The Post Formerly Known As "Beltran Is A Bum"
by ILikeIke#29 on Jul 16, 2010 1:49 PM EDT
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PrintHow about this? I think Beltran can't really make up for 06, but I can't see him staying healthy. The Mets are benching a fairly good outfielder in Francoeur just to let Beltran play. Or Jason Bay and his two inch dribblers (see unintentionally sexual quote of game). What do you people think about it? I think starting outfield should be this: Pagan LF Beltran CF Francoeur RF Bay should be benched, at least until he starts hitting homers.
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You've taken a wrong turn
I think you’re looking for another blog.
and by several
you mean none, right?
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 16, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
Let me see...
Beltran is a bum.
He’s never going to be productive.
He only got one hit yesterday and got thrown out.
He sits by himself.
Beltran is a bum.
he only got 1 hit off one of the best pitchers in the game
who was throwing an absolute gem!
CUT THE BUM! FRanCOURE should just play all 3 OF spots!
I am a fan of both the mets and knicks... so just kill me now.
Don't forget he struck out against some guy in the NLCS
How can you have a post detailing Beltran’s BAR (buminess above replacement) without mentioning that. Fail.
Um dude
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2010 Mets- Hey, we may suck, but what did you expect?
by Syler on Jul 16, 2010 2:35 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
absolutely awesome
except if you’re a fan of Jersey Shore….then you’re offended
My 5-year old daughter even hates the Ravens.
by SundaysWithTroy on Jul 16, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions
You can be as sarcastic as you want,
and I’ll still agree 100% with Joe Benigno when it comes to Beltran. I just don’t like the guy. Jason Bay stinks too. If we had three Angel Pagans in the outfield and in the clubhouse, that would be awesome.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
P.S.
really.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 2:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I thought Beningo said that Pagan was stupid?
I really don’t understand how you can dislike Beltran. What has he done to deserve this?
He never said that, he praises Pagan every day...
Beltran puts up his 30 and 100 every year, but it’s deceptive. I don’t think too many of those hits come when the Mets need it the most. Pagan has gotten more important RBI hits this year than I’ve seen Beltran get in a couple of years. Defensively, he’s right up there with Beltran too.
This site often compares Beltran to a Transformer robot. That’s appropriate, because that pretty much describes his personality. He robotically puts up his numbers when he’s healthy, but the hits just aren’t there when they’re most needed. I don’t think he adds anything to the clubhouse either.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 3:00 PM EDT up reply actions
He’ll hit a three-run homer when the Mets are up 6-0, but he always seems to tap out weakly to short in the big spot…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
Beltran walk-offs: 3
Met record for walk-offs: 4 (shared by Piazza, McReynolds, Cleon Jones, and WTF Chris Jones)
But I bet Beltran didn’t clap for himself as much as that showoff McReynolds.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 16, 2010 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
walk offs aren't a great stat
I mean how often does a guy get a chance to hit the game winning walk off. Beltran is a decent hitter, but has never lived up to his contract. How many game winners did Piazza hit in the other 8 innings of the game. I know I felt more confident in Piazza, and he is the only other guy to have that size contract on the Mets.
I look at Beltran as a very solid #2 hitter, someone who should hit for average, drive in some runs and score runs but not a #4 hitter. he is worth about $7-8 million not $19 million
by Rickfansince76 on Jul 16, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Fun fact from Ted Berg:
“According to Fangraphs, Carlos Beltran has been worth $101.5 million since 2005. The Mets have paid him about $92 million”
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2010 Mets- Hey, we may suck, but what did you expect?
this doesn't even mention the fact that he and pedro did a lot to change the attitude of this club
i know that is not a measurable stat, but i know my feelings about the Mets got really positive again that offseason. it wasnt that i hadnt been watching, it was that it had gotten so ugly
I like Ike
very well said
My 5-year old daughter even hates the Ravens.
by SundaysWithTroy on Jul 16, 2010 7:28 PM EDT up reply actions
you people can't have it both ways
you can’t on the one hand say “his stats are all empty, he never does it when it matters” and then, when we tell you that he’s one walkoff away from being the Mets all-time leader say “well, he doesn’t get hits that win games earlier in the game.” Umm, YES, he does. That’s why his stats are so awesome. He gets hits early, he gets them in the middle, and he gets them late. He’s, quite simply, one of the 3 or 4 best hitters to ever put on a Mets Jersey, and he’s maybe the best defensive outfielder we’ve ever had.
2009 Did Not Happen
by cjmulrain on Jul 16, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions 19 recs
I'm the 13th to rec this
someone make it 14. Not that I’m superstitious or anything
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 7:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Beltan saved more games with his glove than Piazza won with his bat
Nice try tho. E for effort!
Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...
I'm betting this is wrong.
A world class fielding season would be worth around 30 RAR. A world class hitting season something like 120 RAR
I asked you the other day,
how bliss is ignorance really??
LeBron: Yo Dwyane, dead ass you won't fuck my mom? Or Bosh neither?
I would argue with him
but I’m 100% convinced he’s a regular just fucking around with us. Geddy hits on way too many of our “terrible argument” memes to not be joking. He’s a perfect caricature of the uninformed baseball fan, which means he really can’t be real.
2009 Did Not Happen
Alternatively
I think he observed the discussion and comments here before delving into his trolling. By knowing exactly what would push people’s buttons (right down to the Joe Beningo references and “I want to win now, not in 3 years” type of stuff) he came prepared. Studious troll is studious.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 16, 2010 4:34 PM EDT up reply actions
One dumb post shouldn't get someone banned
No matter how stupid, ignorant and illogical it is.
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2010 Mets- Hey, we may suck, but what did you expect?
I think he's referring to I'm-Not-a-Troll Troll.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 16, 2010 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Didn't mean you specifically.
Sorry it came across that way.
this thread was derailed from the second it was posted
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
how can you not like beltran...
he’s really really really good at baseball.
Since I will literally never hang out with the guy or be friends with him, why would I care about anything else besides his ability to play?
by Mike Clemente on Jul 22, 2010 8:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Hmmmm,
Beltran hate? I’d ask you why you think he’s a “bum,” but I’d be wasting my time.
"I want to win now, not 3 years from now. That's my stance." - Kevin Burkhardt
my dad hates beltran too
he is convinced he does steroids… which always baffles me. calls him unclutch and references his k against wrainwright (sp?). i try to explain how that was one of the nastiest curveballs ever, but it doesnt matter.
he also really likes cora.
…sigh…
I am a fan of both the mets and knicks... so just kill me now.
Cora has actually hit extremely well with RISP
.308 with 20 RBIs in 39 AB, .333 with 11 RBIs in 21 AB with 2 outs
while he has sucked most of his career with a .251, I can not fault him for what he has done this year. He sucks with no one on .200 and is also overpaid. He should be at league minimum, whatever that is this year
by Rickfansince76 on Jul 16, 2010 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions
that's an insult to weed my friend.
and the people who smoke it.
LeBron: Yo Dwyane, dead ass you won't fuck my mom? Or Bosh neither?
Dammit.
I clicked on this for one reason, and one reason only…
… and there’s no “BAD POST” to be found.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 16, 2010 3:22 PM EDT reply actions
Ask and you shall receive
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 16, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions
I never understood why a top hat and a mustache makes you bad
Gas prices today are a lot like a pitcher's ERA. Anything under 3 is amazing, under 4 is pretty good and anything 5 and up is something you want to avoid.
by Bobby Baseball on Jul 16, 2010 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Clearly, you've never seen Snidely Whiplash
Lousy kids and their MTVs, and their 90120’s and their (insert other youth thing that old people gripe about).
If there's ever a riot at Citi Field and Oliver Perez was the starter, I started the riot.
you know, back in my day
90210 told you where it was instead of assuming you just knew.
by JoshNY on Jul 16, 2010 5:25 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
k
If there's ever a riot at Citi Field and Oliver Perez was the starter, I started the riot.
Wow
I smell a future meme!
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 16, 2010 4:48 PM EDT reply actions
Excellent first post
I look forward to hearing more of your opinions.
by Evan_S on Jul 16, 2010 5:15 PM EDT reply actions 4 recs
"David Wright is a Hobo"
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 16, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
Jose Reyes is literally homeless
by James Kannengieser on Jul 16, 2010 6:49 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Jeff Francoeur is a wolfman
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
by metsguy234 on Jul 16, 2010 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Ruben Tejada doesn't like kids.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Jul 16, 2010 11:59 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Alex Cora always wears vests.
I am a fan of both the mets and knicks... so just kill me now.
by gbaked on Jul 19, 2010 1:06 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Jon Niese has a big nose.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 19, 2010 2:26 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Jason Bay
doesn’t pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America
It's a game of redeeming features. ~ Bob Murphy
by CTRefJay on Jul 19, 2010 9:32 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Josh Thole is actually a reincarnated John McEnroe
I am a fan of both the mets and knicks... so just kill me now.
by gbaked on Jul 19, 2010 1:18 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
jerry manuel
is the stupidest man in baseball
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
by astromets on Jul 19, 2010 3:40 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Babe Ruth was nothing but a fat old man with little girl legs.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 19, 2010 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
Lee Trevino is the greatest actor of all time
You don't cheer for the Mets. You drink for the Mets.
Trade Beltran for Melky Cabrera or some other player that makes people feel
like they’re better than the evidence proves.
Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...
NOOOOO
Look how good Cano is doing with Melky gone!!!!!! We need someone who’s a real team player, someone who plays with heart and passion and smiles. We need to clone Jeff Francoeur!
Yeah two Francouers! You can just tell he cares by his body language and the way he runs
Beltran not so much
Freedom is a road seldom traveled by the multitudes...
plus
It’s not like Beltran knows when it’s the right time for everyone to shave.
My 5-year old daughter even hates the Ravens.
by SundaysWithTroy on Jul 16, 2010 7:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Speaker was legit
he just got screwed playing at the same time as Cobb. He’s like the Frank Robinson to Cobb’s Hank Aaron
2009 Did Not Happen
New York Mets Career WAR per 700 Plate Appearances Leaders, Minimum 2000 PA
1 Carlos Beltran 2929 6.36
2 Darryl Strawberry 4509 5.85
3 David Wright 3627 5.25
4 Keith Hernandez 3651 5.08
5 Edgardo Alfonso 4384 4.65
6 Mike Piazza 3919 4.39
7 Dave Magadan 2442 4.36
8 John Stearns 3027 4.28
9 Jose Reyes 3617 4.08
10 Howard Johnson 4537 3.81
:(
i wanted to believe Piazza was higher. guess those injured seasons hurt him some
I like Ike
the injured seasons
and also the defense, and I still don’t know how much faith to put into WAR’s (well, UZR’s, but you get the point) ability to accurately rate catching defense
2009 Did Not Happen
Yeah
As bad of a throwing catcher Piazza was, I remember him being a very stellar defensive C.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Effort-y, maybe.
I love Mike— pause— but “stellar” is pushing it.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:17 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm confused
I could swear that Olerud barely missed out on topping this list because he had 1,996 PA as a Met, which is corroborated by baseballprojection.com, but his B-R page says he had 2,018 PA as a Met. What gives?
For what it’s worth, using baseballprojection.com WAR and PA count, Olerud had 6.52 WAR/700PA as a Met. Using B-R.com it’s 6.45 WAR/700PA with enough PA to qualify.
In either case, Olerud was awesome for us.
I was 8 when we got Olerude and 10 when we got Piazza
I really came into my own as a mets fan with those teams.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
OK, but seriously...
does anyone have any idea why the two sites would have different numbers of PA listed?
This is where WAR doesn't pass the smell test (sacrilege, I know).
Injured seasons or no, Piazza and Magadan were nowhere near equals as Mets.
It's pretty well known that WAR has a hard time evaluating catchers
since UZR (or TotalZone depending on who you use), as flawed as it is in grading normal fielding, is even worse at grading defense at the catching position.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
But even so,
I see where Jack Str is coming from in that it seems like (at least in my head) Piazza’s offense was so far above what you’d expect from a replacement level catcher that he should be higher on the list than that.
2 out of Piazza's 7 years weren't that great with the bat (.343 and .333)
and apparently his defense was terrible. Also the average wOBA in 1999 and 2000 was .341. The wOBA’s lower to between .326 and .330 in the following years, but 1999 and 2000 were two of Piazza’s best years with the Mets and they aren’t quite as dominant as it might seem.
Yep, exactly this
WAR for catchers is pretty wonky. I’d hesitate to use it for comparing catchers and other position players.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 17, 2010 10:28 AM EDT up reply actions
Three Things
1. The problem of clutch is ultimately a problem of small samples. Every player will fail in clutch situations more often than they succeed; the only way NOT to would be to hit over .500 in those at bats. No one, in any sample of any size, can hit .500 at the major league level. So more often than not, the “anti-clutch narrative” sustains itself.
2. Most of these “Player X is unclutch” arguments seem like textbook confirmation bias. Focus on only the evidence that proves your point, rather than trying to find the truth.
3. The following would prove to me that Carlos Beltran is “unclutch”:
- a thorough disproving of the way that WPA is calculated (Beltran led the Mets in WPA in 2006 and 2008)
- some evidence that clutch hitting is predictable
- an explanation of Beltran’s positive stats in high-leverage situations
I do not expect to see any of this data, but that’s what it would take. What would it take to prove to those who think he is unclutch that they are wrong?
by sjohnson125 on Jul 16, 2010 6:25 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
Reading this post and subsequent discussion
I started to hear “Stain’d” playing in my head, and started to think about jorts, and started to become a bit ill.
by tmu on Jul 16, 2010 6:31 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
.
When asked Thursday if he had entered the World Cup pool, Carter said: "No. I need to hit more home runs."
He's making way too much damn money.
You just get that nagging feeling that he isn’t giving it his all. But I guarantee you next year he will play 158 games, hit about .310 with 30 home runs and 110 RBIs.
Basically everything he’s fully capable of doing on any year, but doesn’t.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
The Mets have gotten so much value out of Pagan
how much is he making? Not too much over the minimum, probably…well, definitely a small fraction of what Beltran makes. I don’t like the idea of 18-19 million dollars tied into one position player. A guy like Santana I can see, but not an outfielder. When I say I wish the Mets had more Angel Pagan-types (can’t you see he’s my favorite player?), I mean guys who don’t make a ton of money, but play like it. I wish the Mets were more lean and mean.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions
That makes no sense
Why would you rather pay that much money for someone who plays only once every 5 days rather than someone who contributes around 150 games a year?
And no offense, it is complete bullshit to say Beltran isn’t giving it his all, when it has been well documented that he frequently plays through pain.
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2010 Mets- Hey, we may suck, but what did you expect?
A bonafide ace is the most important thing for a team to have
Just ask the Yankees. During their “good, but not good enough” stretch from 2000-2008, they didn’t have that ace. They added CC and they won it all. Their pitching was the biggest reason why.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 7:01 PM EDT up reply actions
im sure paying Santana 23 mil for his half a season last year
was better than paying Beltran 18 mil for his half a season.
there aren’t many people who should get 18+ mil a year, pitchers especially since they are the biggest injury risk. but if i could go back and choose one of those two to give a big contract to, i would definitely choose beltran
I like Ike
What?
2001: Mussina and Clemens are awesome
2002: Mussina and Clemens are still awesome
2003: Mussina and Clemens are still awesome, Pettitte and Wells merely very good
2004: problems because their starters were all old and injured
2005: same as 2004
2006: Mussina and Wang are both very good
2007: their pitching sucks
2008: Mussina is awesome again at 39, somehow
The Yankees had some very good pitching 2000-2008, which was a big part of why they pretty much always made the playoffs. The fact is, the playoffs are a crapshoot, so they didn’t win any World Series during that stretch, but to say that they were lacking an ace is a vast oversimplification.
by JoshNY on Jul 16, 2010 7:31 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
He only won 20 games once. Therefore, he sucks.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 17, 2010 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions
I'll bet that 20 win season puts Mussina into the HOF.
Now he’s got a narrative: “excellent pitcher goes out on top.” He’s exactly the kind of guy—extremely good for a very long time, almost never great, little black ink—that has a lot of trouble making the Hall of Fame.
I just hope when he goes in
they have the sense to put him in as an Oriole, not a Skankee
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
for the record, Pagan is making 1.45 million
see for yourself
http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tfJWfaPG4VXbDyBscIZf1MQ&output=html
but he is also a second year arb player, those guys don’t get paid much
I like Ike
Pagan is absolutely a great value for what he's making
but that doesn’t prove anything about Beltran.
You already gave me a fake stroke.
You are NOT going to get me to slag Santana’s worth just to defend Beltran, who should need no defending.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
again, get your facts straight
Beltran in 5 years (not counting this season) for the Mets put up a total of 25 WAR, which when you factor in that 1 WAR is worth $4 Million, has produced already $100 Million of his $119 Million contract. Assuming he doesn’t get traded, he only needs to put up 4.75 WAR for the rest of this this season plus next season to justify the value of his contract. As long as he doesn’t lose his ability to hit or play centerfield and doesn’t lose significant time to any additional injury, he can easily exceed that 4.75 WAR.
by secret defense on Jul 16, 2010 7:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Hi Joe Benigno
I KNOW that I heard Benigno spew that bullshit on air during the one day I listened to him last month. Either you are Benigno or you take everything the guy says to heart. So tell me, what type of money was Beltran playing for in 2006 when he hit 41 home runs and put up a .982 OPS? Obviously, he was trying to get a contract extension that year. How about in 2007? How about last year when he was putting up a .915 OPS before he got hurt (and the Mets pushed him for a month, making the injury worse)? Or 2001-2003?
I don’t understand the contract BS one bit…this isn’t Adrian Beltre we’re talking about who put up an OPS over 1.000 in 2004 when his career OPS is .785. It’s unbelievable how people can be so biased, all because the guy doesn’t have a big toothy grin all the time and plays the game effortlessly.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 16, 2010 7:44 PM EDT up reply actions
not to mention the 7.1 WAR season in 2008
I like Ike
The man has given it his all his entire career. Something people don't understand is
He has no cartilage in his knee. When he runs his bone literally scrapes against another bone. I don’t have it, but I’m sure it hurts like a motherfucker because the surgery to fix it would be to cut open his knee and break the bone.
by Evan_S on Jul 16, 2010 8:19 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Oh, come on.
They’re just microfractures. They can’t hurt that much. They’re wee!
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:27 PM EDT up reply actions
MFer.
Does degree-of-difficulty matter to you at all?
Then how about the fact that Beltran’s doing this “meaningless” producing on knees that don’t have cartilage in them.
But your nagging-feeling detector is probably accounting for that already, so I don’t even know why I’m mentioning ARRRRGGHkdsak jnvva,v.
(Great. Now you’ve given me a stroke.)
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions
Beltran shouldn't even be back until his knees are 100%
Why create a logjam in the outfield if you aren’t even fully recovered…? Or am I missing something here?
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
IF HE DIDN'T PLAY WHEN HIS KNEES WEREN'T "100%"...`
… THEN HE WOULD HAVE SUITED UP FOR ABOUT A WEEK’S WORTH OF GAMES.
(Sorry about the “yelling.” Aftereffect of said bad-taste fake stroke. Also, this is getting kind of infuriating.)
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
logjam? thats funny
we got pagan out there and a way underperforming bay
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
"Or am I missing something here?"
You need to ask?
Hilarious.
Though now that I think about it, Francouer is a log, so his very presence could create a logjam.
i think it is pretty clear from the response
this post is an overwhelming win
I like Ike
by astromets on Jul 16, 2010 7:43 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
Best shape of it's life
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Jul 16, 2010 8:46 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
"pomo" at the end of that URL really looks like something a bit NSFW to the untrained eye
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
So did anyone catch Beltran dogging it to first base in the 9th?
I wonder what excuses await this.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
In a game that close,
why would Beltran dog it to first base? Like Gary said, either his legs aren’t there yet, or he was just being lazy, and either way it’s a problem.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 9:53 PM EDT up reply actions
Maybe it was the bone-on-bone action going on in his knee?..
(sexual references/jokes aside)
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Wait
Why is he back if there’s still bone scraping against bone in his leg or whatever? We were lead to believe that he’s good to go.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 16, 2010 10:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Wait
WHEN exactly did you begin rooting for this team? I’m honestly not busting your balls…
It's a game of redeeming features. ~ Bob Murphy
No, no, please
go right ahead and bust his balls. Please.
Dude, you can't just magically put more cartilage in a guys knee.
That’s something you do once you’re done playing.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
No we weren't
He should’ve had the surgery LAST year. Yet the Mets FO wanted him to play those meaningful games in September, which he did, despite having no cartilege in his knee.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 7:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Unless it is David Wright every night.
I remember this one time when Phillips hit a bullet of a grounder at Reyes and Reyes threw him out by 20 feet as Phillips jogged to first. Wright led off the next half inning, his a dribbler to shortstop, got thrown out by a step, and Gary said, “If you want to know the difference between David Wright and Brandon Phillips, you need only watch each of them ground out to shortstop in the last inning”
I love David and all, but there are lots and lots of time when he doesn’t run out ground balls. It’s a long season, in hot weather, and guys get tired and don’t run every ground ball out. It’s not a big deal, especially not for a guy coming back off of knee surgery.
LeBron: Yo Dwyane, dead ass you won't fuck my mom? Or Bosh neither?
I would definitely not want Beltran to run out every ground ball.
Why increase the chance of reinjuring himself when 499 times out of 500 there would be no point. THAT would absolutely be the definition of “false hustle”.
Nobody's mentioned it yet
but the closing line is pretty awesome too. If you have any questions, post some comments.
Not quite as good as “I put a lot of work into this fanpost and think you should rec it,” but still pretty amusing
2009 Did Not Happen
My question:
Did you work hard to post something that dumb?
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 17, 2010 1:12 AM EDT reply actions
ilikeike#29 is a bum!!!
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
I admit...
I used to get on Beltran’s case because he “made the big money”, but I never thought he was a bum. Compared to the listless corner OF guys he’s always surrounded with, he used to put up pretty amazing numbers.
Jason Bay and Frenchy, now there are TWO useless bums. GET RID OF FRENCHY NOW!
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
Frenchy's gonna get hot again
He WILL go on another .439-type streak again and rack up the RBI’s in the process…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 12:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Except he won't
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 12:22 PM EDT up reply actions
Let me fix that for you
He will go in another .439-type streak again and rack up the RBI's in the process...
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 12:27 PM EDT up reply actions
Is that the new "Sarcasm Font" thing?
Because I was actually being serious. It’s common knowledge that Frenchy is a tale of two players, one who hits .154 for a stretch or one who hits .439 for a stretch…it’s unfathomable to think he’ll be this bad for much longer…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
"it’s unfathomable to think he’ll be this bad for much longer…"
See:
Jeff Francoeur, 2008
Jeff Francoeur, 2009
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 17, 2010 12:42 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
or Jeff Francoeur in 2006
but we all know he's a great player and a clubhouse leader
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Let's say this is true
Let’s agree that Francoeur is a particularly streaky player. For a stretch of 10 days, he will carry the team on his back. But how many days of bad performance should the Mets tolerate in order to get those 10 days of excellence? And why should the Mets bother waiting, if it is basically inevitable at this point that he will revert to the deep, horrifying slumps?
Word
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 1:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep
If you want to heap praise on a guy for 10 day hot streaks, you also have to slam him for the 30 day freezing cold streaks. All players are streaky to some extent — that’s why we look offensive contributions over the course of a whole season. Francoeur has a .688 OPS, worst among all MLB rightfielders by a healthy margin. I don’t get fans’ rabid defense of this guy. He’s pretty clearly terrible. Actually I do get it — fans are either morons or trolls.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 17, 2010 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions
One comment Gary made a few games back
That you have conveniently neglected to mention: Since arriving to the Mets, Jeff Francoeur has led the team in several offensive categories.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 1:56 PM EDT up reply actions
He played half a season
where Beltran, Wright and Reyes all missed significant time
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
this
and also, dont just say that but back it up with stats man
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
this guy doesn't believe stats
he trusts his eyes more than trivial measurements like stats
by secret defense on Jul 17, 2010 4:44 PM EDT up reply actions
i guess rbi's are not trivial measurements
they must get to the heart of a players true talent level
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
and when Beltran gets rbis they are meaningless pile on runs in blowouts
and when Francoeur gets rbizzz he’s clutch and a winner
by secret defense on Jul 17, 2010 6:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Mario Mendoza has more ML hits than Bryce Harper!
Plus, he’s got a line named after him!
BRING ME THIS MENDOZA!
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:36 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Umm
you know that the Mets had Wilson Valdez, Cory Sullivan and Jeremy Reed starting a lot of games last year, right? Not exactly a high bar to jump.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 17, 2010 3:59 PM EDT up reply actions
Oh btw
I’m loving how you enjoy free reign to call people “morons,” yet I’m warned/banned at the slightest provocation. Double standards make me a sad Jeff Francoeur-supporting, WFAN-listening panda.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
because you're an obvious troll
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 2:08 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm not a fucking troll
Unless you think every single Mets fan on planet earth who likes Jeff Francoeur is a troll. GKR seem to like Francoeur, I guess they’re all trolls too.
Take a cue from Yankee fans. Nick Swisher will never be the most talented player on any team, but he fits that team like a glove. They love having him there and while he isn’t the best hitter or defender, he still does the job reasonably well. You can bring in someone with 10x the talent, but Swisher is a vital cog in that team…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Um,
Nick Swisher is better at baseball than Jeff is.
"I want to win now, not 3 years from now. That's my stance." - Kevin Burkhardt
The point is
Neither are anywhere near the best option for either team in RF, baseball talent-wise
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
But now you can't imagine the Yankees without Swisher
I’m also reminded of Paul O Neill. What i’m saying is, the guy deserve more of a shot than what you’ve given him.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:25 PM EDT up reply actions
Nick Swisher isn't bad at baseball.
Jeff Francoeur is bad at baseball.
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
Swisher: .392 wOBA, 2.9 WAR
Francoeur: .296 wOBA, 0.0 WAR
by EtSuKe on Jul 18, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Neither Newark nor Mercury
… is within 1000 miles of the sun.
One of them’s a little closer, though.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Because calling some one a "moron"
is so much worse than calling someone a “bitch”…
Save Jenrry Mejia!
I apologize for that.
It was out of line and didn’t mean it…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 3:03 PM EDT up reply actions
The trick is...
… playing him when he’s going to go on one of those .439 for a month stretches. It takes a discerning eye to figure that out— the same sort of eye that can look into the heart of a fantastic Met outfielder who’s been playing the entirety of his Met career on shockless wheels, so to speak, and make out his hidden lack of desire.
I guess what I’m trying to say is, why don’t you have your uniform on, bub? Get in the dugout— this team needs you!
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Two things
1) You can’t get the good without the bad with Francoeur. He’ll give you those hot streaks, but only if you play him through the slumps. From what I’ve seen of his hot streaks, it’s worth the wait every time.
2) I’m not sure where you were trying to go with the “get your uniform on” comment, but I play college baseball, which is probably more than can be said for 90% of you. Chances are, when I say something about effort, clubhouses, etc. I am speaking from a degree of experience superior to yours.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
Two responses
1) The bad (no plate discipline, diminshed power, iffy-at-best range and baserunning speed) or meh doesn’t just outweigh the good (nice, hardworking dude; cannon arm); it dwarves the good.
2) I was suggesting that since you can sniff out Beltran’s lack of effort from afar, you might be best suited to smell when a Frenchy hot streak is coming on, and a coaching job.
I played varsity in high school, played some club ball in college. I do not know what the inside of a Division I (or II or III or NAIA) baseball clubhouse smells like, postgame. I do, however, use facts to support my arguments rather than assumptions and blind assertions (which— hint, hint— is why everybody here is jumping on you, NOT because you like Francoeur).
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 17, 2010 2:44 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
My brother played college baseball
and he said he’d rather have a good player who is an asshole than a clubhouse leader who sucks.
What is it Leo Durocher said? “Nice Guys Finish Last”?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
your brother should be the official baseball guy
of AA. So that when people come in talking about club houses presences and what fatcesca says we have a built in rebutter.
I want Jerry Manuel fired now, not three years from now. That is my stance.- John Peterson
That'd be cool
“Firejerrynow’s brother says…”
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 19, 2010 7:27 AM EDT up reply actions
Well, unfathomable...
except for the part where it’s fathomable. After all, Francouer is hitting at around his career level.
Please explain what you think is so great about Francoeur
is it the 10 game stretch in 162 games where he bats .439 and .200 the rest the season?
is it the great arm but lousy range that he has?
is it the career .310 OBP and .315 wOBA?
is it the career 1.585 WAR per 700 PA (compared to 5.388 of Beltran)?
tell me, what gets you wins? It is a player’s clubhouse presence or his offensive and defensive production?
by secret defense on Jul 17, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Anyone who has actually WATCHED him play right field
And doesn’t blindly subscribe to numbers, will see that he’s been a ridiculously good outfielder. He gets to every ball hit in his vicinity. If he plays too deep and a ball is hit shallow, he’ll run like freaking Usain Bolt to get there. Not to mention all the runners who stopped in their tracks @ 3rd to avoid being thrown out.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 17, 2010 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions
yeah, you just proved that you don't have any idea what you are talking about
when you comparing him to Usain Bolt. You are blind if you think he has better range than Beltran or Pagan. I’ll take a RF who can get to the ball for the put out over a RF who can’t get to the ball and prevents the runner from advancing anyday. Also WAR takes into account both offense and defense. so instead of making totally ridiculous hyperboles of your favorite player, how about for once you back your claims with facts.
by secret defense on Jul 17, 2010 2:09 PM EDT up reply actions
in backing up your claims
I want you to explain why his defense is good enough to outweigh these deficiencies.
the 10 game stretch in 162 games where he bats .439 and .200 the rest the season
the career .310 OBP and .315 wOBA?
the career 1.585 WAR per 700 PA (compared to 5.388 of Beltran)
the 0 WAR this year and -0.6 WAR over the last 3 years
by secret defense on Jul 17, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions
this made me lol
he’ll run like freaking Usain Bolt to get there
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
It's true, though!
Well, except for the part where Francouer is, you know, actually slow.
i dont think he is slow
but he is no angel pagan, let alone freaking usain bolt
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
the thing is
at this point i dont think anyone who wants frenchy on the team even wants him to go on a crazy streak like that because that will just give the front office the idea of keeping him around when he should not
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Agreed.
If he starts hitting well it probably means more time on the bench for Pagan, meaning that it won’t actually improve the Mets chances of making the postseason. And, it improves immeasurably the chances that the FO does something extraordinarily stupid like taking Francouer to arbitration and paying him $7.5 million next year. That means they’ll probably trade Pagan in order not to pay him $5m+ in arbitration. And that’s actually the best case scenario. The worst case is Francouer goes on a tear, appears to have fired the Mets into the postseason, and gets a three year deal. 3/25, anyone?
How does Bay start hitting homers
if he’s benched?
And why is Francoeur better than Bay?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
He hits like Thole hits
It doesn’t matter if he’s on the bench or not; they get things done on the field, regardless.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 17, 2010 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions
It's Jerryball, right?
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 17, 2010 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Must be
I wish my thread wasn’t locked; I’d add that into the book of Jerryball.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 17, 2010 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
So, anonymous edited the fanpost title. /Prince'd
In lobby campaign for Chris Carter.
by Michkin on Jul 17, 2010 1:04 PM EDT reply actions 3 recs
and there's no way Bay should be benched in favor of Frenchy
Bay at his worst is still better than Francoeur
"we believe in comebacks"
I would look to give Bay the occasional day off against a lefthanded starter,
put Pagan in LF, Belt in CF, and Francouer in RF. That way I’m picking my spots and not waiting until Bay is clearly exhausted, then having to bench him when most of my good hitters are already out with nicks and bruises. The way someone did a few weeks back.
This is just as terrible as the first post
Francoeur is the worst RF in baseball. Beltran is a future hall of famer. This is fail
is Beltran a future HOFamer?
I think he should give in but I think he’s anything but a lock now.
I want Jerry Manuel fired now, not three years from now. That is my stance.- John Peterson
Oh
I was speaking in the way that Tim Raines and Bert Blyleven are a hall of famers and Jim Rice, Phil Rizzuto, and Bill Mazeroski aren’t.
Phil Rizutto = Hall of Famer and Gil Hodges = Not.
Fail.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 18, 2010 11:05 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
We should have a thread on this.
He just doesn’t have the time in yet (games played, plate appearances), or the counting stats, or the large amount of black ink that would let him get in despite a short career.
He doesn’t have 60 career WAR yet, which is a pretty good dividing line for in and out of the Hall. Kenny Lofton has 65+ iirc. Beltran only has 54.7 WAR so far. That’s 15th among active players, 200th overall. It’s Bobby Abreu and Jack Clark and Frank Tanana and Bret Saberhagen territory. I don’t think Beltran has done anything over and above his stats that would get him the “Fame” part of the “Hall of Fame”. 2004 just isn’t enough. Neither is his postseason record. It might have been a significant help to his chances if Houston had won the WS that year, but it didn’t work out that way.
I know he has injury concerns
But I can’t imagine a scenario he doesn’t get to at least a 65 WAR. If the worst is behind him, injury wise that it, he could get to 70, and the only hitters at 70 WAR and above not in the Hall of Fame are those not yet eligible (Pujols, Bagwell, A-Rod, Chipper, Thomas, Griffey & Bonds. All pretty much shoe-ins.), Pete Rose, and Bill Dahlen (who?). Just to make the numbers easy, lets say he’s work 1.4 wins the rest of this year to get to 56 WAR, he’d then really have to have one more great season (5+ WAR), one more really good season (3.5-5 WAR), and the 2 or 3 solid years (2 WAR) to get there. He’ll be 34 next season, so unless this is really a career altering injury for him, he should get to Dwight Evans territory at just north of 60.
i really dont get this line
I think Beltran can’t really make up for 06, but I can’t see him staying healthy.
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
2006 was his best season ever
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Wow, are you some kind of idiot? Who remembers the regular season and even most of the playoffs where he was awesome?
He struck out LOOKING to LOSE the NLCS!. Obviously that one at bat far outweighs the rest of his spectacular season. You must not be a very smart and objective individual.
haha you had me going there for a second
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
frenchy is not good!
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
also
prove to us how bay is better than frenchy, please
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
frenchy is better than bay
fixed
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
"Bay should be benched, at least until he starts hitting homers."
you and JerMan would get along great each other. He would agree that you’d agree with him, and that would be fucking logic.
Wow, a sitebot retraction
That may be a first.
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
Site Bot is human
It’s a cyborg. It has feelings. I think Site Bot got hammered at Finn MacCool’s tonight and had a change of heart.
by James Kannengieser on Jul 18, 2010 5:10 AM EDT up reply actions
Bot gettin' soft.
I think we might need to take care of a Bot.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 18, 2010 8:42 AM EDT up reply actions
he needs a dickey like upgrade to harden some
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
I bet SiteBot doesn't shave. SiteBot is gritty.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 18, 2010 10:07 PM EDT up reply actions
What I meant was...
Bot might have to get got. You feel me?
It’s tur’ble, but the game is the game.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 19, 2010 12:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I should have known better than to read the interweb after a few days away from it.
I’ll never get those minutes back.
"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez
by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jul 18, 2010 12:33 AM EDT reply actions
you probably missed the first one
it was more in depth
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Bay should be taking the brunt of the heat
Not Francoeur. When you compare salaries and expectations with production, Bay has been exponentially more disappointing than Francoeur. God, what a bust that signing was. I’ve had it up to HERE with that guy. I don’t want to hear about hustle, I don’t want to hear about effort, and I definitely don’t want to hear that he’s been hitting some singles and doubles lately. The fact is, he was brought here to do two things – hit for power and drive in runs – and he’s been a JOKE at both.
URGH. I can’t stand Jason Bay.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
I made a short FanPost earlier
defending Beltran and toning down my pro-Francoeur rhetoric, but people were being a$$holes about it, so I deleted it – thanks for nothing.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 12:18 PM EDT up reply actions
Either way,
Bay is a bum, agreed?
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 12:19 PM EDT up reply actions
It was a nice enough post
In that anything apologizing for being an ass is nice. But dude, you want plaudits for bringing us the “common man” perspective? We’re up to our fucking eyeballs in the common man — or, willfully obtuse — perspective.
We prize players who give their all, who play hurt, who grind it out. WHICH IS WHY WE LOVE BELTRAN. Apart from his probable Hall of Fame numbers, he has played hurt almost his entire Mets career, he mentors the younger players (Pagan spends the offseason training at Beltran’s house), and he is, I believe, the only Mets player reported to care so much about the team’s collapse as to be in tears over it. Good god, what is wrong with this fan base?
by SuperT on Jul 18, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Didn't know all those things about Beltran
that’s pretty cool…
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
I wonder why
perhaps because you listen to WFAN?
by JohnPeterson on Jul 18, 2010 2:47 PM EDT up reply actions
Do you remember in 2005 when he collided with Mike Cameron in the OF
in early August? He came back after a couple of days and played the rest of that season with a fractured face! That was enough for me to think of him as a warrior. He also played all of 05 with a quad injury and has had a number of injuries he’s played through the last few years (including the bone bruise last year that he played through for a month when he should’ve been resting it…if he’d rested it, he might not have needed to be out until now).
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 18, 2010 3:09 PM EDT up reply actions
So Beltran is everyone's darling for playing thru pain...
while Francoeur and Cora, who did the same, get no love?
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions
Sure they get a little
but then I remember that they just aren’t that good and their injuries are making them that much worse. Francoeur was okay last year playing through his injured thumb but you have to admit that Cora was terrible playing through his thumb injuries last year. I give him credit as a person, but it wasn’t really worth it to the team.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 18, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
well beltran is awesome
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Beltran is excellent at baseball
Francoeur and Cora are bad at baseball. Seriously, if Francoeur was in AAA he’d have a .280/.310/.450 batting line. That may be generous.
Cora WAS solid at baseball.
Frenchy was never really more than lucky.
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
cora was a solid backup at baseball
but thats about it. his one good season full time starting was 2004. in 2002 he was good too, but had 293 PA
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
IIRC he's been one of the team's best hitters with men in scoring position
That oughta be worth something.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 8:39 PM EDT up reply actions
Jason Bay's been around the same
in nearly thrice as many PA with RISP
http://www.baseball-reference.com/play-index/split_stats_team.cgi?full=1¶ms=bases|RISP|NYM|2010|bat|AB|
That oughta be worth something.
Cora: .308/.356/.436 in 45 PA with RISP
Bay: .264/.373/.440 in 113 PA with RISP
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
Copy and paste the whole URL (through the AB| part)
it messed up
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
As men, yes.
I mean, playing infield with a fractured thumb has got to be the worst sort of hand pain there is, apart from, say, catching with a hand fracture.
As players, well… Beltran’s still an All-Star when playing hurt. Very few players are… and guys who aren’t that great to start with are even less capable when “gritting it out.”
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 19, 2010 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
This whole part
We prize players who give their all, who play hurt, who grind it out. WHICH IS WHY WE LOVE BELTRAN. Apart from his probable Hall of Fame numbers, he has played hurt almost his entire Mets career, he mentors the younger players (Pagan spends the offseason training at Beltran’s house), and he is, I believe, the only Mets player reported to care so much about the team’s collapse as to be in tears over it. Good god, what is wrong with this fan base?
Well said
"I want to win now, not 3 years from now. That's my stance." - Kevin Burkhardt
Playing extremely hurt without outcry, fantastic defensively (while hurt), good to amazing offensively (while hurt)...
Hell, maybe he should curse more, change his first name to something alliterative with his last, and develop a charming drinking problem. ‘Cause, on-field, he’s doing a pretty good poor-man’s-Mantle.
by LeiterMilnerFasterStronger on Jul 19, 2010 1:01 PM EDT up reply actions
You could say the same things about your fanboy Francoeur
except for the salary
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 18, 2010 12:23 PM EDT up reply actions
Well, salary and expectations
are significant factors in my book, dunno about you.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions
The thing is, what matters is what the players are projected to do in the future
Francoeur is projected to suck and Beltran, Bay, and Pagan are projected to be good.
If Bay is projected to be good,
why has he sucked all season? When will he magically flip the switch?
If he has a terrible year, which looks likely, what does that say about “projections”?
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 1:53 PM EDT up reply actions
The projections are updated throughout the season
and the projections have gone down, but you can’t ignore Bay whole career of being a great hitter. See David Wright, 2009.
Thing is, he hasn't really "sucked".
“Sucking” is having a .686 OPS with an OBP below .300 and a SLG that’s middling in the high .300’s.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
This is where paying too much attention to stats
becomes a hinderence. He has been a flat-out bust this season. I don’t care WHAT the numbers say. Have you WATCHED Bay hit?
…I haven’t either.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 4:20 PM EDT up reply actions
"Hindrance"
Look, NO ONE DISAGREES that Bay hasn’t been as good as advertised. No one. But he still provides value.
He’s been slugging a full 30 points higher than Francoeur, has an OBP around league average instead of below .300, etc., etc. There’s no reason to bench him for an inferior player.
Even if you want to use RBI’s to prove your point that Jason Bay “ain’t producing the runs, bro”, he has 44 RBI’s compared to Frenchy’s 42.
And here’s the thing about salaries: they’ve already been paid. No matter what we do, we’re not getting Frenchy or Bay’s money back. So does it really matter who’s being paid more when it comes to playing time? Of course not. Don’t be naive.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
by squid92 on Jul 18, 2010 4:32 PM EDT up reply actions 3 recs
it's probably not worth your time and effort
to try to convince him with reason and such things as “stats”. His opinion is worth more than anything. This whole thread is a testament to that.
by secret defense on Jul 18, 2010 4:38 PM EDT up reply actions
this isnt even his thread
unless he has created another account on which to be an even bigger troll – troll denial to follow
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Never accuse me of something like that again.
I go to school and work full-time, I’m not some outright LOSER who would troll on even one account, let alone two. I’m just a guy who likes to come home at the end of the day and talk Mets baseball. If you don’t like that, tough.
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 8:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Best. Thread. Ever.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 18, 2010 10:19 PM EDT reply actions
Geddy should be added to the memes list
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
I didn't make this thread
Learning to read is key, slugger
Yes, I like Jeff Francoeur and listen to WFAN. No, I am not a troll.
by GeddyLeeIsGod on Jul 18, 2010 10:52 PM EDT up reply actions
I'm aware
You’ve been a key highlight of this thread though.
http://www.doublebobbyjones.com/ -Double Bobby Jones: a Mets blog
Along with the majority of recent threads.
Can you say “attention whore”?
2010: Year of the Grission
In My World, There Is No Such Thing As Off-Topic!
That's why we need that banhammer...right fucking now!
2010: Year of the Grission
In My World, There Is No Such Thing As Off-Topic!
I didn't make this man.
God did. God is Dead.
by tmac1337 on Jul 18, 2010 10:58 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Carlos Beltran is the ubermench
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jul 18, 2010 11:06 PM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
this post has the longest string of rec'd comments ever
I like Ike, I hate Jerry
Not even close...
This thread has the longest string of rec’d comments ever.
The one and only mistermet on teh Interwebz!
by Steve Schreiber on Jul 19, 2010 2:31 AM EDT up reply actions
this post is never going to end
I want Jerry Manuel fired now, not three years from now. That is my stance.- John Peterson
Can I ask one question about Geddyleesgod?
If you go to a website, and everything you post is disagreed on by everyone, why do you continue to go to that website? Does he think that he is going to change everyone’s opinion? This is a website that bases everything on statistics and Geddy keeps trying to go completely against that. There are many other message boards out there that agree with him, yet he keeps coming back to this one that never does.
This
There’s a great site for GeddyLeesGod. Everyone will agree with him.
"We're investigating the investigative procedure of the investigation of Tony Bernazard"---Omar Minaya (he really didn't say it but he would"
by firejerrynow on Jul 19, 2010 7:57 PM EDT up reply actions
I don't necessarily agree with that.
It’s a free country, he can do what he wants. However, when you take a contrary opinion on 95% of what’s discussed…yeah, maybe for your own sake, you should try a different forum.
John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.
Okay... concerned about sitebot
Little worried, I havent seen sitebot here, I think this threat actually killed it. Anyone know next of kin to contact?
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