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The Resurrection of Ike Davis

Alex was kind enough to offer his take on Mets prospect Ike Davis in the form of a guest post. Hope you all enjoy it.

Hey guys, my name is Alex Eisenberg and I run the website Baseball-Intellect.  Long story short, I have a background in Kinesiology and biomechanics and at my site I breakdown player mechanics and combine traditional scouting methods with sabermetric analysis to evaluate players.

Right now, I'm publishing each team's top-15 prospect list and I recently published the Mets top prospect list (click here to see Prospects 1 - 5 and click here to see Prospects 6 - 15).  However, I wanted to share my report on Ike Davis with some of the Mets' more avid fans.

Star-divide

I did a "Breaking Down the Draft" series for the Hardball Times in 2008 and in that series, I did a write-up on Davis.  

As I watched Davis at Arizona State, the bottom line for me was that Davis' swing was too handsy...not enough lower body involvement, not enough use of the hips.  There wasn't a lot of power coming from that swing.  And the numbers reflected this in his debut season:

.256/.328/.327/.655

Bold number is Davis' slugging percentage.  That comes out to an ISO-power of .071, which is pathetic for a first baseman.  I think the adjustment to pro ball made things worse for Davis, but still, something needed to be done.

So Davis, humbled by the struggles of his first pro season, re-tooled his swing.

The first set of graphics come from the center field camera with the one on the left shot during Davis' time in Brooklyn and the one on the right shot during Davis' stint in Binghamton last year.  The angles are different, but we can still see some key differences.  The graphics are synchronized to contact but if the loop separates from one another, trying refreshing the browser

 

*Credit to Minor League Baseball and the Binghamton Mets

The second set of graphics from the side view come from Davis' draft video at Arizona State (on the left) and Davis last year in the AFL (on the right).  Credit to Toby Hyde of Mets Minor League Blog for the most recent clip of Davis.

 

*Credit to the MLB Scouting Bureau and to Toby Hyde

Now let's go over some of the adjustments made by Davis...

1. The 2009 version starts out with a little more bend in his knees, while his legs are more spread apart in his draft video.  It also looks like he's holding his hands just slightly higher in 2009 as well.

2. The stride...the 09' version sways back a little before striding forward in an effort to build up some momentum.  From the point where Davis first starts his stride, the 09' version finds himself in a much more athletic position than the 08' version.  He's in a position where it's much easier for him to powerfully drive forward, which he proceeds to do in the form of a long stride.  He's also in a position where he's better able to adjust to the ball in mid flight.

The 08' version doesn't really take a stride...he takes more of a small step instead.  Davis ended up swinging off his front foot, which caused him to get too far out in front at times.

3. Simultaneous to the lower body work, Davis is also loading his hands differently.  Notice the difference between the angle of the bat and position of the hands.  As Davis loads his hands in 08', the bat angle doesn't change.  And he lowers his hands only to the level of his upper chest.  Contrast that with Davis in 09' where he drops his hands down to almost the level of his stomach.

Overall, the swing is longer.  His new loading process -- because it's deeper and more aggressive -- creates much more power than his old one.

But it also changes the swing's path.  Take note of where Davis' bat makes its first aggressive move forward.  What Davis has done is given his hands a longer path to travel.  He's able to keep his hands back and turn his hips and hands together on a firm front leg, which is a big driving force behind a hitter's power.

So what impact did some of these changes have on Davis' overall numbers?

The whole set up with more bend in the legs, a longer stride...that gave Davis a lot more leverage, which resulted in more fly balls and less ground balls than the  year before.

The contact made by Davis was harder than before.  But his strikeouts also increased in part because of the length he added to his swing.  However, he should stick with what's working for now.

Weaknesses

Davis has pretty good plate coverage -- I've seen him make good contact by pulling pitchers on the outside corner of the plate -- but he becomes pull happy at times and he ends up rolling over.  He has to work on his approach and make better use of the entire field.

Also, while Davis crushed right handed pitching, lefties baffled him.  His lefty/right splits were enormous (1.000 OPS vs. RHP, .672 OPS vs. LHP).

Davis is regarded as a potentially plus defender at first base.  He's rather agile with good hands though he's a below average runner.

Best Case Outcome - Above average everyday first baseman

More Likely Outcome - More of an average everyday first baseman...I remind you of the kind of numbers one must put up to be considered an even average first baseman.  A worst case scenario would be that Davis proves unable to hit left handed pitching on a consistent basis and has to be platooned with a right handed bat.  But that's much more than most predicted of Davis entering the 2009 season.

This FanPost was contributed by a member of the community and was not subject to any vetting or approval process. It does not necessarily reflect the opinions, reasoning skills, or attention to grammar and usage rules held by the editors of this site.

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Thanks. Very Interesting.

You really can see the difference in the second set of “graphics” (Ariz. St. v. AFL).

But is “resurrected” really the right word. Wouldn’t “adjusted” be more accurate. As I recall, he was a pretty good player at Arizona State. Ike’s stat page on State’s website has his slugging percentages as .542 in ‘06 and .546 in ’07, which, unless I’m mistaken, appear to contradict your numbers.

That said, I see what you’re saying about him being in better position to produce more power at the plate.

"Never throw a slider to The Glider."

- Ed Charles, No. 5

by The Glider on Mar 3, 2010 11:38 PM EST reply actions  

haha...

I went back and forth on resurrected and resurgence. Adjusted would be the right word, but it’s not really an attention grabbing word.

As for him being a good player at Arizona State, he was. But in college he used a metal bat and played in an excellent park for hitters. There are many players that put up huge numbers in college, but can’t replicate them at the professional level. Davis’ tools are better than most — the quickness of his bat, the strength of his wrists/forearms, his hand-eye coordination — but it was clear he would need to make adjustments to his swing and to his credit, he did.

by Alex Eisenberg on Mar 4, 2010 1:08 AM EST up reply actions  

not related to Davis

but I’ve never seen footage of Meija pitching before the video, which is obviously a bit of an awkward angle, is he coming up into the “inverted W” in his motion or does it just look like that because of the angle?

"We have a plan, and our plan, I like our plan'

it's Omar's world, we're just livin in it.

by Gina on Mar 3, 2010 11:44 PM EST reply actions  

the inverted-w

No, not from what I can tell.

Here is how I see the inverted-W. Depending on the degree that the elbow goes above the shoulder, the violence associated with the delivery, and a pitcher’s ability to repeat his delivery, among many other things, I identify it as a risk factor. It’s something I plan on delving more into once I’m done with these prospect lists.

But I’ll say pitchers with a variety of different arm actions get injured and my belief is that most injuries are caused by a combination of genetics, poor conditioning, abuse of being overworked, and bad mechanics. We can’t just focus on singular cause.

The thing that concerns me with Mejia is that he doesn’t repeat his arm action well, which does heighten his injury risk and hurts the consistency of his command. But he doesn’t have an Inverted-W.

by Alex Eisenberg on Mar 4, 2010 1:49 AM EST up reply actions  

Just to clarify

When you say average first baseman, you mean average offensively with possible plus defense or will his defense make him average? I was thinking that Davis could become a Adrian Gonzalez type hitter (06-08) with plus defense.

Thanks for this Alex, it was a very interesting read, and your top 15 may be the best one I’ve seen yet for the Mets with the exception of Marte at 9.

by Evan_S on Mar 3, 2010 11:48 PM EST reply actions  

re:

I use Kevin Goldstein’s positional value chart he created a couple years ago, so the data is a bit old, but it still works as a quick and dirty method to look at the value of each position. Here is the link:

Positional Value Chart

POS BAD AVG GOOD ELITE
  1b 758 858 952 987

Using Goldstein’s explanations, good is top-10, elite is top-5, average is between 11 – 20, and bad is between 21 – 30.

Yes, I think Adrian Gonzalez, 06 – 08 version, raw numbers, not adjusted, is a good best case scenario for Davis. I don’t think there is a great deal of separation between Davis’ best case and most likely scenario.

As for Marte, I actually watched him in a few games during the best stretch of his season, so I think that influenced my thinking a bit. However, my thought process is that while I think guys like Nieuwenhuis, Allen, and Familia to a lesser extent are more likely to be contributors at the MLB level, Marte has more upside and a better chance to make a true impact at the MLB level.

by Alex Eisenberg on Mar 4, 2010 2:01 AM EST up reply actions  

Hey, the 'more likely outcome' sounds good to me, too.

A great breakdown of things us “laymen/women” really can’t analyze. Thank you.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 4, 2010 12:10 AM EST reply actions  

Thats exactly the type of players the Mets need to start producing.

Homegrown stars are nice, but four or five solid everyday players or starting pitchers making next to nothing will allow the Mets to finally start to take advantage of their Payroll.

Pinella: Where th f*ck was that pitch at?
Ump: Lou, don't you know that you're not supposed to end a sentence with a preposition?
Pinella: Where the f*ck was that pitch at, a$$h*le?

by Stephen Schmidt on Mar 4, 2010 12:26 AM EST up reply actions  

thanks for the kind words

They are definitely much appreciated.

by Alex Eisenberg on Mar 4, 2010 2:02 AM EST up reply actions  

 what are the 2008 delgado and the 2009 murphy positional value rankings at 1B Also, i would rank thole higher, based on the fact that he was one of he few bright spots of 2009 . He seemed more confident and mature compared to fmart who was a big dissapointment

by bob c on Mar 4, 2010 7:58 AM EST reply actions  

Thole is a full two years older

Martinez is still really young to be appearing in major league games.

by SuperT on Mar 4, 2010 10:43 AM EST up reply actions  

Strides and leg kicks

“He’s also in a position where he’s better able to adjust to the ball in mid flight.”

I have had some coaches emphasize getting the front foot down (while keeping weight back)quickly in order to increase reaction time and cut down on strike outs. Their reasoning being that the swing can’t start if the front foot doesn’t touch down. This allows you to get the high fastball, and if you keep your weight back, the off speed stuff as well. The trade off is the loss of power but you get less strike outs.
 
However you note that with Ike’s longer stride and higher leg kick he is able to increase his reaction time. How is that so? I really love swing analysis, and notice that a few elite major league hitters are able to maintain high legs kicks and long strides, and have low strike out numbers.

I am also curious to know how you feel about torquing the hands on the load vs. pushing the hands back on the load like Ike.

by Coolpapabell on Mar 4, 2010 11:12 AM EST reply actions  

re:

Ya know, I might have put that line in the wrong place. Once Davis starts his swing, that’s when he’s able to adjust the swing in mid flight. The reason being is that he keeps his hands back and the bat head is actually in the hitting zone for a longer period. I don’t think he increases his reaction time…he’s just in a position where adjusting to the pitch is easier to do.

You have to give me an example of somebody that torques his hands, so I can visually compare and contrast their loading process to Davis’.

by Alex Eisenberg on Mar 4, 2010 3:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Here's what I am talking about

http://www.chrisoleary.com/projects/Baseball/Hitting/ProfessionalHitterAnalyses/SwingAnalysis_MannyRamirez_1B_HR_ToRCF_60FPS_001.html

Notice how Manny tilts the bat during his load to almost a 45 degree angle(some call it torquing), while Ike’s bat angle remains static during the load.

by Coolpapabell on Mar 5, 2010 11:38 AM EST up reply actions  

What stands out to me:

He is definitely doing a better job of keeping his weight back and weight transfer, but overall I would say his new swing is more balanced. Looking at the videos from the side angle, he seemed to be way out in front at the point of contact in the video on the left, while in the video on the right he seemed much more balanced at the point of contact. After a year of adjusting to the stance, the fact that he seems to be letting the ball “travel” further before the point of contact may lead to better pitch recognition, which could mitigate the strikeouts some.

by keithprime on Mar 4, 2010 6:12 PM EST reply actions  

can,t wait for ike ..

the next will clark only with more power book it dano ..

by lohaus#54 on Mar 4, 2010 7:06 PM EST reply actions  

nice breakdown

definitely some interesting stuff here.

my only concern is putting too much weight on just a handful of swings. i mean, there’s a good chance davis was lunging in that first cut because the pitcher fooled him w/ a slow curve then he keeps his weight back better in that second one because maybe it was just a straight fastball. hitters’ swings change quite a bit based on the count, runners on base, the pitch type, location, etc even w/in an at bat.

but it does sound like you do quite a bit of this analysis so you’ve probably watched a lot more of him than just this.

by Rob Castellano on Mar 6, 2010 12:00 PM EST reply actions  

what i appreciate from the (Ariz. St. v. AFL) video

His bat speed seems to have remained the same even though he is using a much heavier wooden bat. This is an awesome sign.

"Wait till Biggus Dickus hears about this!"

by scott from peekskill on Mar 7, 2010 1:27 PM EST reply actions  

I can liken this to...

seeing Jon Olerud develop. Olerud was as slow as they came in terms of foot speed; but put a glove on his hand, and good instincts took over. He was good enough to win a Gold Glove in each league.

Ike Davis fits in a similar mold to me. That said, Daniel Murphy is keeping first base warm for him. Daniel Murphy, himself, will get the 2nd base job; since Luis Castillo’s final contract season is next season, that contract will likely be bought out and second opens up for Murphy.

Danz

by Danz10 on Mar 8, 2010 3:12 PM EST reply actions  

Murphy has never played second base save an ill-fated Winterball attempt last year that went awry due to injury

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 8, 2010 4:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Did it really go awry?

I remember hearing that he was looking good at second.

by BobbyV_Incognito on Mar 8, 2010 7:44 PM EST up reply actions  

His injury is what scrapped the plan.

He only played 15 games in Peoria before hurting his right hamstring, and the Mets telling him to pack it in until Spring Training 2009. In Arizona, he was hitting .397, with an OBP of .501 (that’s not a typo) in 15 games/63 ABs. I can’t find any fielding data, however, so I don’t know (A) how many games he played where he started at second base, or (B) how good he actually was while playing second. As things are now, with those however many games being his only experience at second base, there’s no reason to expect that Murphy can be an average (at the very least) Major League second baseman.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Mar 8, 2010 11:58 PM EST up reply actions  

Daniel Murphy

I for one ,can not figure how Daniel Murphy is even in the Majors
-Does not hit for average
-Does not draw walks resulting ina poor OBA
-Has no real position(if he stays at 1st,between him and Tatis)Wright will have 35 errors with his erratic arm.
-Has no speed and a weak arm
-Very little power
-Does not hit in the clutch or drive in runs
-Not athletic as he proved in left field last year(embarasing)
-His at bats consist of weak grounders to 2nd and weak fly balls to left center
-His platoon partner,Fernando Tatis,Is a DP rally killer,even worse than Murphy
-At least with Ike Davis there is hope.Bring him up now!!!!!!
Please bring up Ike Davis,

by Putnan Prince on Mar 20, 2010 10:02 PM EDT reply actions  

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