Open Thread: Mets vs Giants
by Eric Simon on Aug 14, 2009 6:13 PM EDT
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PrintSan Francisco Giants at New York Mets, Aug 14, 2009 7:10 PM EDT
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these line-ups are so depressing
jesus, i was going to go to this game, but then i remembered watching parnell and this line-up would be torture.
anyway, i wrote a blog on how the mets can contend in 2010 on a reduced budget. http://firejerrymanuel.wordpress.com/
get nolasco, homegrown bullpen (adding bostick, nieve and maine), platooning ankiel/reed johnson, acquiring towles, pairing him with thole or a really cheap lefty bat. yay!
by firejerrymanuel on Aug 14, 2009 6:16 PM EDT reply actions
Do you really think Nolasco can be a #2
i would go for someone more proven
by Jadden Hopkins on Aug 14, 2009 6:35 PM EDT up reply actions
trust me...
dude is the goods.
he’s getting killed by BABIP and LOB%
marlins demoted him, so hopefully they’re souring on him.
by firejerrymanuel on Aug 14, 2009 7:00 PM EDT up reply actions
trade for him
try to buy low. he’s worth a lot. holt/havens/something? anything but mejia/fernando really.
by firejerrymanuel on Aug 14, 2009 9:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Lineup Fail
over/under on Parnell innings? I say 3 is max
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
aginst *that* SF lineup?
He might throw a complete game.
first met no hitter
however he walks in a run in the 9th, and we lose 1-0
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Hey, our lineup isn't so bad.
We’ve got Slappy, Dub, and Sheff in there. Thats three competent hitters!
ain't had enough...
Frenchy
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:33 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, like he said
Three competent hitters.
And both Pagan and Francoeur have been hot.
It’s still a sad lineup but its not the worst we’ve put out. Oh god did I just say this isn’t the worst lineup we’ve had this year? I wanna cry.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
I think the worst lineup
was that gave vs the Fish and Josh Johnson and we had Tim Redding pitching and no Dubs.Needless to say Johnson pitch a CG
by Jadden Hopkins on Aug 14, 2009 6:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Mike Silva strikes again
http://nybaseballdigest.com/?p=14210
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
but duquette seems smarter then he looks
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions
I was gonna make a FanShot about that.
Best part
I still believe "replacement level" can take on many different meanings.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
this was great
Anytime we cite Bill James I still think back to his "anyone can be a closer" statement. That worked so well for the Red Sox that they needed to get Keith Foulke a year later, and, well, we know what happened.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Fanshot on why Silva is dumb
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh god
The man should just quit talking about baseball.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
wait for him to come on here
seriously, he is an idiot
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Aug 14, 2009 6:52 PM EDT up reply actions
tomorrow's article on NYBD
“Another Volley in Our Spirited, Friendly Debate on Whether Silva is a Genius or Merely Above Average”
even minor league lineups
should be able to put some runs up against Zito . . .
Hey fellas....
I’m ready for another evening of suck.
The series may be the final nail in the coffin.
WHAT?!
That nail was pounded during the D-backs series at Shitti …
by RetireNumber17 on Aug 14, 2009 6:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Why is SNY even showing the Mets playoffs chances
We’re done, no need to waste the standings graphic
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
it's simple
if we can rifle off twenty straight wins we’ll be back in contention
I'd like to think so, but I'd also like to believe in the Easter bunny.
by RetireNumber17 on Aug 14, 2009 6:57 PM EDT up reply actions
only if
our injured players figure out ways to stop re-injuring themselves and get back on the field. But honestly, it’s probably not worth it at this point
At this point, I'd rather lose 20 straight and secure our #1 draft
Though the Nats and the Royals need to win at some point
Robert Carson already got two Ks in the first inning
Bring him up!
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
Well, going against crappy Zito gives us as good a chance as any to win tonight
I’m so glad we never signed this guy.
Worst contract in the game today.
veron wells' is pretty bad
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
apparently
someone lobby for a turn-of-the-century Giants-esque throwback.
I think they’re kind of neat, myself.
that changeup
needs a lot of work. not enough difference in velocity
Swagalicious
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
Angel!
Why don’t we get Scotties coming through here asking why sabermetrics fans hate Angel Pagan? If he keeps this up, will we start seeing them soon?
I personally liked scotty
Sure i wasn’t here for that argument, I hadn’t signed up yet, but I read it like 3 times and laughed every time.
“I’m talking about RISP not OPS.” “How did you get that number? Did you add AVG and SLG?”
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
also, he was a "professional statistician"
By which he apparently meant “circus clown” or “village idiot.”
Yes, Scotty himself was the best of the bunch, as far as entertainment value.
I like arguing so really anybody like scotty amuses me
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
The Black Unis are an Abomination ...
… as are the “snow whites” and the pinstripes with black drop shadows. The Mets could take the field nude with orange and blue ribbons wrapped around their wangs and look more professional than they do with any of their current uniforms.
Ditch the black, return to orange and blue.
by RetireNumber17 on Aug 14, 2009 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm with you on most of this
but what’s so wrong with the home whites? In general I think the Mets fuck up whenever they try to get too fancy or adorned, so I’m in favor of keeping things as clean and simple as possible.
It's the black.
If they’d get rid of it, the snow whites and the pinstripes would be ok. I do like the cream color; it would look good with the pinstripes.
by RetireNumber17 on Aug 14, 2009 8:23 PM EDT up reply actions
then we're on the same page.
The black needs to go, completely. Lame ’90s attempt to look cool and sell more merch.
It's 20 rows deep in Yankee stadium
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
true story
anyone notice Johnny Damon’s OPS is over .150 pts higher at home
you're probably right, but
let’s give props to the Wilpons who built a stadium to honor another team, and made the dimensions of said stadium such that their best hitter would find himself castrated.
finding oneself castrated
would be a hell of a lot more jarring than waking up with your prize stallion’s head in your bed.
by keepcoolbutcare on Aug 14, 2009 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions
Well two things
First, CitiField is gorgeous so I won’t complain, and Wright is just having a down year. I don’t think Wright is now forever a 10-15 home run guy. Yes the dimensions are big and should be brought in just a bit, but Wright will be find.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
seriously, WTF is up with this "another team" bullshit?
Like the Mets weren’t created to continue the legacy of the Brooklyn Dodgers and the New York Giants? There are whole generations of fans for whom the Mets are the new Brooklyn Dodgers. Where did you get the idea they were different teams?
then "most people" are not true New York baseball fans
They’re Johnnies-come-lately or bandwagon-jumpers.
Gil Hodes was a Dodger
Is there a Gil Hodges bowling alley in LA didn’t think so.
Sriously though, I don’t give a fuck about them neither. I’m 19, I’m a Mets fan and there should be more Mets stuff in CIti, but I get the remembrance of Dodgers and Giants
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
To be fair, I wasn't alive during the Dodgers and Giants era.
My father was a Dodgers fan until they moved, and he was a Mets fan, so I became one too. But honestly, I just care about the Mets. And I’m sorta with fxcarden here.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
And to further this
People say Jackie Robinson was a Dodger, true, but he played in New York. New York fans appreciated him, rooted for him, or hated him and rooted against him because they were racist scum, not LA fans.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
true day
Pretty much everyone I know who rooted for Robinson when he played is now a Mets fan, not a Los Angeles Dodger fan.
and by "day" I mean "dat"
and by “dat” I mean “that” but in a hipper dialect
look, Ihave no problem with the rotunda, as long as it is balanced by some Mets stuff
elsewhere in the park.
It took until freaking August for the Wilpons to even acknowledge their own team.
The generations anonymous speaks of are mostly dead.
All I ask is for balance.
the uniforms
and I’m talking about the real Mets uniforms, not the pajamas they’re wearing today, are a combo of the Dodgers and Giants
mostly dead? nonsense.
They’re just over 18. Everyone I’ve seen complaining about this alleged failure to honor the Mets rather than their ancestor teams is a teenager.
Huh?
What year did the Dodgers leave town? Anyone who remembers the Dodgers would have to be 60+ years old.
you didn't read your own post
you said there are generations for whom the Mets are the new Brooklyn Dodgers. that implies those people actually saw the Brooklyn Dodgers, which makes them older than a teenager.
I’m 52 myself, and I like I said, I respect the origins of the blue and orange, but I am a Mets fan before anything else.
okay, I guess I was wrong about the teenager thing, then!
I just honestly don’t understand this whole line of thinking. The Mets’ history is the Brooklyn Dodgers.
but not
the 1905 Giants, which brings us back to how much these uniforms suck
I still think they're one of the nicer alternate uniforms of the last decade
Check that out. They even make Angel Pagan look like a ballplayer.
yes, and it should be acknowledge, but only up to a point.
the Mets have history too. most of it bad, but history nonetheless.
I like the 86 Mets more than the Dodgers.
So, pretty much the opposite of the Wilpons.
Hey did you guys read this on 3dot ?.
The Mets are completely exasperated with Reyes, who has enough problems in general (petulance, not keeping his head in the game) and can’t stay healthy. It’s inexcusable for a player to go down with a hamstring injury May 20 and still be out of the lineup, but that’s the case with Reyes, and the Mets aren’t sure if he’ll play at all this year. This is a likeable, dynamic shortstop who can light up stadiums and be a true difference-maker when he’s on his game. He signed a four-year deal in August of 2006, but as far as the Mets are concerned, the expiration date has already arrived . . .
Cerrone posted a link to this today.
"inexcusable"
How dare he still be injured? The sheer hubris of his muscles and ligaments!
2004
The only catch is that Reyes had a similar issue in 2004. Didn’t Delgado have to go to Florida and drag Reyes back from “rehab”?
if Omir has one arm left
Jerry will still keep him in
I think there’s a good chance, actually, that he appears in with the call-ups, regardless of what our current catcher situation is like. He needs to be put on the 40 man roster anyway.
by TheBigStapler on Aug 14, 2009 7:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t think we need to put him on the 40-man. I’d rather not waste a spot, and who would commit to a AA catcher anyway?
-Omar Minaya
How awesome would a Flores Thole platoon be at catcher?
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
it's a relief
to see an opposing pitcher not burn us
Let's see
how Bobby holds up for his second time through the line-up . . .
What does Brian Sabean have against walks
and batters who like to take a pitch or two?
I’m stunned he didn’t try to trade for Frenchy, whose free swinging ways would fit right in with the rest of that line-up.
are they dead last in walks and OBP?
by keepcoolbutcare on Aug 14, 2009 7:57 PM EDT reply actions
Obviously Mike Silva is getting to me
I heard the White Castle commercial on WFAN pitching “saver-sized soft drinks” and thought they said “saber-size,” and wondered how statistics were taking over even the food-related parts of baseball.
Animated GIF flat swing FTW!
…also some fine, fine fielding by Rowand there.
The Giants lineup is freakin horrible
They don’t have one 100RBI guy on the roster.
Take them out of the West and put them in the NL East or NL Central and I doubt they manage and over .500 record.
Sandoval actually seems to be pretty good, and RBI are kinda meaningless
But yeah. Albert Pujols would have trouble getting to 100 ribbies on that team.
And June?
That was his best month.
He’s only had one good month all season.
And August ain’t over yet.
His OBP hasn’t been that great either.
what are you saying?
Are we playing argue-the-moving-target again? An 850-900 OPS is pretty damn good for a young 3B, and nothing like “terrible since after the ASB.”
Oh yeas it is
and if this was Francoeur you’d be out to murder him.
Look at his OBP.
April .350
May .350
June .459
July .327
He’s had one good month. If he can’t get it done with the bat he is completely useless. He can barely draw a walk to save his life and is slow as shit on the basepaths.
his OBP for his first year in the majors has been .373
Francoeur is hardly an appropriate comparison
Again, based on one good month.
As I said, if this were Jeff Francoeur you’d be out to kill him.
His best month in terms of walks was also in the month of June 13 BB
The rest of the season he’s gotten five a month.
Sandoval has the benefit of playing in the NL West.
why does it matter that he had one really good month?
they all count, and the aggregate is .373. that’s very good. and his SLG is .533 which is also very good. if Francoeur were putting up those numbers that would be awesome but his aren’t even close.
Because he's not doing that through out the course of the season
He had a phenomenal month of June. I’m not taking that away from him.
my point is that since the ASB has has not been that good.
Outside of June, would you want the guy hitting third in your lineup avergaing about 5 BB a month?
His projection is a guy who will be more known for his glove than for his bat. He’s not going to be able to keep these numbers up for his career and they are starting to level out to his prejune level.
His OPS is about an .850 if you exclude June. In statistics there is something called an outlier. For Sandoval his June OPS and OBP is the outlier.
he had a bad OBP month in July, yes
this month he’s been better.
this isn’t gymnastics. you don’t throw out the high score and the low score. they all count. by that logic his OPS is .975 if you exclude April, and his OBP is .395 if you exclude July. that’s not how it works though.
His month of June is a deviation from his norm
In statistics, an outlier is an observation that is numerically distant from the rest of the data.
I understand the concept
and if we were talking about assessing his future performance, then this might be relevant. but that’s not what we’re talking about.
His future projection is a guy known more for his glove than for his bat
He’ll probably wind up about .290-.310 hitter.
Also keep in mind that playing in the NL East there are much tougher teams to face in interleague play against the AL East.
I don’t think his numbers are that good playing out here. I’d rather deal with San Diego and Arizona 36 times a year and the AL West than what we have to face.
I do think Sandoval is going to be a good player in the future. I just don’t think his numbers including the month of June are really what we are looking at.
FanGraphs has him at 3.4 WAR so far this year
Guess who that would tie him with for best on the Mets?
WTF is Tatis doing playing first base?
And where is Murphy?
Lefty pitching
so Im assuming that the smart competent manager would sit Murphy due to Zito being a lefty. Jerry probably forgot that Murphy was in the stadium tonite and just filled the lineup card without Murphy on it
This is hilarious...NY Times, April 2004
“The Mets are desperate to get Reyes on the field as soon as possible, partly because they want to show off their prized double-play combination, which also includes shortstop Kazuo Matsui. Throughout spring training, Reyes and Matsui were billed as the fresh faces of the Mets, but they have not played a game together.”
Why even bother sacing there?
Terrible.
Why give up an out like that at this point of the game WHEN YOU ARE UP 2 RUNS!!!!!
Neither is Pagan
I say swing away.
It’s early in the game and I doubt they have better luck with Pagan.
Dare I say
quality start? Thats a hell of a game for a kid making only his second big league start….now please dont give up a two run bomb
Parnell has just become the Mets #2 starter
Otherwise known as the #5 starter on a normal MLB team.
6 scoreless from Parnell
thats pretty good for a spot start
by aparkermarshall on Aug 14, 2009 8:40 PM EDT reply actions
I guess I'm the only one, then.
I’ll enjoy them while they last.
yeah, I suppose
I don’t think I could afford a game-worn jockstrap from one of those charity auctions, though.
Also, I don’t love ’em that much.
I find them interesting
better than the horrible black uniforms
by aparkermarshall on Aug 14, 2009 8:43 PM EDT up reply actions
It might have worked with Wright's double
by aparkermarshall on Aug 14, 2009 8:44 PM EDT up reply actions
Wow
he really made Miller work didnt he
by aparkermarshall on Aug 14, 2009 8:50 PM EDT reply actions
hahaha...WTF was that??
Feliciano cut off the DP ball?
In all seriousness...
Why isn’t there some method or stat that measures a giant fielding fuck up like that?
I know “you can’t assume the DP”…But jesus, that’s a perfect example of horrible fielding.
it's so subjective though
I mean, who made the bad play there? was it the return throw? did Feliciano make a bad play to cut that ball off, or was it a good one because Murphy might not have caught it? would Murphy have caught it?
like I said, subjective.
haha...I know, I was just joking.
At least you had a better week than that guy.
Are you his lawyer or something?
Cause it’s basically impossible to defend him now, right?
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
Good thing the Wilpons didn't grow up in Philadelphia...
The Mets would have the Philly Phanatic on their sleeve.
Did Keith just say to wait to see where the Mets are after the road trip
to see if its time to put injured guys on the DL? What is he on?
Sometimes the guys in the booth have to play the role of homers
I’m sure he could cut this team up all day in the booth.
They do have to think about ratings.
Yikes
I just looked up Parnell’s minor league numbers. They are pretty horrible.
Yeah you're right
I’m happy for him, and hope he ends up being a good major league starter. I was just surprised at his minor league career.
Oh, and “There is more to life than numbers”??? Not on this site! ;-)
I right there with ya my friend!!!!!
Although I’m probably gonna get killed for this.
I’d love to see an NLCS of Florida VS Philly.
Florida wins and sends those cheezeheads packing.
+10000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
as long as Victorino makes the last out.
What a Tremendous performance by Bobby Parnell
If this is a preview of what’s to come from this young man in the Majors, we might have found ourselves a silver lining in this dismal season from hell.
First Francoeur(and his entertainment value as far as this blog goes) who got yet another RBI hit today(yawn), and now Parnell who is just dealing.
A Great Start for this weekend.
LET’S GO METS!!
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