Rumor: Mets Talking 3-Way Deal With Cleveland And Tampa
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 10:26 PM EDT
139 comments
We are hearing dialogue about the Mets/Rays/ and Indians talking about a three way deal. In this scenario Victor Martinez would go to Tampa and not New York. As of now we do not know who the Mets would receive in this scenario.
Mike goes on to speculate that Scott Kazmir, the lost son, could return to the Mets. Given the rumors around the Rays to this point, that makes the most sense to me. DraysBay speculates on Carlos Pena being another possibility, which would mark the end of the Delgado-era for the Mets. Pena is signed through 2010, to an affordable $10.125MM.
Metsblog claims the Mets are trying to make a deal with Cleveland that would avoid trading top prospects, in the mold of the J.J. Putz trade. That would fit the description here: a three-way trade in which the Mets throw a lot of lower-minor talent to get an injury-prone pitcher who was good two years ago.
As an editorial note: wouldn't it be ironic if the bad trade that Minaya made to save his job was getting Kazmir back?
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Andrew Friedman
must be unable to contain his excitement with Omar and Shapiro involved.
by mets81 on Jul 30, 2009 10:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I wasn't sure on Delgado's status.
I think I read August-ish. Which, if true, makes no sense to acquire Pena.
by R.J. Anderson on Jul 30, 2009 10:31 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
hey
R.j., tell your boy Friedman to stay away from Omar. You’re going to clearly win any trade and that’s just not fair. Just let us stay in fourth place in peace
by Pat Andriola on Jul 30, 2009 10:44 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions 0 recs
Questionable for August
but yes dumb
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kazmir isn't too bad, for the right price that is.
I have a feeling Minaya may do something stupid though.
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 30, 2009 10:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I can't wait for the trade deadline to pass for a number of reasons
Nonstop flow of unsubstantiated b.s. “rumors” is at the top of the list. Of course, if this trade actually happened I’ll gladly eat my words. Hold onto Holt and Mejia please.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 30, 2009 10:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I couldn't agree more
Its somewhat exciting when the Mets are in contention and you are looking to pick up that one piece for a stretch run, but its time like this (and 2004) when its down right sickening.
by mets81 on Jul 30, 2009 10:34 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Get Pena and give up Castillo and move Murph to second? :)
I know he hasn’t been too productive but I like having Murph playing nearly everyday. Just my opinion though :)
by dulciusEXasperis on Jul 30, 2009 10:36 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
News flash:
Luis Castillo isn’t the problem.
by Eric Simon on Jul 30, 2009 10:38 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
+1
Too many people think he is when he is one of our better and more consistent players.
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 30, 2009 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Still
he’s definitely not the future for us. It’s hard for me to put stock in his health for next season, but clearly he’s still a good value if he’s healthy. That’s a big if.
For me it’d be ideal to trade him away.. but not for Carlos Pena. Depth. An arm. Not as a move to “push” us “into” the playoffs.
ain't had enough...
by BlackOps on Jul 30, 2009 10:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Whoa never said he was just moving the only expandable infielder.
Not like we’re moving Wright, Rayes or whoever is starting at first.
Relax fellas geeze I was messing around. just didn’t want to see someone take Murphy’s spot because I like the kid….whoa….relax
by dulciusEXasperis on Jul 30, 2009 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It'd be a lot to give up
but at least Kazmir is signed through 2011 with an option for 2012. Plus Dan Warthen said he could fix him in 15 minutes.
by Eric Simon on Jul 30, 2009 10:39 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
How did no one catch this reference?!
Sigh…
"If there was ever a man dying inside, it must be Jerry Manuel" - Vin Scully
by pingel on Jul 30, 2009 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I caught it
just didn’t say anything
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 30, 2009 11:51 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
because i died on the inside when i read it
but i remember peterson all too well
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I caught it
but I just got here.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jul 30, 2009 11:54 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Any chance it's Crawford that may come here?????
by Syler on Jul 30, 2009 10:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That is the one guy I want
I’d trade F! if it meant we were getting Crawford back. That guy was basically designed to play at Citifield.
by Balagast on Jul 30, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
So is Jose
oops
ain't had enough...
by BlackOps on Jul 30, 2009 10:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If we don't have to give up too much
I’d be ecstatic
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 30, 2009 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
crawford is the only one of the 3
i really want to see in this trade
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Kazmir, Crawford, or Pena would all fit this team nicely
I guess it all depends on the price to get them. Somehow I’m not that confident here.
"If I ever decide to do a book, I've already got the title...The bases were loaded and so was I."
-Jim Fregosi
by Schmidtxc on Jul 30, 2009 10:51 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
If we could get Kazmir
or Crawford and not give up our top 3 pitching prospects.You make that deal
by Jadden Hopkins on Jul 30, 2009 10:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
There are others I wouldn't trade right now
Ike Davis to name one.
by Balagast on Jul 30, 2009 10:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It all depends on the deal.
no one should be untouchable, but some players should be hard to get to the point of being untouchable, but only Mejia, Holt, and Martinez are that for me.
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Personally
I’d trade F! in the right deal. His injuries worry me to a degree, but we would have to get a good haul in return.
by Balagast on Jul 30, 2009 10:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Me too
i think we have all soured on F!.And pitching is more important than hitting
by Jadden Hopkins on Jul 30, 2009 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
hmm
What’s fair value for Crawford? F! and Parnell..?
I still like F! He’s gonna be a good player, but with his skills I just don’t see it all coming together.
ain't had enough...
by BlackOps on Jul 30, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I really hope we get Crawford
He would be great for Citi and will be part of the “Core” with David,Jose,and Beltran
by Jadden Hopkins on Jul 30, 2009 11:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
he would fit in well there
i just hope they dont overpay for him, if he’s indeed their target
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still wouldn't underestimate F!'s power
The injuries are becoming a real concern, and its not just durability issues, its development stunting. But when he’s managed to start showing off his pop like he did back in the SAL and like he was early this year in Buffalo, you get a taste of just how good he could be if the skills do come together.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 30, 2009 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well anybody who is injury prone
and dealing with the mets training staff is likely to be dead or maimed within a year of being injured given their track record this season , maybe we should be careful with this guy.
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Absolutely
I’m just saying his ceiling is still huge, and he still looks like he has nice odds at become at least a solid regular. But the injuries are definitely very troubling.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 30, 2009 11:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd guess if Martinez is heading to Tampa
and Kazmir is coming here, Tampa would be sending a prospect to Cleveland as well.
"If I ever decide to do a book, I've already got the title...The bases were loaded and so was I."
-Jim Fregosi
by Schmidtxc on Jul 30, 2009 11:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Rays will not make that trade.
CC is not a guy that will most likely be traded for any players involved in a Cleveland or New York Mets swap. They’re still hoping to win this year and they arent going to take an injured AAA player for CC when he is a lot of the reason the Rays are still in the race.
by andy.ss80 on Jul 31, 2009 10:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He's...20...years...old.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 2:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Ike Davis is looking real good right now, even you’re anti-Davis Propaganda can’t hide that at this point, but he’s also much more tradable than either of those three. His whif rate in Bingo is a bit uncomfortable, and his BABIP has been high all year. And at first base, he doesn’t have the potential superstardom of Mejia, Holt, or F!. Even if Davis becomes a nice player, it’ll be easier to find a similar/better player on the open market. But with the other three, there’s a chance we’ll really regret dealing any one of them. It’d be one thing if Davis had a crazy high HR/FB or something, but nothing screams huge outlier superstar.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 30, 2009 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
WOAH
you’re anti-Davis Propaganda
SLANDER
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 11:08 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Slander is spoken, in print it's libel.
by Sokojoe on Jul 30, 2009 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
what about AIM?
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 11:20 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the internet doesn't count
it’s like Deadwood out here.
(j/k, just in case anyone thought otherwise)
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jul 30, 2009 11:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This
:P
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 30, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Slander? Libel?
I would’ve been more upset by the poor apostrophe usage, personally.
by JoshNY on Jul 31, 2009 12:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
this worries me
i’m ok with a trade, but it better be far sighted.
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 10:55 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Knowing Omar
The trade will be David Wright for Matt Garza
by Jadden Hopkins on Jul 30, 2009 10:58 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
they'll have to throw in a pack of baseball cards
and some big league chew for that one
by KeithsMoustache on Jul 30, 2009 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Consider the source
One of the things that both Joe and I discussed, and this is pure speculation not a rumor, is that it could involve Scott Kazmir.
I will cry if Omar continues the vicious cycle of overpaying for names, reputations and WFAN-cred, because the good will immediately after a trade like this would probably result in him keeping his job for another offseason. Essentially, another year of Reyes/Wright/Beltran/Santana will be wasted.
by All Shook Down on Jul 30, 2009 11:02 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
The Kazmir part is pure speculation
but yes this is all a rumor
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 30, 2009 11:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Question
Are the Rays in any way discussing trading BJ Upton? I thought I read somewhere that they were considering moving him because they didn’t think they’ll be able to sign him. This was awhile ago so I’m not sure if it was truth or suggestion. Maybe it was on BtB…
ain't had enough...
by BlackOps on Jul 30, 2009 11:09 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
NO Carlos Pena and NO Kazmir
It was a mistake to trade him for V Zam and it would be a mistake to trade for him now. Kazmir has run into injury problems. He is not the same pitcher that he was in 2007. Pena is flirting with the Mendoza line.
Id rather get Victor Martinez.
Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!
by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 30, 2009 11:35 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I heard a rumor that it was Carl Crawford, and not Pena
Now if Crawford is included than the deal must be made. Can you imagine Reyes/Crawford at the top of the line up. OMG………I’m drooling already.
Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!
by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 30, 2009 11:37 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If it's Crawford you can't pass that deal up
Those two up top for the next 5 years with Wright and Beltran to drive them in…Holy SWIPING BASES Batman
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 30, 2009 11:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree on Kaz
But if it didn’t cost top prospects, I wouldn’t have a huge gripe with Pena. He’s got some pretty awesome power, “CitiField Power” you might say. And despite the ugly average, his BABIP is just .257. Yeah, he strikes out a ton, but when his BABIP is reasonable he’s a solid .250 / .360 / .500.
I highly doubt the Mets are getting Crawford without giving up one of their top three prospects.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 30, 2009 11:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Also
He’d solve the first base problem for next year fairly affordabley, and as long as he wasn’t included in a trade, buy a little extra time to get Ike Davis ready for 2011.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 12:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
But Jermaine Dye is TEH ANSWER, right?
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 2:54 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
At the time
He could have been attained for cheap. There is no chance the Mets get Dye now, for he is in the middle of the divisional title race and is putting up great numbers.
Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!
by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 31, 2009 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
A long night in the front office
Omar will be shaking the eight ball and Wilpons will be gliding the square on the ouija board.
by cuseindahuse on Jul 30, 2009 11:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'd hope Omar is doing more than just shaking the eight ball
if it will be such a long night.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jul 30, 2009 11:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I wouldn't give up Niese for Kazmir
given the control time left, durability issues, etc.
by twon8 on Jul 30, 2009 11:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agree
Niese has all the hallmarks of a future all-star. Kazmir will not be his former self.
by cuseindahuse on Jul 30, 2009 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
What hallmarks would those be?
And I like Niese.
by All Shook Down on Jul 31, 2009 12:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The five pitch repoitoire he developed in the past few months.
A cutter, a 2 seamer, a 4 seamer, curve, and change. That’s pretty sick.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 2:56 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I still don't see superstar
He’s always had a very deep repertoire, the cutter is a fairly recent development, but not as recent as the hype would have you believe. He used to throw a pitch that was more often called a “slider” but rarely threw it in the upper levels. I also seem to remember reading that he used to throw a split in addition to the changeup, but I imagine since the pitches have such similar purpose, he picked the one he was more comfortable with. The advent of the cutter as a viable Major League weapon helps his stock, but I still don’t see a perennial all-star in the making. If things go well, once or twice is possible though.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 3:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I didn't say superstar.
But I think a being a #3 esque starter, as opposed to a #4 or #5, is definitely within the realms of possibility.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 9:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agree
Niese is no superstar.
Lopez wants it away, and it's hit deep to left center, Andruw Jones on the run, this one has a chance... home run!!, Mike Piazza!, and the Mets lead 3 to 2!!
-Howie Rose
Gary Thorne=Simply the Best!
by The American Mr.Hockey on Jul 31, 2009 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I honestly don't see this going well in our favor.
I don’t think Tampa will part with Carl Crawford, unless they think there is no way they are going to be in the playoffs this year. Not sure if I really want any part of Pena, or Kazmir.
But, as stated many times before: If we can somehow get Carl Crawford and we don’t give up everything, I’m all for it.
"If there was ever a man dying inside, it must be Jerry Manuel" - Vin Scully
by pingel on Jul 31, 2009 12:01 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agree with all of the above
Omar is trying to right a wrong here and that rarely works out. Kazmir I think can still be a decent pitcher as he showed the other night but you can’t overpay for him. And Pena is not impressive to me at Citi. Crawford, on the other hand, I think I would give up F! and Mejia for Crawford and I would certainly give up one of them. But I can’t see Tampa getting rid of him.
by Endys Game on Jul 31, 2009 12:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Crawford seems to be the deal breaker here for AA
Kazmir and Pena are iffy but everyone here wants to see what Reyes and Crawford could do at the top of the lineup next season.
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 31, 2009 12:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The problem is
Its hard to imagine an outcome that would include Crawford to the Mets unless they give up one of their best prospects, and that just doesn’t seem like the direction they want to go in.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'd give up a top hitting prospect for Crawford
but don’t touch my pitchers!
"We have to find a way to play better, there's no doubt. Overall. I'm not pointing fingers at anybody. Offense, defense, pitching -- we have to find a way to play better. The reality of this is, coming here to Pittsburgh and being swept -- personally, I feel embarrassed." -- Carlos Beltran
by EMSfan9 on Jul 31, 2009 12:17 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
With the uncertainty behind Carlos Beltran's knees
Acquiring Crawford to play CF wouldn’t be the worst idea — even if it involves dishing out a top prospect.
by All Shook Down on Jul 31, 2009 12:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Crawford
if he is really on the block, you have to make an all out push to get this guy. Offer F!, Parnell and maybe Neise. Something like that would be fair I think. Maybe Tampa can throw us a pitcher as well. Crawford is only 27 and is a steal next year at 10 M. and by all accounts his work ethic is second to none. I think he could do wonders mentoring Reyes and providing leadership as well. I would hate to give up F! but for this deal I think you have to.
by Endys Game on Jul 31, 2009 12:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
True
But it contradicts Cerrone’s “sense” that the team wants to acquire a bat without dealing a top prospect. But at the right price, and considering Carlos Beltran’s ability to roam CF is in question, Crawford would make lots of sense as a target.
My other question would have to be “would the Mets use Crawford in CF?” It seems like the team’s analytical basis for defensive evaluation has more to do with whether or not a certain player has played a particular position recently, as opposed to whether they actually might play that position well (see Sullivan, Corey), and Crawford hasn’t more than eight games in CF in a season since 2004, and only 54 in his career, though his UZR/150 there is 8.8.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 12:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have a feeling that Omar's "scouting sense" would have a chance to prevail.
I hope a trade doesn’t happen, however. To me, no major activity would signify that Jeff Wilpon has cut Minaya’s nuts off.
by All Shook Down on Jul 31, 2009 12:36 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed
Brian Schneider for Reid Brignac too much of a pipe dream?
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They'd play Crawford in center to keep his bat in the lineup
and I’m not joking, I’d guess that would be the logic.
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Jul 31, 2009 12:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha, touche
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I have been wrong before but I have a feeling something will happen tomorrow.
either Omar shocks us all by making a great trade or does something that makes Kazmir for Zambrano look like a work of art.
by Endys Game on Jul 31, 2009 12:40 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
David Wright for David Eckstein
you know it’s coming.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jul 31, 2009 12:52 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bite your tongue, both of you
I’ve been up and down about Pena this season. He got off to a decent start, but in recent weeks he’s been streaky. Haven’t actually watched him but just looked at the stats so I’m not sure what the cause is or might be. Of the three, I think Crawford would have to be the only one worth the price. I suspect Tampa would want more than either Pena or Kazmir are really worth, especially considering Kaz’s injuries and inconsistencies this season.
Not to sound to much like a broken record, but Crawford would definitely be worth a Holt, F!, Mejia or some combination, though I would much prefer trading F! than giving up a pitching prospect. I don’t think Tampa would be willing to part with Crawford just for F! unless they got something amazing from Cleveland.
All that said, my bet is that none of this is actually the case and it is nothing more than a rumor started by a bored journalist or team official who may have overheard or misconstrued something different
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 12:57 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
forgot numbers for Pena
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/splits?playerId=4594
in short:
April – .256/.340/.628
July – .138/.278/.275
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 1:02 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah, that's not that crazy a variance for a high K guy though
The lack of power in July is troubling, but hard to complain about a guy who already has 25 bombs. I really wouldn’t mind if the Mets were giving up lower level prospects to get him, and essentially allow the Rays to free up some funds. Even when Beltran got back, he’d have more raw power than any hitter in the Mets lineup, and he walks enough and in the past has played good enough defense to supplement his lack of contact, though he’s having a poor defensive season this year according to UZR.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 1:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I agree with you, and therein lies the problem
I don’t think the Rays would part with him for just lower level prospects though. Of course, you and I may differ on what constitutes lower level.
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
sorry, should have been a reply to meddler, hit the wrong button
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 1:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who would you consider "lower level"?
I guess Josh Thole would have to be on the table, and I’m sure the Rays would be all about him.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 2:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thole for one
Maybe Tejada or Havens
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Havens is being pretty significantly underrated now. His trade value is not good enough to justify using him in a deal.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 2:29 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The more I think about it
The more I like Pena as a “buy low” candidate. His stock is hurting right now due to a low BABIP, but ZiPs still projects a .236 / .369 / .500 line for the rest of the season and a .379 wOBA. PECOTA’s seven year forecast also called for a .237 / .353 / .471 line for 2010, which would be a nice upgrade over Murphy. If the Rays are desperate to sell right now, its not a terrible idea. When buyers enter the offseason market and realize the best first baseman are Aubrey Huff and Nick Johnson, Pena’s going to look like a much more appealing target. The only issue is dealing with Delgado this year.
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 31, 2009 2:45 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
What kind of free agent is Delgado gona be this offseason
any hope for Type-A?
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 4:28 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would guess no...
They’d have to offer Delgado arbitration, and he might accept.
by sjohnson125 on Jul 31, 2009 9:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Though to be a free agent
he will have to get a $4m buyout in any case, I believe
by deadspy3 on Jul 31, 2009 9:37 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yes
They would have to decline the option and then offer him arbitration.
by Eric Simon on Jul 31, 2009 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
He has no option, no buyout,
and will likely be a type A.
http://mlbcontracts.blogspot.com/2004/12/new-york-mets.html
"If I ever decide to do a book, I've already got the title...The bases were loaded and so was I."
-Jim Fregosi
by Schmidtxc on Jul 31, 2009 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That’s what I thought too although MLB Trade Rumors thinks he’ll be a Type B
by TheBigStapler on Jul 31, 2009 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They have him as a borderline guy now,
If he gets back and plays there’s a very good chance he’s type A.
"If I ever decide to do a book, I've already got the title...The bases were loaded and so was I."
-Jim Fregosi
by Schmidtxc on Jul 31, 2009 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just to get some thoughts.
Would you guys say that the Mets equivalent to the Phillies deal for Lee would be along the lines of Niese, Tejada, Thole, and Familia? If we can get Martinez or get this three way deal and get Crawford with those four, that would be a steal. Although at this point I wouldn’t do that deal for Martinez because of his age, but Crawford would be great.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 4:26 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Maybe the deal is that we screw Cleveland, who trade Martinez to Tampa
And then we get Crawford/Kazmir. But Omar, don’t be stupid, and do not under any circumstances trade Holt/Mejia/Niese. Maybe F!. You could trade Parnell. Not Murphy. I just got the $25 green Murphy tee-shirt, so you cannot trade him. Ike Davis could be traded, just because I don’t think he’s as good as his stats, because of the high BABIP.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 31, 2009 7:09 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'd trade Niese over F! anyday
Niese is a nice player and I think can be a real useful number 3, 2 in his peak years, but F! could be a superstar. If it came down to Niese or Fernando for a guy like Crawford, bye bye Niese.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 7:23 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Oh
And Davis’ BABIP is high, but he still has plus power potential and is supposed to be great at first base. I’d try to keep him right now
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 7:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
would you really trade Niese?
We only have for next year, 2 good starters, Pelfrey and Johan. Niese has pitched well since coming up (yesterday was Jerry’s fault) so that makes 3. Perez is not good, if we’re going to win anything we’ll need pitching.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 31, 2009 7:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would not trade Niese but
if it meant getting Crawford and Kazmir back, I would trade F!, Holt and Davis with no hesitation. A line-up of Reyes, Crawford, Beltran, Wright, Francoeur, Murphy/Evans, Castillo, , with Santana, Pelfrey, Kazmir, Niese, Maine in the rotation would be pretty sweet.
by deadspy3 on Jul 31, 2009 8:00 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Isn't maine out of the picture? Where would Perez fit in the equation?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 31, 2009 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Well, if Maine were out of the picture then
Ollie is a fine number 5 starter, albeit expensive. If not, who knows. Mars?
by deadspy3 on Jul 31, 2009 8:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I agree
A rotation with Johan,Pelfrey,Kaz, Niese,Ollie would be good and 4 out 5 are lefties.Not sure i would trade Holt,or Davis but i would not be pissed if we did.But for some reason Omar thinks F! is the next wille Mays or something
by Jadden Hopkins on Jul 31, 2009 8:18 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
That's way too many lefties for one rotation
Most hitters are right handed, remember?
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I see your point
But I’d rather have a rotation of five good lefties than include a lesser righty just for handedness’ sake.
by deadspy3 on Jul 31, 2009 8:40 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Just be thankful David Wright is on our team then
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
F! is a much better prospect than Niese
His ceiling is so much higher, it’s not even funny. Hypothetically, If we were trading players and it came down to F! or Niese fro Crawford, I keep F!. I’d rather rush Mejia or Holt and keep Fernando. More realistically, you could sign a guy like Washburn or Pineiro (maybe not after this year) as a stop gap or sign Lackey, Bedard, or even Sheets and hope they regain their old form and stay healthy. I don’t get why people are down on Fernando as a std. There wasn’t a better prospect in the IL in AAA when he got called up in June. The injuries are concerning but I’d take the gamble on the superstar outfielder than on a number 3 pitcher.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:19 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Stud not std
STDs are bad.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:31 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
never mind bad joke.
“Usually, STDs are bad.” was what i was getting at.
by meigs1414 on Jul 31, 2009 1:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It DOES mean you're getting action.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Jul 31, 2009 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I'm sorry
I like Niese as much as the next guy (at least so I thought) but I would rather include Niese in a deal over F! and rush Holt or Mejia to the bigs. F!‘s ceiling is so much higher than Niese’s it’s not even funny. Of course, if you don’t want to rush anyone, you could always sign a guy like Wasburn or Piniero as a stopgap or Lackey, Bedard, or even Sheets and hope to get their old selves.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:20 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don't know what the hell this is about but I"M NOT SORRY
mostly because I have nothing to be sorry about.
It was supposed to be the first two words of my post above I think
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Jul 31, 2009 8:22 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
thing is, crawford hasn't been in any reports
Usually, media people actually get their stories right about who gets traded when, especially this close to the break. So, Adam Rubin, I want reports. You are in player development, right? You must know something.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 31, 2009 8:18 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
He lobby to the get the details of the trade
He lobby Omar, he lobby Tony. Etc.
by deadspy3 on Jul 31, 2009 8:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Mike goes on to speculate that Scott Kazmir, the lost son, could return to the Mets.
Yay?
I don't need no instructions to know how to rock!
by R_Adragna on Jul 31, 2009 9:27 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Would you trade ?
Murphy / F-Mart / one of Mejia / Holt / Niese and possibly Parnell
if you could get back Kazmir / Pena / Crawford in a 3 way deal.
Pena replaces Murphy
Kazmir replaces Niese
Crawford replaces F-Mart
I believe all these players are signed or have options thru 2011.
by fxcarden on Jul 31, 2009 9:38 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I would but would the Wilons
That is a fairly large amount of salary to add, both this year and next. They combined have about 11-12mil left this year I believe, and like 29mil next year.
by Balagast on Jul 31, 2009 9:50 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I would as well, but...
I would be shocked if the Rays would accept that.
by sjohnson125 on Jul 31, 2009 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Rays are still in the race.
They are not going to give up three pieces from their active roster to take a bunch of AAA/AAAA players. Plus, can the Mets really add all of that salary for 2010?
by andy.ss80 on Jul 31, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yeah I cant imagine the Rays making that deal
And like you said I don’t think we can afford all those contracts.
by Gina on Jul 31, 2009 11:21 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
We could
With the people we have who will be free agents it might even break even, but no way will it happen
"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage
by blueandorange4life on Jul 31, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can smell the Mama's of Corona from here
Omar, don’t let the sweet, buttery aromas infect your mind. Be strong, be smart!
by TheBigStapler on Jul 31, 2009 10:02 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I know I'm late to the party
But regardless of the possible names I just don’t see how Omar+ Friedman can end well for us.
by Gina on Jul 31, 2009 10:30 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
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