Jeff Francoeur's Intangibles
Since the day Jeff Francoeur arrived from Atlanta, there has been a deluge of praise for his positive intangible qualities. Believe it or not, I think this emphasis on intangibles is a disservice to Francoeur, who has been a reasonably productive hitter for the Mets since being acquired. A .350 wOBA is very good for him, even if it is fueled by an unsustainably high .355 BABIP. Instead of focusing mostly on his on-field performance (which has a tangible effect on winning ballgames) the intangibles crowd has sung the praises of everything from his smile to his clothing choices to his water cooler destruction. A few recent examples:
Though not renowned for his sense of style, Jeff Francoeur is mindful of how he dresses. He plans his wardrobe; i.e., which jeans go best with which T-shirt, and do his kicks match the ensemble. (James note: uhh, what?) What the Mets like so much is that Francoeur, as much as any player on their roster since Paul Lo Duca, raises the composite blood pressure, too. He not only cares, he shows that he does and his manner rubs off. "If you were to talk intangibles," Jerry Manuel said, "he'd rate way off the charts."
He’s as gritty and as driven as they come, and as Jerry Manuel said "This kid hates to lose." After making the final out in Friday nights loss, he reacted by smashing a dugout cooler to pieces in a show of rage. Francoeur is a warrior that wants to play every inning of every game, and even the torn ligaments in his thumb won’t keep him out of the lineup. The best part is that at 25 years old, the best is yet to come. We have a lot of work to do this off season, but signing Francoeur to a multi year deal is definitely a huge first step.
But whats been more important is the intangibles that he's brought to the table, he seemed to immediately become a main clubhouse figure and team leader. He brings a hard nosed, passion to the team that has been missing for years. Playing through a thumb injury in meaningless games because he wants to. Two teams of equal or relatively equal talent, generally; over the course of a season the team with the better intangibles end up having the better head-to-head records. In 2007-2008 the Mets were an immensely talented team that somehow couldn't find a way to win just one more game, while Hadley [sic] Ramirez single handily [sic] willed his team to win the last game of the season two years in a row to knock us out of the playoffs.
Regarding the Mets Fever piece, "Hadley" Ramirez didn't even play in the last game of the season in 2008. I suppose his will from the bench was great enough to "single-handily" make his team win. But that same will wasn't strong enough to make his team win more games than the Mets in 2007 or 2008.
Compare the Mets' record, pre Francoeur trade and post Francoeur trade:
Pre: 40-45 (.471 Win %)
Post: 25-40 (.385 Win %)
This is a large drop-off. The Braves' winning % has gone from .488 pre-trade to .597 post-trade. Regular readers know that pointing to this with any sort of relevance would only be done tongue-in-cheek. Yet if the Mets' record had indeed improved since the trade, there would probably be daily posts about it in the Mets blogosphere. A legitimate question arises for those praising Francoeur: if his intangibles are so valuable, how can one explain the significant decline in the Mets' play after his acquisition? I present a brief fictional conversation that might take place on this topic, between myself and anonymous intangibles lover. Let's call intangibles lover "Beau".
James: So you're a fan of Francoeur's intangibles. Why has the Mets' performance declined since his arrival? Shouldn't his presence raise his teammates' level of play?
Beau: That's not a fair question. Johan, David, Jose, both Carlos's and a bunch of other good players have missed a lot of time in the 2nd half.
James: So what you're saying is that good players are essential to field a winning team? And intangibles aren't enough to overcome having bad players?
Beau: Uh, uh, well, Paul O'Neill used to bash water coolers and look at how many World Series....
Tangible talent trumps intangible grission and it's not particularly close. This isn't to deny the existence of intangibles in sports. It's been said before, but if given the choice between 2 identical players, and 1 is a good clubhouse guy and the other a bad one, it makes sense to take the good guy. However, it's an overrated trait and not reason enough to seek a player's services.
Talk about Francoeur's statistics. Talk about his on-field performance (and the sites listed above generally do, to varying degrees). When doing so, don't completely ignore the 2500+ major league plate appearances he had before coming to Flushing. But please stop pretending intangibles are a significant consideration when deciding what to do with Francoeur this offseason. Character counts, but since we can't sufficiently evaluate it objectively let's stick to what we can evaluate. Leave the largely irrelevant intangibles topic for talk radio, the lowest common denominator of baseball discourse. (Next up on the talk radio docket, a discussion about how David Wright and Jose Reyes aren't "winning ballplayers"!)
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39 comments
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Comments
we all know what's coming
seriously.
it’s time to find another team to root for. it’s only getting worse from here.
francoeur is getting signed for the next 3 years and they’re trading fernando for david aardsma
by firejerrymanuel on Sep 20, 2009 6:32 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
well, because he dresses well and throws water coolers
lets re-sign him.
by EtSuKe on Sep 20, 2009 6:38 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
of course
that’s what creates a championship team
seriously whats with all this Francoeur shit. Do you guys actually like him. extension…..seriously?
by dulciusEXasperis on Sep 20, 2009 7:06 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
This is the type of praise that makes me HATE baseball players.
Jeff Francoeur gets lauded for sucking and being white and gritty, while Reyes gets crucified for being injured. The fact that people don’t understand just how useless he is pisses me off. If he’s in right field next year, we have no shot.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Sep 20, 2009 6:42 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Here's a good comment I saw on Metsblog
“Tidewater says:
September 20, 2009 at 8:35 am
Francoeur is playing because he is gritty, Matt. Your own blog says so just two posts down. And grittiness is what so many Mets fans have clamored for. If he goes to the bench or the operating room now, he may have is SHGP membership revoked (Society of Honorable Gritty Players) and then he’d just be a guy who swings at everything. And if his membership is revoked, who’s left. Cora’s no longer gritty because he took that sissy surgery way out. Murphy’s no longer gritty because he makes errors that cost us games and is no longer hitting .320, like all us gritty fans expected him to do after his small sample size last year.
Francoeur is the last gritty player we have, Matt. Please don’t urge him to stop playing. Who cares if he further hurts himself? Isn’t getting and playing hurt the cornerstone of the gritty player pledge?"
The sad thing in, someone missed the sarcasm and thought this was praise of Frenchy.
by Dapoil on Sep 20, 2009 7:03 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
i didnt realize marty noble compared francoeur favorable to paul lo duca
i mean, if thats the case then why doesnt omar just sign this guy to a million effing years? in fact, omar should just clone paul lo effing duca and get a million of that em effer on the team. or he should save himself a bunch of work and hand the team over to a gee dee 8 year old and let him run the effing team.
i actually think noble is a decent writer but whenever he actually analyzes baseball or discusses GMs moves he reveals himself as either pandering to the less intelligent mets fans, or just is an idiot himself. i mean come on, paul lo duca? effing jagov.
Lets hope that when gut check time comes again the Mets will pass it with flying colors.
by kendynamo on Sep 20, 2009 7:12 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
James, let me make sure I don't misunderstand what you are saying..
" Compare the Mets’ record, pre Francoeur trade and post Francoeur trade:
Pre: 40-45 (.471 Win %)
Post: 25-40 (.385 Win %) "
You are not attributing this to Francoeur alone, are you ?. That doesn’t seem fair.
Since July 10th, when he was traded to the Mets, we lost (in no particular order):
Johan
Sheffield
F!
Cora
Nieve
Niese
Ollie (ok, maybe he doesn’t count)
Wright for almost 3 weeks
I’m sure that has something to do with the 25-40 record. My point is, when Francoeur came aboard, there was still some hope. The level of suck over the last 65 games has had a lot more to do with the rest of the team than with Francoeur himself.
No ?.
by fxcarden on Sep 20, 2009 7:30 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
We also lost Castillo for almost a week after he fell down the steps.
and speaking of that day…..BB-Rod blew the save and Green lost the game.
by fxcarden on Sep 20, 2009 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
um
Regular readers know that pointing to this with any sort of relevance would only be done tongue-in-cheek.
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Sep 20, 2009 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The point is that talented players were lost, and grit is overrated compared to talent.
He even lists the best of those players above while making this point.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 20, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Francouer's been a Met for 65 games already?
that’s just depressing.
by cjmulrain on Sep 20, 2009 7:40 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
65 games I have not watched.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Sep 20, 2009 8:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
really?
for all the posting you do on this blog… That is incredibly disappointing.
by gbaked on Sep 21, 2009 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I watch a few innings here and there.
But I can’t bring myself to actually watch a full game.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Sep 21, 2009 5:43 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Mets should trade spare parts for Milton Bradley and let the Cubs pay most of his contract.
He should be well rested for next season considering his season-ending suspension.
"Of course Kolby Rasmus was going deep! That’s what Kolby Rasmus does! You don’t give Kolby Rasmus second chances!" -Kolby Rasmus
by hazel on Sep 20, 2009 7:43 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Are the Cubs dumber than us?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Sep 20, 2009 8:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
i agree
but what are the chances omar does that?
by EtSuKe on Sep 20, 2009 9:27 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bradley is a lunatic.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
by The Glider on Sep 20, 2009 9:57 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
God, the comments at Metsmerized is worse than Metsblog
They all believe in grit
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Sep 20, 2009 8:22 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
"are" worse than Metsblog
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
by The Glider on Sep 20, 2009 9:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
grammar fail
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Sep 21, 2009 6:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
BTW, ....
Xavier22 on metsblog is a pretty good poster.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
by The Glider on Sep 20, 2009 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
great for him.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Sep 20, 2009 10:12 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
The Glider likes Jeff Franceour
He’s played well for us though I, like a lot of others here, would like to see him start drawing an occasional walk or two. I’m on board for bringing him aboard.
On another note, I see that Carlos Zambrano is pitching for the Cubs tonight on the ESPN Sunday night game. His fast ball is being clocked at only 91 mph. According to the broadcast crew, Zambrano admitted that he didn’t come into this season in-shape because he lazy (because he got that humungus contract!). So, Carlos says he’s going to work hard during the off-season, blah, blah, blah.
The point I’m trying to get to is that there are rumors of the Mets being interested in Zambrano, if the Cubbies are looking to sell (because they’re looking to shave payroll).
Would anybody here do a Pelfrey (and filler) for Zambrano deal?
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
by The Glider on Sep 20, 2009 9:49 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Fuck no
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Sep 21, 2009 6:26 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Wow
Can you imagine the backlash if Reyes smashed a water cooler? “Just a whiny, immature kid throwing a tantrum” etc. Ridiculous.
by gogomets on Sep 21, 2009 12:36 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
this is probably the best Reyes hypothetical yet
King of the bling come to lay down the evidence//Not George Bush, L-Millz be da president
by Sam Page on Sep 21, 2009 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
If Reyes ran into a burning building
and saved the lives of several children, and babies, and then collapsed from exhaustion and too much smoke inhalation, but left one of the families cats behind, the media would say how he has no heart and didn’t want it enough or otherwise he would have saved the cat’s life. But if Paul O’Neil, after a strikeout, had went to an apartment building and burned it down, killing dozens, people would say he has passion and that the arson was a literal expression of the fire he has inside of him, a burning desire to win.
"We must win and we must know how to win rather than win because we have statistical people."
by Evan_S on Sep 21, 2009 1:53 AM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Rec'd for
arson was a literal expression of the fire he has inside of him, a burning desire to win.
by TheBigStapler on Sep 21, 2009 10:07 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
O'Neil was praised
because it showed that he cared sooooooooooo much. Reyes doesn’t care about baseball and winning, so if he would do that it would have to be because of another reason, like immaturity.
by Mount17 on Sep 21, 2009 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
why the hell does the word "Intangibles" seem like a good thing?
I’m looking at the definition of word and this is what I get.
intangible |inˈtanjəbəl|
adjective
unable to be touched or grasped; not having physical presence : my companions do not care about cyberspace or anything else so intangible.
• difficult or impossible to define or understand; vague and abstract : the rose symbolized something intangible about their relationship.
• (of an asset or benefit) not constituting or represented by a physical object and of a value not precisely measurable : intangible business property like trademarks and patents.
via Dictionary Version 2.0.2 (51.4) – Apple Inc., Mac OS X Version 10.5.8
You can add Mr. Intangibles in Jeff Francoeur’s nicknames of arsenal.
by nelsonc on Sep 21, 2009 2:24 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
How about this one
not having physical presence
So, if Francoeur has intangibles, does he not have physical presence?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Sep 21, 2009 6:29 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
that would explain his K rate.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf"
-Tug McGraw
by squid92 on Sep 21, 2009 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs

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