More Wilpons/MLS Speculation

In MLS Commissioner Don Garber's annual State Of The League Address, among the topics discussed was future league expansion plans. The league currently includes 16 teams, will expand to 18 with the addition of franchises in Portland and Vancouver next season, and will further expand to 19 in 2012 with a franchise in Montreal. Garber stated that the league is focused on making a second New York franchise the league's 20th team, with a target date of 2013. Relevantly, Garber said that "[the league has] been meeting with the city, with the Wilpon family and the owners of the Cosmos name and brand and other investors who have expressed interest."

Seems to me that the Wilpons couldn't be in such bad financial straits if they're considering investing in a second professional team.

over 1 year ago JoshNY 21 comments 0 recs |

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So let me get this straight...

you’re telling me that the MLS has enough of a fanbase to actually support 20 teams along with 2 in the NYC area?

To me, that’s the biggest news in this article.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!

by Steve Schreiber on Nov 17, 2010 7:44 PM EST reply actions

I'm no MLS expert

but I’d guess maybe the thinking would be NYC would be one of the few cities who could support two teams. Bringing back the Cosmos name will generate a lot of publicity which could transfer into reasonably large crowds at small-market MLS teams when the Cosmos are in town. This in turn could be a way of getting supporters out to watch their local teams and hope that some have such a good time they stick around and are encouraged to go to games more often, thus helping spread the popularity of MLS?
Not living in the USA it’s hard to precisely gauge the popularity of MLS – is there a lot of talk/hype about the MLS Cup Final, or is it still quite a minority thing?

by benny_profane on Nov 18, 2010 1:54 AM EST up reply actions

it's not really covered at all in the national media

I live in DC, and for a while DC United was the cream of the MLS crop, and they were actually fairly popular around here. They haven’t been very good the past 3 or 4 years though, and their popularity has waned, and now all of DC pays attention to the Capitals b/c they’re the only local team that’s winning anything.

2009 Did Not Happen

by cjmulrain on Nov 18, 2010 9:51 AM EST up reply actions

While it's not covered in the national media

it depends on your location if the local media will support the team. I live in New England and the N.E, Revolution actually have all their games broadcast on local sports radio. They’re popular enough to get air time even with all the other teams in this town playing well.

"Baseball is a game played by the dextrous but only understood by the POIN-dextrous"-Professor John I.Q. Neidelbaum Frink, Simpsons

by Blame-everyone-else on Nov 18, 2010 10:10 AM EST up reply actions

Aha, that's interesting

I guess maybe it doesn’t help that LA got knocked out so no Beckham or Donovan in the final.

by benny_profane on Nov 18, 2010 7:10 PM EST up reply actions

2nd MLS NY team

MLS is still kinda of a minority sport, unless you follow the US Soccer team and if you live Seattle. Majority of MLS follower are bloggers and follow there teams online.

The main reason why MLS wants a 2nd NY team is because they want a rivalry with NY Red Bulls.

As for the Wilpon angle: MLS just wants the Cosmos to play at Flushing. I think the Wilpon’s would be a minority owner.

by nelsonc on Nov 18, 2010 7:12 PM EST up reply actions

If relatively tiny cities can support one team

then the NYC metro area should be able to support at least two.

The article got NYC’s population wrong. It is 8.4 million people who live in the city, and 22+ million people in the metro area.

"We have gotten to the point where not only big market clubs are going over slot, but small market clubs are going over slot, and they see it as a competitive advantage. I don’t think we can be left behind in that regard. I think that we've got to be open minded about it, and we intend to be." - Sandy Alderson

by Russ on Nov 18, 2010 9:00 AM EST up reply actions

I'm not so sure.

In some parts of the country high-school soccer has replaced football as the sport of choice (parts of New England come to mind). My understanding of the MLS fanbase is that it is dominated by people who play, or have played, soccer at the high school level, but that those who are fans are fairly rabid. DC United, who I will assume is one of the more popular teams based on the comment above, averaged between 14,000 and 20,000 fans per game over the last 15 years, in a stadium that can hold a whole lot more. Even playoff attendance barely scratched 20,000 a couple of times, usually far less than that, and sometimes even less than their regular season average (this leads me to believe that a lot of ticket sales were made by organizations, or individuals who just wanted to see what the game was like but had little real interest in the team.

It's a triumph of number crunching over the human spirit...aaaaaand, it’s about time. -- Play-by-Play Announcer, The Simpsons.

by MookieTheCat on Nov 18, 2010 7:07 PM EST up reply actions

Well, LA has two MLS franchises that play in the same stadium

Now the LA metropolitan area has 17.8+ million people

The Washington-Baltimore-Northern Virginia metro area has 8.4+ million people and one team.

MLS has been moving to soccer specific stadiums. Filling up 50,000 seat venues is really not realistic, and the numbers that you provide for DC United demonstrate that. Red Bull Arena seats just over 25,000 people.

If a new team (and I really hope that it is the Cosmos) were to occupy a new soccer specific stadium in Flushing, it would be able appeal to a different part of the metropolitan area. The population of the four counties of Long Island are over 7.5 million people. The population of NYC and Long Island is over 11 million people. The population of NYC metro outside, of NYC and Long Island, is about 11.5 million people. With all of these people, and soccer specific stadiums in Harrison and Flushing, two teams should be able to thrive.

by Russ on Nov 18, 2010 7:49 PM EST up reply actions

The Red Bulls attendance

Has only cracked 20,000 once since the team’s inaugural season (that was in 2001). In the last five years it’s floated between 12,000 and 18,500, with playoff attendance being less than regular season each appearance except for last year. In the huge NY-area market I just don’t see how this level of interest should support another team.

It's a triumph of number crunching over the human spirit...aaaaaand, it’s about time. -- Play-by-Play Announcer, The Simpsons.

by MookieTheCat on Nov 18, 2010 7:57 PM EST up reply actions

I think that they cracked 40,000 once in Giants Stadium

According to the Wikipedia article, they averaged 18,650 this season, with 25,000 in attendance for a game in August, which was their first season in the new stadium. They averaged 12,744 in 2009 which was their last season in Giants Stadium. My understanding is that when MLS teams move from larger venues to soccer specific stadiums, the attendance climbs, and keeps climbing. If this holds true for the Red Bulls, then they are fine.

As far as a second team, I don’t know what the demographics are, but the MLS does. That might explain why they are so ready a team east of Manhattan.

With regard to the playoff attendance, I don’t know why it dropped, but my guess is that holding MLS’ playoffs at the same time as MLB’s playoffs hurt. I think that MLS’ playoffs should be completely over in early September to avoid the competition of pennant races.

by Russ on Nov 18, 2010 8:43 PM EST up reply actions

It would make sense

that attendance increases when teams move from a larger (typically NFL) stadium to a SSS; the gameday experience is just so much more pleasant. Going to a Red Bulls game at Giants Stadium sucked. No atmosphere. RBA is the right size (both in terms of field size and seating capacity) for soccer, not to mention it’s easier to get to.

Maybe the attendance is worse in the playoffs because of the weather? I went to the playoff game at RBA and it was not a nice night, cool and windy and drizzly. It’s a tougher ask for parents to bring kids to one of those games than it is during the summer, once school has started especially.

by JoshNY on Nov 19, 2010 12:32 PM EST up reply actions

Those attendance figures are in line with the Nets and Devils

Considering that MLS is growing I’d say those are good figures. Also, putting a team that actually plays in NYC would be extraordinary for a franchise.

by Adam F. on Nov 19, 2010 3:20 PM EST up reply actions

The first Beckham Galaxy vs Red Bull game

drew 66,237. And has dropped a bit every year since. There is a market in the NY area, especially with all the foreign backgrounds, it’s just a matter of keeping ticket prices affordable and games competitive.

"..."

by Thaddeus Ballpheasant on Nov 20, 2010 9:52 PM EST up reply actions