blue shirted one, he did an amazing job running that blog by himself way back when. personally i can atest that after googling “mets blog” and finding cerrone’s one man show, i was quite happy with the product and absolutely have that blog to thank for getting me back into baseball and the mets. but reading that blog now is painful and i pretty much just ignore it. so its a combination of several things. i personally have nothing agasint cerrone (i mean i never met the guy) and am appreciative of the site from back in the day but i can see where mets fans know would get annoyed when the ‘voice of the fans’ says somethign totally stupid. and i think the ad hominem parade you somtimes get into discsussing him and metsblog on AA can be distasteful and quite poor form, but on the other hand if youre going to go on tv regularly you should be prepared to be savaged by the masses, so i dont really have too much sympathy for him either.
Lets hope that when gut check time comes again the Mets will pass it with flying colors.
My answer
Luck. Just because a you register a practical and catchy domain name doesn’t mean you will be succesful, but if you register a terrible domain name that makes no sense and is immemorable, your chances of success decrease greatly. The idea that metsblog is successful [at least partly] because its called metsblog and a blog called yankeesblog won’t be succesful despite it being called yankeesblog are not mutually exclusive ideas.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 14, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Another example
David Wright can hit a scorching line drive, and if you’re not considering directionality, there’s still about a 25% chance its going to be an out. However, the chances that it will be an inside the park HR are less than 25%, and require a number of other factors to go right as well. So even though the process was a good one (such as choosing an awesome domain name or taking a sweet swing), the chances that it will yield the best result possible (inside the park HR or one of the most viewed sportsblogs in the world) are still smaller than the chances it will yield the worst result possible (an out or a sportsblog with a minuscule readership).
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 14, 2009 3:10 PM EDT up reply actions
While those that dwell here
Hold themselves and their baseball experience to a higher (more empirical, as Eric put it above) standard, the fact remains that sort of analysis isnt quite mainstream yet. When the average fan starts being able to define VORP and WAR and BABIP as well as AVG and RBI, then perhaps you will see a shift in mentality. For the time being, however, Metsblog and that particular arm of the Mets media network is simply trying to serve the most fans possible, most of which a) can’t wrap their minds around statistical formulas designed to truly analyze a player’s worth on the baseball field, or b) don’t give a shit, yet.
Live and let live.
For me it's not so much about statistical analysis or the lack of
My problem with metsblog, I mean. It just so often (unless things have really improved recently) is riddled with errors. Grammar and spelling errors, etc – okay, that’s common on blogs, though I don’t like it and I think any site affiliated with a major media organization should really employ an editor. But even game reports would get all sorts of things wrong, to the point where it seemed doubtful that the writer had seen the game.
yeah, I agree.
The borderline innumeracy and knee-jerk grit-based analysis opinion actually bothers me less than the rank illiteracy. If MetsBlog were written in basic complete sentences, in competent high-school-graduate-level English, I would cut it a lot more slack.
oops -- "analysis opinion"
was supposed to be -analysis- opinion (or use ^H^H^H^H if you prefer)
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