Alex Rios

by bleedin' orange and blue on Jul 9, 2009 2:04 PM EDT

Does anybody else think that it would be a good idea for the Mets to trade for Alex Rios? Some people say that he has a terrible contract, but this post to Fangraphs suggests otherwise. I have read that the Blue Jays are trying to get rid of Rios so that they will be able to sign Halladay and I don't think it would take that much to get him. What does everybody else think about this?

(BTW this is my first post so sorry if i did anything wrong)

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Yes on Rios!

I’ve been wanting Rios for awhile.

With his off year so far this year, I’m less certain that he’s worth the contract, but after looking at what else is out there, I think you have to be willing to take it on. Maybe signing Holliday in the offseason at the cost of a 2nd round pick (assuming the Mets dismal record continues) would be better, but I doubt he’d be available for near the same cost. Omar negotiating with a Boras client in the offseason is a recipe for disaster.

If Rios is available for a minor piece, you have to do it. The Met’s need his defense, he’s got some pop, good all around fit. The Mets have three star players in Reyes, Wright, and Delgado, but are lacking in the supporting cast. Rios is a perfect fit. We need 2-3 guys like this.

Oh, and the link to that article:

link

by acerimusdux on Jul 9, 2009 2:41 PM EDT reply actions

I believe Halladay is a FA after next year, not this year.

The 2009 Mets: Rollins hits a la-a-a-azy fly ball to left field. Murphy ready to put this one in the books as he ma-...HE DROPS THE BALL!! Ruiz rounds second, Murphy throws in to the backup shortstop Cora WHO LETS IT GET BY HIM. To third goes Ruiz! Reed, who took Tatis' spot for defensive reasons fires to thi-...THERE'S NOBODY THERE! Putz is running over to the ball. Picks it up and whirls to home, THROWS IT AWAY! PHLLIES WIN! Putz appears hurt and we're getting word Reyes was involved in another car accident.

by ZaBlanc on Jul 10, 2009 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions

he said holliday

as in matt holliday

by wrightnumber5 on Jul 10, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions

Double yes on Rios

I’ve been clamoring for this since I heard he was on the block. Right side of 30, under control, good defender with a great arm, line drive hitter with some pop and some speed. Still could improve, and I think a change of scenery could help. He seems to translate well to a “CitiField” offense, if that actually means anything.

by njk237 on Jul 9, 2009 2:51 PM EDT reply actions

Generally

For something short like this, you should either turn it into a FanShot, or make a longer post trying to justify an argument to trade for Rios or not to trade for Rios. Either way, welcome. Its nice here, just don’t say mean things about Mike Carp or Josh Thole. I made that mistake with the former.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 9, 2009 2:54 PM EDT reply actions

This.

Also, like I said a week ago, I just don’t believe Ricarrdi is going to let RIos go for cheap, it’s a fair contract and what’s the point of resigning Holla-Day if your getting rid of one of your better positional players?

by Sokojoe on Jul 9, 2009 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions

Ricarrdi is an idiot

I wouldn’t assume anything. That said, the Jays have to get rid of Vernon Wells if they have any hope of resigning Holliday. if we can get Rios without giving up a major prospect it s a great deal. But I think he is the one they want to keep.

by Endys Game on Jul 9, 2009 3:23 PM EDT up reply actions

Ricciardi would really be an idiot

if he signed Holliday instead of Halladay

by JoshNY on Jul 9, 2009 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions

how about Hollaback!!!

paging Gwen Stefani!!

by Endys Game on Jul 9, 2009 5:34 PM EDT up reply actions

boooo

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Jul 9, 2009 5:52 PM EDT up reply actions

lmao

by wrightnumber5 on Jul 10, 2009 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions

I think calling him an idiot is a bit unfair

Yes, his Adam Dunn comments were pretty dumb. But his worse decisions were somewhat understandable if not defendable. There were a large number of fans that favored Ryan over Wagner and both got injured. He tried to lock down what seemed like a productive player at a key position, but Wells didn’t work out. Even the likes of Beane whiffed with young player extension in Chavez. I don’t think Ricarrdi gets enough credit for picking up players like Scutaro who was worth 12 million last year (1.6 salary) and so far this year he has been worth 14.7 or having good if not great players all around. Really I think Ricarrdi’s biggest faults is that he builds a solid team with very little upside meaning that his teams are set up to win in the 82-88 team which is kind of pointless and, yeah, he’s kind of an arrogant jerk.

by Sokojoe on Jul 9, 2009 4:11 PM EDT up reply actions

to be fair

last year’s Blue Jays team had 93 pythagorean wins (I am a Jays and Mets fan). If the Jays were in the National League East they’d be in the hunt with the Phillies right now and people would be talking about them trading for players, not moving Halladay.

As you said, Ricciardi takes a lot of, in many cases well-deserved flack, for being arrogant, but the guy has put together a team that’s a lot better than the Mets for $80.5 M vs. $149M. And if you think the Mets have had injuries, the Blue Jays now have four major league ready starters out with labrum fraying (or tearing) or Tommy John surgery.

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 10, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions

By the way

you guys have a great site here.

Lind/Snider/Overbay right now will be crowding LF/1B/DH in 2010, but Overbay’s contract is up in 2011.

Rios stands to make 10M in 2010 and more going forward, so that would free up salary, but he is actually a very good player. Think of Blue Jays fans who are disgruntled with Rios as like Mets fans who are disgruntled with Carlos Beltran (obviously Rios is not as good as Nachos Beltrande). The guys are good at everything, they’re just underrated because they aren’t exceptional at anything (except defence which is already, of course, underrated).

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 10, 2009 11:40 AM EDT up reply actions

Beltran is an exceptional hitter

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 10, 2009 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions

Beltran is an exceptional hitter OVERALL

But in his career with the Mets:

BA: .281
OBP: .368
SLG: .507

2005 – 2008 AVG / Season with Mets
HR: 29
2B: 36
SB: 20

Those numbers, taken individually, each suggest a solid ballplayer. No one will complain about someone who OBP’s .368 unless he hits for absolutely no power. No one will complain about someone who slugs .507 unless he can’t get on at all.

The point that I’m making here is that nothing Beltran does jumps out at you like Ichiro’s ability to get 200 hits every year or Adam Dunn’s ability to hit 40 homers. To get an idea of how good Beltran is you need to take everything into account at once. Rios is a worse version of a similar player (though he’s average at best at getting on base).

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 10, 2009 12:40 PM EDT up reply actions

He played injured in 05 so to average

that season in with 06 07 and 08 is somewhat unfair.

If you go from 06-09 hes a .286/.379/.536 hitter and from 06-08 he has a .390 wOBA good for 15th in the league over that time period.

I get what you’re saying though. Also, I really like Rios as a player and would love to have him, but Beltran should be in the hall of fame when his career is over, Rios has to pick up the pace to get there.

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 10, 2009 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions

the wOBA comment is exactly what i mean by taking everything into account at once

And I know that Beltran was injured in ’05, but I think that caused Mets fans to go sour on him pretty quick. And even still, .376 is a great OBP but not otherwordly and ditto for .536 as SLG. Neither of those would be top-10 in the NL right now.

And I definitely agree that Beltran could be a HoFer, Rios is good, but nowhere near HoF-good. As I said, a worse version of a similar player. And you’re right — Steve Phillips is a moron. But what do you expect from someone who thinks that Sammy Sosa didn’t do steroids because he corked his bat?

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 13, 2009 3:45 AM EDT up reply actions

No way

But what do you expect from someone who thinks that Sammy Sosa didn’t do steroids because he corked his bat?

Did Steve Phillips really suggest such a thing? That’s hilarious.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 13, 2009 4:08 AM EDT up reply actions

Not only did he say it

he wrote it. Check it out for yourselves:

http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2875680

In fact, consider that Sosa did get busted for corking a bat during his playing days. Why would a player on steroids cork his bat? He wouldn’t.

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 13, 2009 9:37 AM EDT up reply actions

Wow, just wow

Player gets caught cheating, therefore player isn’t likely to be cheating in other situations. I don’t think there’s something I could slam into my face hard enough to express the absurdity of such a claim.

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 13, 2009 1:41 PM EDT up reply actions

Yes

There’s no other way to put it.

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 13, 2009 3:32 PM EDT up reply actions

Man, I knew Steve Phillips was stupid

but that’s a whole new level. That’s equivalent to the old, “I deal drugs, so of course I wouldn’t commit armed robbery” defense.

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jul 13, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions

Maybe I'm alone

but in relation to the article, I don’t think Sosa is a hall of famer based on the numbers.

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 13, 2009 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions

If he was not a cheater

I would probably vote for him based on his offensive contributions and his surprisingly competent fielding.

Personally, I don’t take cheating lightly with regards to Hall of Fame consideration. The Hall is a privilege, not a right — if you don’t play by the rules, you don’t get to go.

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 13, 2009 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions

Wait we're wrong, he not that good...

Beltran is overrated

And that’s really funny if Steve really said that.

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 13, 2009 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions

Overrated, overpaid

same thing

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 13, 2009 4:13 AM EDT up reply actions

I love how there is absolutely no explanation for how he's overpaid

all it says is “cashed in” with a big market club.

Some of the inclusions are good, some are dumb, but the biggest problem is the reasoning behind them is nonsensical.

It is like he cherry-picks a fluke half-season to compare someone who has had a much-better career and is a more sure thing to (Posada to Varitek, etc.). Someone should tell him about Carlos Silva and Gary Mathews Jr.

"Look at me! I'm Tomokazu Ohka of the Montreal Expos!"

by jessef on Jul 13, 2009 9:54 AM EDT up reply actions

Yes

And Rios has struggled this year, so it’s probably somewhat similar to Beltran 2005. Even after 2006 I remember there being a number of Met fans who thought he wasn’t that good and the Mets had wasted their money and should have gotten a “big bat” instead.

You seldom see the criticisms of Beltran anymore though. I think the fact he played 161 games last year helped. If Rios bounces back from his slump he could end up being bargain. I wonder if he’s playing through an injury though.

by acerimusdux on Jul 10, 2009 3:26 PM EDT up reply actions

Seldom see criticisms of Beltran

Those seldom criticisms come from Steve Phillips

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 10, 2009 3:49 PM EDT up reply actions

oh ok

i didnt know about fanshots

"You don't set nobody back because of a cough."-Jerry Manuel, Mets Manager

by bleedin' orange and blue on Jul 9, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions

Its coo'

They’re easy to miss at first, and tough to figure out if you don’t have something to link to (that’s apparently what we use the “chat” FanShot for now).

"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet

What a fool I was to defy him"

-HST

by Mark Himmelstein on Jul 9, 2009 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions

added bonus

if trading for Rios helps the Jays extend Halladay’s contract, that means the Phils don’t trade for Halladay

by JoshNY on Jul 9, 2009 3:03 PM EDT reply actions

I actually really, really like Rios

He’s an immediate solution for center and a long term solution for either corner.

by TheBigStapler on Jul 9, 2009 3:27 PM EDT reply actions

If they aren't picking up any of the remaining money, we should get him for a reasonable deal.

I’d take him in a second. His remaining contract after this year (5 year, $60 million) isn’t really in line with his current production, but moreso his past and potential, but he’s a fit.

I’ve been saying this for weeks…he is signed long-term, fits in to the model in which this team should be built (defense, speed), and has an opportunity to flourish hitting in this line-up when whole. He’s also an option should Beltran need to move to a corner.

There probably aren’t going to be many suitors out there, so throw out the Familia, Tejada and Murph pu pu platter and see if they bite.

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.

by AnthonyR on Jul 9, 2009 3:35 PM EDT reply actions

What MLB positions do the Jays need the most?

by Michkin on Jul 9, 2009 3:54 PM EDT reply actions

SS

I think.

Thats why everyone thinks they’re a fit with the Phillies – because of Jason Donald.

by mets81 on Jul 9, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions

maybe

but they have scutaro

"You don't set nobody back because of a cough."-Jerry Manuel, Mets Manager

by bleedin' orange and blue on Jul 9, 2009 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions

THE VENEZUELAN HAMMER!

by JoshNY on Jul 9, 2009 4:10 PM EDT up reply actions

How about Tejada?

Tejada+Rustich+??? for Rios?

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Jul 9, 2009 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions

SS is pretty big

They don’t have one in their top 10 prospects and John McDonald is getting up there in age and not really producing (although they have our boy, Marco Scutaro).

Aside from that, they could use some young help in the pen. Their rotation is pretty stocked with young talent so Niese/Holt/Mejia probably aren’t needing to be on the table.

Everyone is entitled to be stupid, but Jerry abuses the privilege.

by AnthonyR on Jul 9, 2009 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions

Scutaro's been beast this year.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw

by squid92 on Jul 9, 2009 4:14 PM EDT up reply actions

I've always liked Rios

so if they can get him for some mixed bag and take the salary, I would do it.

by mets81 on Jul 9, 2009 3:59 PM EDT reply actions

I love Rios game,

and think it would fit perfectly in Citifield. I wouldn’t mind giving up tejada in a deal for him, Rios really should be attainable for not too much more. I think the Jays are stuck with that Wells deal, I’d love to take Rios off their hands.

"If I ever decide to do a book, I've already got the title...The bases were loaded and so was I."

-Jim Fregosi

by Stephen Schmidt on Jul 9, 2009 7:08 PM EDT reply actions

Imagine

Beltran flanked by F! and Rios. That’s a great defensive OF.

by njk237 on Jul 9, 2009 9:14 PM EDT reply actions

Yea

Rios is a tremendous outfielder

"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."

by Evan_S on Jul 9, 2009 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions

Great Idea!

I love Rios and he probably wouldn’t take that much to get.

by wrightnumber5 on Jul 9, 2009 11:37 PM EDT reply actions

I think he'll take more to get than you guys think...

but I’d still be willing to give the extra up for him now.

by BlackOps on Jul 10, 2009 4:31 AM EDT reply actions

Definately would like to have Rios on the Mets, as you all have said he’s a perfect fit.
Shouldn’t really cost much either if Toronto are looking to dump salary…and apparently he’s worn out his welcome there.
The sad thing is that with trading for Francoer its doubtful Omar will feel the need to go after Rios, in which case that makes the Francoer trade 1 million times worse.
With Beltran and Rios in CF & RF the Mets could put an all offense minus defense slugger in LF and still have a great OF defense.
Plus Rios would probably lead the league in doubles & triples hitting in Citi Field.

by Ohpityme on Jul 11, 2009 7:26 AM EDT reply actions

Why not trade for Rios AND Halladay?

I’ll try to be very brief in my reasoning.

Rios and Halladay would help the Mets creep back into contention while waiting on Reyes, Delgado, Beltran, and Maine. Then, when they get back you would have the makings of a very nice lineup and if they could squeak into the playoffs they would be pretty dangerous.

Lineup: Reyes, SS; Rios, LF, Wright, 3B, Beltran, CF; Delgado, 1B; Francoeur, RF; Schneider, C; Castillo, 2B. They would even have Sheff to DH if they made the WS.

Playoff Rotation: Johan, Halladay, Perez, Maine.

Playoff Bullpen: Feliciano, Green, Wagner, Putz, K-Rod.

by SQUAD on Jul 13, 2009 11:25 AM EDT reply actions

i agree

however im not sure if they have the prospects for halladay and it prob wouldnt take much for Rios which is why i think they should at least get him. But yeah if they could get both that would be great.

by wrightnumber5 on Jul 13, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions

Why wouldn't they have the prospects?

You have Mejia and Holt in the BA top 50 and Flores and FMart are still considered quality prospects. You could throw in Tejada if they want a SS that badly. There is also the Pelfrey option. Niese and Parnell would also be considerations as well.

And I understand this is a 180 from my post a few weeks back that this team isn’t good enough to contend, but the more I think about the construction of this team, I think they have a 2-3 year window with this core to win a title. Why not push your chips into the middle of the table and try to supplement the Wright, Reyes, Beltran, Johan, KRod core with some better MLB level players?

by SQUAD on Jul 13, 2009 12:30 PM EDT up reply actions