Jason Bay's 2009 UZR
by wobatus on Apr 21, 2010 10:23 AM EDT
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Fangraphs just did their first UZR update of 2010. They changed the park effects, and now Bay's 2009 measures out at 1.9+, making him a 5 WAR player last year. It seemed pretty clear to me the large negative UZR he had under the former system must have been flukey, and Sam Page pointed out in an article how UZR had him as worse than Dewan and much worse than Total Zone. Errors and assists don't mean everything, we know, but given his putout rate, no errors, 15 assists and fact he isn't especially slow or appear to take really bad routes, it just didn't seem right that his UZR would be so bad, at least last year.
He is already at -1.2 UZR with the Mets (nice catch down the line last night however), and appears to be trying to justify his payday at the plate, but maybe his contract, at least the early years, isn't so bad. A year of UZR isn't enough to go on, but it does seem he was improving from the knee injury that hobbled him previously.
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I already have
Of course, he was still awful 4 out of 5 years prior to that, but it is a chink in the argument. He was kind of portrayed as Adam Dunn, Jr.
This reminds me...
What the heck ever happened to SeanSchirmer guy?
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2010 Mets- Hey, we may suck, but what did you expect?
Guessing he got banned after that whole meltdown.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 21, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions
Or
He was using ped’s and is serving a 50game suspension
by Blame-everyone-else on Apr 21, 2010 1:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Meltdown?
He always seemed like a cool guy, but who am I (or anyone) to assume? Besides, there are times when people simply snap – I’ve seen it happen a few times (the cops got involved one of those times, but no arrests thankfully). I always tend to give a benefit of the doubt, using track evidence to gauge my judgment.
Where there is a Wilpon, there is a way. To lose.
oh yeah, him
didn’t he get into a disagreement with Schmidtxc?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 21, 2010 1:14 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh, forgot you were away for a while there.
It’s really not worth rehashing, so here’s the shorthand version of what happened.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 21, 2010 1:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Jeez, Ryan Leaf
The Alex Escobar of football players.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
Oh god
Ryan Leaf is one of the greatest tragedies to have ever inflicted the NFL since, ever. In fact, I only use that reference sparingly, and not in jest, either. This comparison merits an asterisk (*).
I would have to guess that (a) SeanSchirmer is never returning here again, or that (b) he created a new account with an aliased username, so as not to be discovered. Or that © he simply gave up – just like Ryan Leaf did after that disastrous stint with the Chargers.
Where there is a Wilpon, there is a way. To lose.
madness
it was so insane someone made a leverage index graph for it
And to top off their greatest season yet the new jersey nets scored 86 points...in double overtime. yes a professional basketball team only mustered 86 points in 58 minutes of basketball.
Oh wow I totally forgot about that.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 21, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
That may have been the best leverage index graph I ever saw
Reyes, Thole, Wright, Beltran, Bay, Davis, Martinez, Tejada...
by Stephen Schmidt on Apr 21, 2010 2:28 PM EDT up reply actions
I never saw that
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 21, 2010 3:13 PM EDT up reply actions
speaking of tirades
anyone remember Myrick4gm?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 21, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Here we go
And to top off their greatest season yet the new jersey nets scored 86 points...in double overtime. yes a professional basketball team only mustered 86 points in 58 minutes of basketball.
by Gina on Apr 21, 2010 4:00 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
That'll never get old
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 21, 2010 5:44 PM EDT up reply actions
shit, i can't believe i missed two and a half months and i miss perhaps the greatest freak out in AA history.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
It was pretty epic.
The post got deleted at some point (no complaints there, to be honest), so you’ll just have to imagine the insanity.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 21, 2010 6:07 PM EDT up reply actions
I lobby for it to be brought back for one last time
Couldn’t it be view through google cache though?
I kind of missed it too.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 21, 2010 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions
I have to confess:
I already went looking for “88 wins, I say” at archive.org and in the Google cache — sadly, it’s not there.
dammit
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 22, 2010 5:49 AM EDT up reply actions
if you just search for seanschirmer
you can see little snippets of the conversation. Gives some of the flavor.
I saw that
but snippets don’t give the full picture
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 22, 2010 7:42 AM EDT up reply actions
wow
whoever made this gets 1000000 internetz.
If there's ever a riot at Citi Field and Oliver Perez was the starter, I started the riot.
Michkin, I believe.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 21, 2010 11:03 PM EDT up reply actions
This is ridiculously awesome
how did I miss this?
You don't cheer for the Mets. You drink for the Mets.
Who? And, welcome to AA, newcomer.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 22, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions
I still joined 5 months before you. Not that anyone actually remembers me.
In lobby campaign for Chris Carter.
actually, I do
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 22, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Sarcasm, playing on the Nick Evans theme.
Geeze
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 22, 2010 3:30 PM EDT up reply actions
I know, I was just pilling along haha. I wonder if Nick Evans check the Mets depth chart everyday to see if his name is still there.
In lobby campaign for Chris Carter.
Oh, okay.
I thought you were mad at me or something. Phew…
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 22, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
man, that thread was epic
in the same way that Alec Baldwin cursing out his daughter on the phone was epic.
Wasn’t he saying that Schmidtxc was stalking him or something? I understand why it was deleted, but I have to admit it was entertaining reading through the whole thing…
2009 Did Not Happen
Yep.
Hence the Ryan Leaf reset. It was basically him yelling “DON’T TALK TO ME, ALRIGHT?!” at Schmidt over and over across multiple threads.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Apr 23, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
good times, good times
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 23, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
You guys missed the way the story played all around SBNation.
It achieved legendary status in minutes, then the whole thread disappeared. The way it was told, one guy was relentlessly trolling another guy. The second guy put up with it for a while, tried to humor the troll, then at some point decided he’d had enough and started giving the troll what he deserved. The troll, weirdly, couldn’t get enough of the abuse and kept licking it up. He just kept begging for it. Wouldn’t agree to a truce, wouldn’t go away, just kept saying beat me, whip me, give me more and more and more. Totally bizarre stuff, a complete, masochistic meltdown. That’s the story, anyway. It’s all myth now, what with the thread having vanished. The internet needs a site where deleted posts and threads can live on, in infamy.
By the way, why should we assume that fangraphs suddenly has UZR right, after getting it wrong all year? Park effects aren’t difficult. Why were they giving out info that was extremely likely to be wrong—I mean, how do you transplant plays into a park in which they never occurred, publish that information without so much as an asterisk, then expect to be believed when you cough up your next set of numbers?
archive.org
picks stuff up after 6 months
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Apr 24, 2010 6:53 AM EDT up reply actions
That's a really good question about uzr
especially since not only were they sharing the info they made about 114141 articles and arguments based on information that was apparently wrong.
And to top off their greatest season yet the new jersey nets scored 86 points...in double overtime. yes a professional basketball team only mustered 86 points in 58 minutes of basketball.
yeah, it just seems like the info by which the stat is arrived at
should be accessible, and there’s no way they should have been writing definitive articles based on a ficitional stat.
they got kinda testy
when I complained about that. Sky was nice, but Appelman and MLC (sic?) acted a little huffy. Appelman suggested I keep repeating to myself that “all assertions made by the author may be based on incorrect data,” or something to that effect. Well, exactly. Folks were telling them it may be flawed, at least regarding Bay and Ellsbury. I kinda made peace and said good that they have honed it.
I checked and I think the answer is yes.
Also, Angel Pagan is now 3 WAR in 2009 and the Mets Of went from about -25 runs to -13.
Did they publish their change in method anywhere?
I’d like to see the overlay, how they adjusted their zones to an irregular park like Citi.
yeah
he still is a little weak, although some of that is the knee injury in Pitt then getting used to the Monster, I think. He seems decent enough so far at Citi. He’s not Dan Murphy or Hundley out there.
We'll see how he does.
And that means, in single seasons, we really have to rely on scouting, maybe with some stats. Defense will play a big part in whether his contract is a major disaster or not
.
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