Mets, Jeff Francoeur Agree On $5 million Contract For 2010
by Eric Simon on Jan 19, 2010 10:23 AM EST
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PrintPer Jon Heyman, the Mets and Jeff Francoeur have settled on "$5 million" as the ridiculous sum of money the rightfielder will 'earn' in 2010.
This and this should suffice in lieu of any commentary I might have otherwise added to this announcement.
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I think its time for Omar to leave.
Fire him already.
by aparkermarshall on Jan 19, 2010 10:29 AM EST reply actions
You know what though
Jeff Wilpon would have ordered Omar’s replacement to do the same thing. I remember him singing paeans in Francouer’s honor when he was last on WFAN at the end of the season.
He also said something to the effect that he wished he had a few more Jeff Francouers on the team. My memory might have failed me on the quote, but the point is he loves him some Francouer.
by Coolpapabell on Jan 19, 2010 11:24 AM EST up reply actions
That's right
This team is in for some long term pain that cannot be easily solved unless they sell the team. The owner has no idea how to properly manage the team. I guess I should hold on to 86 because I dont think this team will one in my lifetime.
by aparkermarshall on Jan 19, 2010 11:44 AM EST up reply actions
LOL
friggin awesome.
but if they’re willing to pay him 5 million this season is there any chance they won’t be signing him to an at least semi-longterm extension?
y’know something like 4/36
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Yes, I suppose we should be
grateful for small mercies. A $5m/1yr deal at least means there’s no crippling extension for a while.
Time to revise some of those Omir/Wincoeur races
Someone with editing skills should start making pictures of the Omar/Dayton Moore race to the bottom.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 19, 2010 10:50 AM EST reply actions
Over and over and over...It's making me dizzy
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 1:53 PM EST up reply actions
was this
before or after Frenchy hurt his thumb?
Well
Heyman’s tweet doesn’t say that he signed with the Mets. We can hold out hope that he signed with somebody else. Heck, he didn’t even mention his first name. Maybe it’s some other Francoeur we haven’t heard of!
You don't cheer for the Mets. You drink for the Mets.
LOL MAYBE HE SIGNED WITH THA NORTH POLE!?!?
http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/
by PWHjort on Jan 19, 2010 11:45 AM EST up reply actions 1 recs
5 mil?
we could have bought so much stuff for what we’ve burned on frenchy and cora. This makes me sad, although im glad it didn’t have a 10 year vesting option if Frenchy flies Delta airlines in the next year.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 11:41 AM EST reply actions 2 recs
no doubt
Cora should of been cut lose. He’s a career backup with no upside and declining D on the wrong side of 30.
Francouer is none of those things.
His D is declining
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Well I think he has a lot of upside
unfortunately it comes coupled with a crapton of downside.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
I would just like to point out that Ryan Church will be making $1.5 mil this year.
And Blastings Thrilledge won’t be making much more than league minimum. But noooo, let’s pay $5 mil for the worst guy.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
I don't think this is so heinous.
He probably would’ve gotten more had it gone to arb. He can still be non-tendered after next year. We are albatrossless here…
Oh, the butcher and the baker and the people on the street: wheredotheygo?!?!?
I don't know what this year's arbitration results are going to look like
but I hope that’s not true.
His seasons are hit or miss (kinda like his batting style) so the hi-lo arbitration bidding is a problem to estimate. Do you value him like a 3.5 WAR player (high), a <0 WAR player (low), the average of those two (still pretty high), or a 1.5 WAR player (medium)?
I think his agent would bid like 4-4.5M and the Mets agent should bid 3.5M. If his agent bid any higher, I think it would be a wasted bid. He’s two years removed from a “good” season and a big fraction of those were due to high BABIP.
He got 3.5 last year didnt he?
so at worse he was going to improve on that.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Plus arbitration is based on outdated stats
like rbis, etc, it’s the same reason type a/b status is so ridiculous.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Exactly!
The FO might have saved at least half-a-mil with this move.
Oh, the butcher and the baker and the people on the street: wheredotheygo?!?!?
They could have saved 5
by just nontendering him, though I suppose with Beltran out they didn’t really have a choice at this point, not that I think it would have made a difference to them.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
I don't think
non-tendering him ever entered anyone’s mind in the FO. “Whatta gritty guy & lookit all those ribbies he gave us last year. Keepin’ this guy is a no-brainuh…”
Oh, the butcher and the baker and the people on the street: wheredotheygo?!?!?
actually
that was the original intention. if he didn’t perform as a Met, he would of been non-tendered. But lo and behold, he hit and played through a thumb injury that pretty much prevents you from being able to grip the bat with any real force with that hand.
So that explains the increase in production – he wasn’t able to hit like he normally does due to injury, thus getting different results.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
except
he was hitting much better prior to ripping the ligament that stabilzes the thumb while making a fantastic reaching across the body robbery of Bruntletts diving liner. It was so good the umpires missed it at first.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/boxscore?gid=290823121&page=plays
That hit might of been straight up the middle (and off Lidge’s head, considering how hard Francoeur hit it with one hand) if he had two healthy hands at that point. Still, Bruntlett got revenge on Francoeur, twice.
Actually, I remember reading at the time
That the more he swung, the more it would hurt, so it may well have put a brake on his free-swinging tendencies.
So one of us just needs to find him
and break his thumb
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Actually no
he swung just as often with us =(
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Well,
arb figures tend to run 40-60-80% of what the player would have received on the open market as a FA. Francouer, overall (which is what the arbitrator would have looked at) had very weak numbers for a RFer. He wouldn’t have sniffed $5m had the Mets gone through the process.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 4:11 PM EST up reply actions
I wonder if the contract includes incentives
Like, $1 million for every game he wears his Turkey Underwear to.
http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/
You guys think hell play like he did with the Mets last year?
by Jordan Tuwiner on Jan 19, 2010 12:11 PM EST reply actions
No
"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green
by Stephen Schmidt on Jan 19, 2010 12:13 PM EST up reply actions
why could he not reproduce that line
he had 2 better lines before …. until Atl tinker with his swing
because if theres one thing we know
its that Hojo knows how to fix somebodies swing.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
Trying to get a guy to not swing at balls 2 feet off the plate isn’t really tinkering with his swing.
Jeff adding 20-25 pounds of muscle to increase his power tinkers with his swing. Atlanta had nothing to do with his downfall – it was all Jeffy.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
didnt he shed most of that weight though?
his defensive numbers had rebounded, but like someone else said half a season of uzr data is really anything to go on.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
He tried to lose that weight, but judging from the recent pictures of him, he wasn’t very successful in that endeavor.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 5:08 PM EST up reply actions
I don't really know what he looked like before
but he’s listed at 220 again now.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
He'll play like hell, alright...
Oh, the butcher and the baker and the people on the street: wheredotheygo?!?!?
not a chance
every ball he hit found the ground somehow, doubt he gets that lucky again. although his walk totals will probably stay pretty constant
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 12:15 PM EST up reply actions
Nice of you to call it a "walk total"
by TheBigStapler on Jan 19, 2010 12:22 PM EST up reply actions
8 is a total...
"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green
by Stephen Schmidt on Jan 19, 2010 1:26 PM EST up reply actions
BABIP was .311
Wright had a BABIP of .350
This BABIP is lower than his career average and much lower then prior to when Atlanta tinker with his swing
He is also a good line drive hitter, which he could not do as much with an injured thrumb last year
francoeur hits 20% line drives,and has never been above 20.7%
as opposed to Wrights which has been above 25% all but 2 seasons.. furthermore, Frenchy has a career O-swing% of about 35% as opposed to 20% for wright. This means he’s going to have more weak contact on pitches he has to reach for or gets jammed on. you would expect Wright to have a high BABIP compared to Francoeur based on these numbers and that is in fact the case. Francoeurs skillset doesn’t lend itself well to maintaining an elevated BABIP.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 4:29 PM EST up reply actions
His BABIP with the Mets was .343
He’s not keeping that up. And if he has a BABIP of .311 all season, he’ll be a replacement level hitter, like he was last season
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
It's a waste of money, but at least it's only a one year waste of money...
"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green
by Stephen Schmidt on Jan 19, 2010 12:14 PM EST reply actions
He was due a raise regardless because of the arbitration rules.
If they went to arbitration he may have been rewarded more than $5 mil. Or he would’ve been rewarded 4.5 mil. Either way he was going to make more than last year. It’s not like the Mets were gonna release him.
Please correct me if I’m wrong on the rules, but I don’t think I am.
I thought the agent and the team each submit a bid, then they get to argue about which one is more appropriate. Time of service would only be a factor in helping to generate a initial bid amount, not something the arbitrator takes into account as a separate modifier.
If Frenchy’s agent bid $5M, the team rep would just say “look, this guy has sucked for two years running, he strikes out all the time, and he’s a butcher in the field.” Just because he’s been in the league doesn’t mean he should automatically get a raise.
Although I don’t know if there is some kind of guidance on how the agent and team generate their bids.
There's no precedent for a case like this
Players this bad don’t make it this far in the arbitration process, they’re non tendered by this point. Francoeur is a unique case. He basically peaked at his age 23 season and wasn’t able to sustain it due to a combination of terrible plate discipline and a complete evaporation of his athleticism.
He was somewhat productive in his pre-arb years until that final one and he’s been completely useless since.
There’s zero precedent for a worthless player like this getting this much money in arbitration. We really have no idea how much of a raise he’d get in arb, but I’d like to think it’s less than the past two enablers have handed him.
http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/
the Mets are pioneers
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
He could have taken up to a 20% pay cut via the CBA rules.
He was awarded 3.5 million after 2008, and he did have a better season in 2009, so he likely would have gotten around 5 mill anyway.
"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green
by Stephen Schmidt on Jan 19, 2010 1:27 PM EST up reply actions
I thought there is a rule that the player must receive a figure higher than the previous season, if that player is still arbitration eligible, which means less than 6 seasons of service time.
No.
A player can’t receive less than 80 per cent of his last year’s salary if he’s tendered a contract as an arbitration eligible player.
http://www.capitolavenueclub.com/
Are you sure?
I thought that was just for FA eligible players who are offered arbitration, not 0-5 year players.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
I think its the other way around
Could be wrong though
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jan 19, 2010 1:00 PM EST up reply actions
PWJ is correct...at least thats how I'm reading the CBA.
"We're just as bad as the old Mets, but this time nobody's laughing"
-Dallas Green
by Stephen Schmidt on Jan 19, 2010 1:29 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah thats what I thought
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jan 19, 2010 5:01 PM EST up reply actions
So I'll assume he originally acceptd a $2.5 million offer and then the Mets doubled it?
At least there isn’t a $20 million vesting option.
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
So hypothetically if the mets do offer him a 3-4 year extension
what would that say about how they view F-mart? Since that would block both corners, and it seems doubtful that he’d stick in cf.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
unless he vastly overperforms this year
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 1:11 PM EST up reply actions
more reason to hope he hits .210
This season is already a lost cause, so I’m willing to sacrifice it for the greater good, i.e. getting rid of Frenchy and letting Fernando play RF in 2011.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 2:04 PM EST up reply actions
yeah its a sticky situation
I don’t cheer against Mets players, but I know it’s in our best interest for him to not do well in the long run. Maybe he’ll just have a monster season and then retire? or maybe he’ll learn how to walk magically.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
It could just mean they wanted to avoid the arbitration process
for w/e reason, it seems unlikely they he would have gotten much more than this in arbitration.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
You're assuming that the Mets have an idea that Fern can't play CF?
Hmm…
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah I'm unsure of the mets ideas on that
it seems most reports say he’s destined for corners, and prior to this season they were often reports that the mets didn’t want to sign big name corner outfielders because it would block frenchy. but i suppose with Beltrans injuries they may be thinking of him as a centerfielder now, whether he should play there though I have no idea, I don’t know anything about his defense other than his totalzone numbers, and the facts scouts don’t seem to love it.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
"block frenchy"? Please tell me that was a typo...
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 6:10 PM EST up reply actions
yeah it was supposed to be block f-mart.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
i cant get mad at this
its a 1 year deal worth close to what he will get in arb.
I am glad its not a 3 year deal.
He is a fan favorite (metsblog fans, not AA fans) so there was no way they were gonna get rid of him.
If he stinks, then hopefully they recognize this and do not resign him. Or, if all you grit haters are wrong and he plays solid (2-3 WAR) signing him to a reasonable deal would be the next step. I dont think he will improve much from last year, but you never know…
either way after how he played when he came over last year he was going to be back. This is prob best case scenario.
i don't think anyone hates grit
we just hate when crappy players get passes because they’re labeled gritty, I’d glady take Jayson Werth and his grit.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
by Gina on Jan 19, 2010 1:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
says it all
He is a fan favorite (metsblog fans, not AA fans) so there was no way they were gonna get rid of him.
You’re right, and that’s the biggest problem with the way the Mets are run. An intelligent team doesn’t care about fan uproar when it’s trying to put the best team possible out there. Was there uproar when Boston traded Nomar? Was there uproar when Oakland traded Mark Mulder? You bet, but both teams ended up doing pretty well.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 2:06 PM EST up reply actions
Well Boston retained varitek at that ridiculous price
because of him being a fan favorite.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
true
I’m not saying Theo is perfect, I’m just saying the Mets are idiots.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 2:15 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah varitek was at least a fan favorite with years of service to the team
Frenchy is a guy pawned off on us by one of our division rivals probably because we were one of the only teams dumb enough to take him.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
haha
The Braves couldn’t of know for sure if we’d retain his services or DFA’d him. The Mets weren’t just dumb in your view then, because it was the FO’s idea to trade Church for Jeff… o and they got money out of the deal… o and Francoeur played much better in the second half than Church. All and all, it was a great move by ATL’s FO.
o and the other team that was linked to Francoeur for a midseason trade last season… the Red Sox. Go figure, right? Why on earth would the Red Sox want him…. hmmmm.
There was never anything more than rumors of them possibly scouting frenchy
there was never any real proof of them having interest in him or even entering talks regarding him
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
And even saying there were rumors is generous
there was one rumor, reported by one source.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Also what does Atlanta knowing whether we'd retain him or not
have to do with anything? Why would that make any kind of difference?
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
please try and collect your thoughts in one reply next time
Wren confirmed the rumors when he refused to deny them. The unsubstantiated rumors were the people who “connected the dots” and claimed Boston was thinking of moving JD drew for him.
o and if you can’t see why ATL not knowing whether or not we’d retain him is relevant to your comment, you’re clearly not “connecting the dots”
...
wut, maybe wren didn’t confirm deny because rumors of other teams being interested in him would allow him to ask for more from any teams that actually were interested in him? Not to mention why would he deny rumors when they obviously were shopping him, the only reason there would be to deny it if they had no intentions on moving him to any team. And once again only one source ever “connected the dots”, outside of one guy from yahoo sports no one else reported the red sox having interest in him let alone actually entering talks.
And if you have an actual reason as to why it’s relevant to my comment then please enlighten me. Why would it matter whether we retained him or not if they were just trying to dump him to whoever would take him? What difference would it make what the team they dumped him too did after wards? Please connect the dots for me.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
I’ll put it to you this way: None of us over at TC were upset about the move. Also, for what it is worth, the Braves went 50-32 after trading Francoeur to you guys.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
pitching
is the main reason for that second half record. Vazquez, Hanson, Jurrens were all much better in the second half and even Derek Lowe, in an otherwise abysmal season, managed to put together 7+ quality/solid starts after July.
Couldn't the fact they jettisoned frenchy's medicore defense
have helped their pitching?
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
by all measures
UZR, +/-, Francoeur was an above average fielder in the first half for the Braves, while the Diaz/Church combo was significantly worse in the second half.
You're right
I was looking at his total for 2009 not his braves split.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Very true
I think overall, Francoeur is and will be an above average defender. He’s never going to be worth 17 runs defensively again, but he should be worth 4 or 5 runs. His bat though, that’s a whole other story.
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
unless you’re asking the question, “what kind of outfield defense did jeff francoeur provide in that half season?”
by inventor frank on Jan 20, 2010 3:06 PM EST up reply actions
UZR data needs to be averaged out over years, not weeks.
the sample sizes are too small in half a season. One or two outliers slaughters their UZR value
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 20, 2010 10:32 PM EST up reply actions
Our pitching was dominant from start to finish – with regression from Lowe in the 2nd half. That argument doesn’t hold up.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 4:13 PM EST up reply actions
condolences from a Braves fan.
Remember folks, I'm almost always wrong.
"Let Jason Heyward start the season in RF, and get the hell out of his way."
Tyreke Evans for Rookie of the Year.
Peyton Manning = Best Quarterback of all time.
At Arizona, our basketball team doesn't rebuild...we re-load.
by Scott Coleman on Jan 19, 2010 1:28 PM EST via mobile reply actions
take him back please
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
well, at least you guys traded Javier Vazquez for a spare part.
The Phillies should have the NL East wrapped up by Memorial Day, unless Florida does one of their patented come-out-of-nowhere runs.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 2:07 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
We actually made out pretty good in the Vaz deal – assuming of course, that Vizcaino pans out.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 3:26 PM EST up reply actions
OK, sure
But that kind of deal is what you’d expect from a rebuilding club, not one who won 86 games last season and still had all its significant contributors around.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 4:34 PM EST up reply actions
Well they apparently had no choice but to cut payroll
and they had a surplus of starting pitchers
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
You're right
OK, I’m just going to complain once more about Minaya letting Atlanta get Vazquez last winter while he made that awful trade for Putz.
Somehow, a chain of events unfolded that put Steve Phillips in a professional broadcast booth Sunday night so he could rip Carlos Beltran. Try to explain that in any other terms.
by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 19, 2010 4:37 PM EST up reply actions
Lol the Braves got him for like b-/c+ prospect
who was blocked anyway…meanwhile refused to offer anything more than castillo.
We can send 7 players for a reliever coming off an injury…but only willing to offer a bad contract for a starter that regularly goes 200 innings.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
lol. That is why Omar has a rep as one of the worst GMs in the game.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 5:10 PM EST up reply actions
The way most of us Bravo fans (and btw, I just want to say that I am enjoying this discussion with you guys. If I come across as trolling, I apologize.) view the situation is that the market for Lowe was pretty much non-existant – especially with the reports that the teams we were talking to wanted us to eat nearly half of his salary.
Our greatest strength was (and still is) our starting pitching. We basically had 7-8 MLB ready pitchers (counting Melden and JoJo Reyes). If Lowe could not be dealt, then dealing Vazquez – who was our 2nd most expensive pitcher and only signed for 1 more year – was the next logical step. Sure, we would have loved to have gotten Swisher in return, but that is just unreasonable. Instead, we got a serviceable OFer (better than FYF), a potentially really good lefty reliever and one of the top pitching prospects in the game, all while saving $8M which enabled us to then sign Hinske and Glaus and still have some money in reserve at the deadline in case something happens.
It was a great long-term decision, even though I was really hoping we could extend Vaz for about 3 years.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 5:14 PM EST up reply actions
What does FYF stand for?
F*** you Francoeur?
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
Yes.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 19, 2010 5:35 PM EST up reply actions
That or “Francoeur You Freak” (when he did something good.)
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 5:50 PM EST up reply actions
Dang. I used to love stories like this. Now, I just kinda feel sorry for you guys.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 1:48 PM EST reply actions
Hey,
maybe the Braves will win the division again, and play in front of a half empty stadium during their first round exit.
Stellar franchise.
Trump Card Time: Omar Minaya is your GM. You lose.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 7:59 PM EST up reply actions
Bastard.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 8:09 PM EST up reply actions
My hand was forced.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 8:32 PM EST up reply actions
I don't like the fact that he got so much money. He doesn't deserve $5 million, in my opinion, based on his performance.
It’s an arbitration extension, though, and not a four-year contract, which is the silver lining.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 1:56 PM EST reply actions
Geeze, I like it even less.
Josh Hamilton is making less money. Now, I’m not entirely sold as Hamilton ever being as good as he was in 2008 ever again, but he’s clearly a superior player to Francoeur, even with his injuries factored in, and he’s making considerably less…
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 2:02 PM EST up reply actions
Please stop.
You’re killing me.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 19, 2010 1:57 PM EST up reply actions
Francoeur should bat #8, in front of the pitcher.
He’ll try to get RBI’s no matter what (well he does that already) and he’ll see his walks increase (iBB, but still). If only he was the worst bat in our lineup. He’ll face a tough competition for the #8, with Omir/Molina, 1B and 2B.
If Pelf or Johan are playing, then they bat cleanup and Francoeur goes #9.
they'll pitch to him
so they won’t have to see the pitcher bat.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
if rallies were so important they'd be on the scoreboard
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 2:19 PM EST up reply actions
well played
but francoeur never seems to be part of them so he doesn’t notice.
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 19, 2010 2:39 PM EST up reply actions
you embaress yourself Mr. Moustache
what’s that white powdery substance there?
if the founders intended players to get on base because of balls
they would have named the game “baseball”, not “dingerball”
by hotspur on Jan 19, 2010 3:23 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Every day I am stunned by the money that is thrown around. I was looking at the contracts on COTS and realized that Alex Rod is going to make almost a half of a BILLION dollars? Cora gets 2 million….for what? Not only is the vesting option a joke there are performance bonuses, well not exactly performance, more getting into the game, in 2010. It’s beyond nuts. All I can say is lets GO Jets.
It's such myopia, the way people talk about the money players are getting
Obviously, the owners are raking in a TON of money, or we would not be seeing these contracts. If we could see the owners’ books, everyone might gain a bit of perspective.
I can agree with the "Cora gets 2 million….for what?" part.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 2:36 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, no. Alex Cora said it himself: He's not here to make friends. He's here to play.
In your face, team camaraderie!
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 3:02 PM EST up reply actions
I want the best ballplayers to make $70,000 a year,
the best owners to make around that, box seats for $3, and nickel beers.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 4:15 PM EST up reply actions
One of the comments at talking chop
That’s more than Laroche got from Arizona
when you look at it like that, it really hurts.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Laroche has well passed his projection
for like 3 years straight.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Probably his notorious slow starts – which typically I dismiss as not being a repeatable skill. However, in Adam’s case, he has done it every year of his career except 2005, I believe.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 3:28 PM EST up reply actions
He’s not that good – before July
FTFY
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 7:19 PM EST up reply actions
Mark said this:
“Yup exactly
That’s why the projection is so low, and its also why you can’t just do a linear regression on WAR numbers, each component has a different correlation rate to account for. One year he was a +6 defender, one year he had a 21% HR/FB and .276 ISO, one year he had a .330 BABIP. Those are all career peaks for him, and none of them really showed up with any other major strengths, they all kind of just happened at different times”
This year he'll steal 45 bases
on 50 attempts
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
In other arb-avoiding news...
The Other Pedro signed for $2.7 mil.
Thaty might be the bargain of the winter…
Oh, the butcher and the baker and the people on the street: wheredotheygo?!?!?
I don't have a problem with 1 year for Frenchy, especially after Beltran's injury
If the second half of last year wasn’t a fluke, let him prove it.
Just please… no extensions for him. Please.
After 4/32 and 3/36, if the pattern continues, we might be looking at 2/40.
by Michkin on Jan 19, 2010 3:08 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
That's depressing
and funny.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 19, 2010 3:14 PM EST up reply actions
If he has a good first half we're looking at a 3/20 extension.
Count on it.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 4:20 PM EST up reply actions
hey 3/20
is better than 4/36
y’know what im sayin
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Yikes. Imagine paying $33m in 2011
to Frenchy, Castillo, Molina, and Ollie.
Even the Yankees would give up on that season.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 4:22 PM EST up reply actions
this is the extension
one year. Get’s to prove himself this year.
At least there's no vesting option
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
Just wait.
I’m sure we haven’t heard all the details yet.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHAHAHAHAHAHA
hahahahahahahahahahahahahahhahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahahah
I’m sure I’ll have more as soon as I catch my breath.
There needs to be an AA/mets front office mistake drinking game
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
No
We’d all have cirrhosis of the liver in about a week.
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
I was going to say, that AA meeting would become an AA meeting.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 3:48 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Sometimes, coming here, it already feels that way...
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 3:50 PM EST up reply actions
Omar press conference drinking game?
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
A shot everytime he says "uh"
and we’ll all die of alcohol poisoning
The Mets lobby Omar for a plan, and his plan, he likes his plan. The problem is that he didn't write his plan down 'cause that makes it paperwork, and that’s false hustle... Know what I’m sayin’?
Thank you. I'll be here all week. Please tip over your waitresses.
You’d think that after owning a billion dollar business since 2002 the owners would have some clue as to how to value that businesses assets.
For the $5m for Francoeur and the $2m for Cora the Mets could have gotten a real pitcher. For what they want to pay Molina they could have gotten another real pitcher. That would have given the club one of the best six or seven rotations in the majors instead of it’s being a real potential weakness.
Mostly agreed
Cora is useless, and Molina is the definition of fat garbage.
As for Francoeur… I am not a Francoeur lover by any stretch of the imagination, but given that he did play reasonably well for the Mets down the stretch, and given that our starting CF is out a month, and also given that the FA options suck, would it really be that horrible to give Francoeur another half year? Yes, he’ll probably suck, but I don’t see Eric Byrnes or Rick Ankiel doing any better.
As for the extra starter…. I think the Perez and Castillo contracts would hold us back from a 2nd starter more than anything else.
yeah but castillo and perez were already on the books
there was nothing they could do about those at this point, they could have done something about this. That being said I would agree mostly with what you said, if I thought the mets ever considered nontendering him pre-Beltrans injury to begin with.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Sure.
At this point most of the bridges are burned, and of everyone still available Francouer has one of the highest upsides. We just never should have been in that position to begin with.
by SeanSchirmer on Jan 19, 2010 5:55 PM EST up reply actions
it is a 1 year deal
if he repeat last year, or his 2 year stats with Atl, prior to they tinker with his swing, he will be worth much more than that
He is also keeping the seat warm for F-Mart, we might keep him for 1 year or trade him mid season when F-mart is ready
If he has a good year, he might net us a prospect next year, if not we will promote F-Mart
This is a no downside deal in my opinion
The downside to this deal is that you have Jeff Francoeur in your lineup.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 4:23 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
Rec'd
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 19, 2010 4:24 PM EST up reply actions
Even if he hit
.280,.310,.430 I think that is his downside
His numbers from the last 3 years (each season worse than the one before) say his downside is much uglier than that.
"My team of nine guys who hit like Albert Pujols and never ever bunt just beat your team with one Shane Victorino 472 to 3."
by justincredubil02 on Jan 19, 2010 4:30 PM EST up reply actions
thats right around what chone has as his most likely projection
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
His 2008 was an absolute train wreck
You don't cheer for the Mets. You drink for the Mets.
Personally, having Francoeur in the lineup....
Bothers me a lot less than Jerry in the dugout.
Amen
"All energy flows according to the whims of the great magnet
What a fool I was to defy him"
-HST
by Mark Himmelstein on Jan 19, 2010 5:03 PM EST up reply actions
WOOHOOO!!! MOLINA REUPS WITH THE GIANTS!!!!
The balance of the universe is restored!
The real downside here..
is that if he “exceeds” the Mets expectations or performs something similar to what he did in the second half, he’ll get an extension.
lol its sad
the downside is that he might live up to his upside.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
RBIZZ!!!1!!!
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 19, 2010 8:11 PM EST up reply actions
So, what you're saying is
Ramon Martinez on a $3 mil deal?
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
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