Mike Pelfrey: He Sucks, Or Are Those Who Say So Schmucks?
I wanted a rhyming, catchy title. What can I say?
Over the course of the last month or so, I've heard various calls for Mike Pelfrey to be traded ("Are people still gonna be impressed [by Pelfrey]? Please! Get rid of him already"), dumped ("He's way too inconsistent...TOSS HIM, please!!"), or otherwise let go. I'm not particularly a huge Mike Pelfrey fan or anything, and I'm sure that most people here at AA completely understand and agree with what is written below, but a few of these random comments grated on my nerves for some reason, prompting me to sit down and vent. What is with a lot of the dislike heaped on Pelfrey by the media, and a lot of the fans? Personally, I think it's tied somewhat to higher expectations (He's the "Number Two" guy and should be pitching like a "Number Two"), but that's just an educated guess on my part. Maybe people have other reasons for not liking him to the degree that I've seen people not like him.
Did Mike Pelfrey kill Kenny? Is that why so many people dislike him?
Mike Pelfrey is 26, and is still relatively cheap and controllable. No matter how you look at things, that's a plus. According to Cot's Baseball Contracts, Mike Pelfrey is owed $500,000 dollars for 2010. He is set to enter into arbitration in 2011, instead of entering into free agency. Let's say he gets a raise of 500%, an arbitrary number- he'll still only be making $2,500,000 dollars. Let's say he gets an even bigger raise, a raise of 1000%, another arbitrary number- he'll be making $5,000,000, still a very reasonable salary, from the team's perspective, for a starting pitcher.
Last year, Mike Pelfrey certainly had an off year. It's not because, as has been floated around in the media, or among the general fanbase, because he is a bad pitcher. Rather, it is because of the horrid defense behind him in Luis Castillo having his worse defensive season to date and the revolving door of sub-par shortstops filling in for Jose Reyes- Anderson Hernandez, Wilson Valdez, Ramon Martinez, Angel Berroa, Argenis Reyes, and Andy Green. All of that contributed to ballooning his ERA to an inflated 5.03, while his BABIP was .321, up about .20 points from 2008. Let's put his ERA to the side for a moment, and look at his peripheral stats for a moment- if it's something Mike Pelfrey is doing to make him suddenly suck, there'd surely be something sticking out there.
Let's denote 2008 as his "good year", and 2009 his "bad year". His "good year" was not very much different from 2009, his "bad year". It was surprisingly similar, actually. He made 32 starts, and threw 200.2 IP in 2008. He made 31 starts, and threw 184.1 IP in 2009. Those stats are basically the same (there's a difference of one start and 16.1 innings, which isn't all that much). In 2008, he struck out 110, and walked 64. In 2009, he struck out 107, and walked 66. Not much variance there. In 2008, his ground ball rate was 49.6%, and his fly ball rate was 29.6% (with 12 of those fly balls being home runs). In 2009, his ground ball rate was 51.3%, and his fly ball rate was 30.0% (with 18 of those fly balls being home runs). Again, there's not too much variance in the data, with the exception of an uptick in home runs allowed. His balk rate certainly went up in 2009, from 0 to 6, but that's a piece of data that I don't know can be contributed to anything. If it continued, it's certainly something to note, and be concerned with. So, on that matter, we'll have to see.
The only major variance in his 2008 and 2009 data is ERA, with his ERA being 3.72 in 2008, and 5.03 in 2009. Among all qualifying pitchers, Mike Pelfrey put up an ERA that was 6th worse in the 2009 MLB season by a starter. Only Jeremy Guthrie, Ricky Nolasco, Carl Pavano, and our good friends Braden Looper and Livan Hernandez posted ERAs that were worse than Pelfrey's.
Generally speaking, ERA is a fundamentally flawed piece of data to measure the success as pitchers, however. That's not to say that it should be ignored- 99.9% of the time, when a pitcher has a low ERA, he's doing good, and when he has a high ERA, he's doing bad- but it's a far cry from actually measuring how good a player is pitching. In 2008, Mike Pelfrey's BABIP was .302. In 2009, it was .321. In 2008, balls were being put in play, and were being converted into outs at a larger rate than in 2009. Daniel Murphy exhibited decent range at first, defensively, but the shoddy defense of Luis Castillo, the various infielders filling in for Reyes, and a poor defensive campaign for Wright led to more of Pelfrey's ground balls being put into play for hits, and more of those base runners making it around the bases, to score. Does Pelfrey (or any other pitcher) control what the balls the defensive behind him gets to, and what balls they don't? No, of course not. So, because ERA includes weighs balls that defensemen just barely miss as home runs that are crushed into the night, it cannot be used to seriously demonstrate his pitching ability.
FIP, on the other hand, can. A player's FIP is calculated using home runs given up, walks given up, and strikeouts, all things that the pitcher alone controls. Luis Castillo not being able to reach ground balls up the middle has no impact on his FIP. Alex Cora bobbling the ball, and not being able to throw out the runner as a result has no impact on his FIP. David Wright not being able to field a bunt in time has no impact on his FIP. Instead, Mike Pelfrey and Mike Pelfrey alone controls what his FIP is.
In 2008, the MLB average FIP was about 4.40. Mike Pelfrey's FIP was 3.96, a little better than the average. In 2009, the MLB average FIP was about 4.35. Mike Pelfrey's FIP was 4.39, demonstrating that he was just a tad beneath average. On their own, however, a variance of 3.96 and 4.39 is not very much (.43). In the context of the MLB mean in 2008 and 2009 (4.37), Pelfrey's FIP of 4.17 demonstrates that, in actuality, Pelfrey has been a little better than the average pitcher.
In terms of WAR, in 2008, he was worth 3.0 WAR for the season. His 2009 campaign was worth 1.8 WAR. The only WAR projection data available was from the ‘Fans' section of Fangraphs, which projects Pelfrey to be worth 3.5 WAR, a career high. This would put him, based on other projections made by the same people, in the same category as John Lackey (3.7), Ryan Dempster (3.5), and Carlos Zambrano (3.4). Personally, I don't trust fan projections of that nature. So, assuming that his performance for 2010 is somewhere between the two, that's a mean WAR of 2.4. So, keeping in the same vein, what other pitchers, in the past two years, have been put up seasons worth 2.4 WAR or thereabouts? Nick Blackburn in 2008 (2.5). Gavin Floyd in 2008 (2.4). Bronson Arroyo in 2008 (2.4). Joe Blanton in 2008 (2.2). Aaron Harang in 2009 (2.5). Kevin Millwood in 2009 (2.4). Jon Garland in 2009 (2.4). Jarrod Washburn in 2009 (2.1). A lot of people are very down on Mike Pelfrey, and would be ecstatic to acquire any of those above-mentioned players, simply based on name and/or expectation, not realizing that many are/were only marginally better than Pelfrey.
So, all in all...I don't get it. Mind you, this is from reading "less than educated" Mets website/blogs, listening to WFAN, and other similar things, but still...
Is Mike Pelfrey responsible for the melting of the polar ice caps? Is that why so many people dislike him?This FanPost was contributed by a member of the community and was not subject to any vetting or approval process. It does not necessarily reflect the opinions, reasoning skills, or attention to grammar and usage rules held by the editors of this site.
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Good write up Dodgers.
I don’t get the slack Pelfrey gets. You mentioned “the number 2 role” but I think it’s a bit deeper than that. Pelf was the organization’s top draft pick back in 2005 & the “common” Mets fan takes note of that and when they see a 5 ERA after a 3.72 ERA the season before, it leads them to the conclusion that Pelfrey sucks. But as you mentioned here, the Mets infield defense was horrible last year. Naturally, a groundball pitcher with a terrible defense behind him isn’t going to be pretty.
And for what it’s worth, Pelf did shed some lbs. so that might serve as some benefit for him this season.
MIke Pelfrey used to be a Polar Bear...

you know what I'm sayin' ?
by fxcarden on Mar 20, 2010 8:16 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I'm afraid don't get it
Pelfrey and polar bears? He is a big guy. I’m probably missing a really obvious joke. If it’s something as lame as the fact that there’s a tongue in the picture of the polar bear, though, I’m going to be sorely disappointed, because christ, has that gotten old.
I'm sorry to disappoint......it was about the tongue.
I couldn’t find a polar bear with a mouthpiece.
you know what I'm sayin' ?
If he keeps growing that beard, he might become Grizzly Adams, which has it's own bear connotations.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 21, 2010 2:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, right,
and Grizzly Adams had a beard.
"Relax, all right? Don't try to strike everybody out. Strikeouts are boring; besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls. It's more democratic."
- CRASH DAVIS
Well, if today was any indication...
Then the answer is obvious…For today. I’m not gonna go as far as to say “he sucks” all the time. Regular season get here soon please.
Hey, anyone ever hear the results of this CBS Fantasy Baseball for Amazin Avenue? I guess if I didn’t get an email, I didn’t get selected. Just wanted to know if anyone knew of the status of who got selected.
Guess my writing sucks too.
This season I will expect the worst but I will be prepared for 'worser'.
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Mar 22, 2010 4:22 PM EDT reply actions
Pelfrey's perceived flaw
if we can call it that, is that he’s not a strikeout pitcher, so that will always limit him, and he’ll always have to rely on his D. I agree that Cora and Castillo, and some outfielders cost him some hits, but how many really? He gave up 213 in 184 IP. That’s not just poor range, he was legitimately getting lit up every now and then. And I think the BB rate increase from 2.9 to 3.2 is more significant than you think. He has to stay under 3 walks per 9 to be successful. When you’re not striking guys out, you have to keep your walks down. And at Citi, there is a ton of room for balls to drop in that outfield, so maybe he can’t expect a great BABIP.
I’m not disagreeing with you, but I think we have to limit our expectations of him. He’s an average to slightly above average pitcher. But, he could easily have a career year in him where everything breaks for him (like Garland’s big year or Piniero last year), so that’s worth something.
It was nice to see him slightly increase his K-rate last year, so if he can improve on that again, and limit the walks and homers, he’ll go from average to well above average pitcher, and when two of our other starters are named Perez and Maine, we all know Pelf’s not the big concern.
I don't think Pelfrey is a world beater, for sure.
I find the general condemning of Pelfrey as being sucky combined…“pining”- if it can be called that- for certain other pitchers that he compares with a bit comical. Certainly not in the AA community, but listening to WFAN sometimes yes, and reading over at Metsblog yes. I’ve heard/read Mets fans who believe that trading for Arroyo, and including Pelfrey in such a deal would make the team better- the two are very comparable, in terms of stats, but Arroyo is “good”, while Pelfrey is “bad”. Or Jarrod Washburn, that he’d be a difference maker, while Pelfrey drags his ass and doesn’t step up to contribute much, when the two are fairly comparable in terms of stats nowadays.
A perception issue, for sure.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 22, 2010 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions
It's not just that he's not a strike out pitcher
it’s that he doesn’t get an overwhelming number of ground balls either. Most of the lower groundball% effective groundball pitches have much higher strike out rates/lower contact rates, and the the lower strike out effective groundball pitchers have groundball rates in the 60s. Pelfrey is somewhere in no mans land.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
.
Pelfrey is somewhere in no mans land.
Agreed, which brings us to the question = where is Ollie, then ?.
you know what I'm sayin' ?
Ollie land
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
Where you wear hats on your feet
and hamburgers eat people.
by Pack Bringley on Mar 22, 2010 10:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Hmm...
It’s populated by 100 nuts and a squirrel.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 22, 2010 11:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Where frogs have wings and don't bump their asses a-hoppin!
This season I will expect the worst but I will be prepared for 'worser'.
by LOUtheMETandNATSfan on Mar 23, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions
Never Never land
Who cares how bad the Bay deal will look in 2013, the world is going to end in 2012 anyway
by Stephen Schmidt on Mar 23, 2010 8:16 PM EDT up reply actions
the good ship Olliepop
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
by squid92 on Mar 25, 2010 6:28 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Alternate Title
Is Mike Pelfrey a Number 2 starter, or just a starter who pitches like Number 2?
"I've been trying transcendental meditation, and that helps me be passive and wait on the curve. I've got to find something else to hit the slider." - George (The Stork) Theodore
I like it.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 29, 2010 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
He's not really a "number two" starter, in an ideal world, but...
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 29, 2010 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
I think you're confusing Pelfrey with Ollie.
Perhaps today IS a good day to die.
- Klingon proverb
by Thomas Wachtel on Mar 31, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Nice writeup
Love the pictures too, haha. Anyway, I chalk up Pelf’s rough year due to slight upticks in the walk and HR-rates, a sub-par LOB%, as well as an unlucky BABIP, and the fact he pitched in front of an awful defensive team (which are a couple things he doesn’t have much control over, hence the decent FIP). Another thing of interest is the pitch value of his fastball; it went from +21.9 in 2008 to a staggering -8.2 in 2009, with velocity and movement staying fairly similar; I thought that was a bit unexplainable and fluky.
I'm not sure that's fluky
it could just mean either hitters figured out something about it or started laying off it.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.
It might be
But the FanGraphs pitch value rankings are very flukey given that they are basically just wOBA allowed on each pitch. And wOBA is influenced by BABIP and just plain hitter luck, so it’s not the best measure. In short, Pelfrey’s fastball might have been “figured out” last year, but it’s more likely that it’s just a fluke.
Also I don't think it differentiates between the 4-seam and sinker
so maybe he threw one more or less.
"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'
it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.

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