Mets Have Fifth-Worst Farm System In Baseball
by Eric Simon on Jan 26, 2011 12:45 PM EST
Email
PrintKeith Law has posted his 2011 MLB organizational rankings at ESPN (subscription required), and the Mets rank 26th overall.
26. New York Mets
Earth to Fred Wilpon: This is what a strict adherence to slot recommendations will buy you. Parsimony has its price.
The Braves are ranked 3rd, Phillies are ranked 5th, and the Yankees are ranked 9th, so the Mets' chief divisional and geographical rivals have all done a better job stocking their farms with talent and depth. Law doesn't go into detail about most teams so it isn't clear if he has excluded guys like Josh Thole, Dillon Gee, or Fernando Martinez. Not that there's a likely superstar among them, but I'd expect the system to rank higher than 26th if any or all of them were included in the group.
Ike Davis and Jon Niese are recent graduates of the Mets farm system, which doesn't excuse the organizational lack of succeeding prospects in their place, but it should be a credit to the Mets for having developed them in the last few years.
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Is there anyone out there who still thinks that Omar should still be GM?
Anyone? Anyone? Bueller? Bueller?
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
I get our ranking even if it's a tad lower than I think.
But how are the Phils #5 overall? Dominic Brown plus a couple low level bats?
yeah you'd figure they'd be fairly gutted after all the trading theyve done recently
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 26, 2011 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, I call BS on that
Overrating a LOT of “good tools, no results” players plus calling Singleton the next big thing because he had a good two months.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 1:09 PM EST up reply actions
well
idk if i’d rank them #5 but they’re definitely good and i’m pretty certain the basis for law’s philly ranking isn’t as much singleton as it is the group of 4 power arms they’ve recently collected in biddle, may, cosart & colvin. every org has good arms at the lower levels but these guys are all around the A-ball level, which isn’t actually that low when you factor that these guys are all considered potential fast movers.
even with their recent trades they’ve been great in the draft and thats where they got these guys. all 4 throw hard and have top of the rotation potential. fortunately i will say that the mets could be brewing a similar such group with our current crop of impressive teenage arms and come this time next year may see that reflected in the rankings.
by Rob Castellano on Jan 26, 2011 1:24 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, they’ve got some good arms. But almost no impact bats outside of Brown. I’m not saying they have a lousy farm system but 5th? Come on, that’s total BS.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 1:33 PM EST up reply actions
Also
Biddle has 40+ IP in the pros, no higher than short season NYPL. Cosart has 95 total innings, no higher than the Sally. In fact, I don’t believe any of those guys have seen A+ yet nor have more than one season of pro ball under their belts. Cosart has elbow issues. May has command issues. Biddle is probably the best of the four.
What I’m saying is these are all intriguing arms. But they do not, in any way, make for a believeable 5th overall farm system.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 1:38 PM EST up reply actions
maybe
It all depends on how much you like the lottery ticket approach. Take as many high-upside types as you can get/pay for, and then hope one or two of them pan out and become real impact players. Brown appears to be on his way. And Singleton hit like a beast for the first half of 2010 in Low-A, regressed to respectability in the second half but maintained excellent plate discipline, all while 18 years old.
Plenty of high-upside guys in James, Altherr, Dugan, Santana, etc.
Cosart, Colvin, May, and Biddle all have a very good chance of being mid-rotation or better.
Anyway, we’ll see how it all works out.
http://www.thegoodphight.com
I'm a bigger fan of Sickels' approach to ranking prospects.
I hate the all tools, don’t look at production approach. Especially for position players who usually don’t just all of sudden learn how to hit.
The problem with that approach is that you ignore the kids who haven't grown into their "man-bodies" yet.
Guys like Puello would be drastically underrated.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
I'm not discarding tools either.
There is a balance. But sometimes you see a prospect who Ks 40% of the time, doesn’t draw a walk for weeks at a time and he gets ranked high because he’s fast and might be able to hit homers if his projected power comes along.
The comment reads "Earth to Fred Wilpon?"
Paperman is that you?
It's a triumph of number crunching over the human spirit...aaaaaand, it’s about time. -- Play-by-Play Announcer, The Simpsons.
HELLO HELLO MR WILPON!!!!
WE WANT THE MANSION NOT THE CONDO!!!!!
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Jan 26, 2011 2:33 PM EST up reply actions 5 recs
It's not just slot adherence that hurt the farm, but they made several questionable drafts along the way.
Scouting and player development should be improved as well.
In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis
The Unwritten Rules of AA
What are you talking about?
Ruff Eddie Kunz was clearly a worthy first round pick.
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Jan 26, 2011 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
i think it's a misprint
the line should read, “Earth to Jeff Wilpon: you’re unqualified to run a self-serve car wash. Go have fun at the country club and stay out of daddy’s businesses.”
"they're still shitty"
by Help!I'maRock! on Jan 26, 2011 1:26 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
The depth is getting under-rated
I think the system is still more like 16-20 range. Matt Eddy has said he thought that’s where they’d be on the BA ranking, and it looks like my favorite numbers guy Mark Jerkatis (http://baseballnumbers-diamondfutures.blogspot.com/) has them at least 20 or higher as well.
That said, while the depth is good for a change, it seems like the strategy has maybe been a bit too much to go for quantity of good prospects over more expensive high quality elite talents. This has been true even in the international market, where they bargain far more often then they have signed the most recognized prospects. The Mets have actually done a decent job of finding bargains, and I think the player development, especially on the hitting side, has been much improved lately.
I still do think it’s a good thing, for example, that two guys who have apparently been retained, while much of the system does get an overhaul, are the minor league hitting co-ordinator and the director of international scouting.
But they need to supplement that depth by investing in a few more premium talents. I actually then there’s a pretty good number of future big league regulars in the system right now though; I would guess you’ll actually produce 5 guys (out of over a dozen decent candidates) who graduate in the next 3 years who will be average regulars at some point, not counting the guys who have already graduated (Davis, Niese, Thole). But they need more upside there.
Agreed with pretty much everything.
The reason we really get panned is our lack of pitching prospects and the ability to develop them. It’s Mejia than a couple guys at A- ball.
Yeah
The lack of pitching is a big part of it but I think what kills this system with law and BA is the lack of high upside talent like acer said. There’s good depth offensively and some really interesting players but there just isn’t that slam dunk, potential superstar stud that most other systems have, aside from maybe mejia.
by Rob Castellano on Jan 26, 2011 6:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
He does, give him another year and he'll be the next big thing.
He’s 18 and only has a half season of A+ ball. The guys who get the surefire can’t miss prospect tag are usually guys who have some AA experience at least.
He's almost there
Flores isn’t quite that elite yet. He’s not toolsy enough to say he’s proven yet that he’s that good. The hit tool is excellent, based mostly on strong hand eye co-ordination. His pure hitting ability is comparable to a guy like Starlin Castro, who moved quickly through the minors and hit .300 in MLB this year. But that’s the only real standout tool right now. His speed is poor, and defense is uncertain. The very good hands and good arm strength could make him a pretty good 3B prospect, but he hasn’t even played the position yet.
I think to be top 30 he probably has to actually either show the defensive ability to be an asset defensively at 3B, or show more of the power that people think will develop.
And not even Mejia
Actually, for Law I think Mejia was considered ineligible (as well as Martinez). That probably explains much of the difference between Law and BA. Really if you consider Mejia and Martinez ineligible, I don’t really disagree much with the ranking. I’m not sure Flores is a top 50 guy yet, and Harvey is maybe only just a top 100 guy. I do think there’s some pretty good depth in B to C+ guys still (mainly bats), but with the top end that thin, 21-23 would seem right to me.
And the pitching behind Harvey is pretty thin, mostly all bullpen arms with a couple of back end SP. Urbina could turn into a good SP prospect, but he’s still a long way away.
Last night,
MLB network had the top 50 prospects in baseball. I admit I didn’t see all of it, but I did see 80% of the show, and not one Mets prospect was mentioned. It seems like Yanks, Braves, Jays, and Phils are doing well in that department.
Not including Wilmer on a top 50 is a major omission.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:21 PM EST up reply actions
Flores was #58
Mejia was ineligible, but Mayo said via twitter he’d have been top 10 if eligible.
I’d agree with the Mejia ranking but Flories, IMO, is top 30.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:40 PM EST up reply actions
I would think if Aderlin, Puello, Ceciliani and Vaughn
put up really good numbers again this year, that would have to vault them into the discussion for top 50 or at least top 100 prospects. Plus, Harvey should be right there too, if he has a strong year with his pedigree. And if Havens ever gets healthy, how is he not one of the better 2b prospects in all of baseball? What minor league 2b have his power?
If they all have good years (unlikely that they all do, but still) we could have 6 in the top-100 plus Familia.
Harvey and Havens could be top-25.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
I saw it too
One thing is for sure: People who consider the Rays out of contention this season need to reconsider their argument. Also, what the hell is Dayton Moore doing in KC? I believe there were 6 Royals prospects on that list, and at least half were major-league ready at some point in 2010.
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Dayton Moore is the Dr. Jekyll and Mr. Hyde of GMs
He is Jekyll with the minors, and Hyde at the MLB level.
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
by Russ on Jan 26, 2011 2:44 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
He'll probably tell you
That Jeff Francoeur is closer to major-league ready than, say, Moustakas, simply because of his experience.
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Francoeur is closer to MLB ready
because of his winning smile!
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
Francoeur is closer to MLB ready
because of his winning smile!
*fixed
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 27, 2011 8:00 AM EST up reply actions
not one cracked the list last year
79-83
by SuperSantana on Jan 26, 2011 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
Also another snub. Mejia and/or Ike should have ranked in the top 50.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:42 PM EST up reply actions
I don't understand what the problem is ....
Our farm system is still in the top 100 worlwide ….
by brooklynlou on Jan 26, 2011 2:00 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
I see what you did there.
It's a triumph of number crunching over the human spirit...aaaaaand, it’s about time. -- Play-by-Play Announcer, The Simpsons.
by MookieTheCat on Jan 26, 2011 2:01 PM EST up reply actions
The fifth-worst farm system concept is a little bit arbitrary
If Ike Davis had been kept in the minors all year and he’d hit .350/.450/.600 beating up on AAA pitching instead of helping the big team, then he’d probably be an “A” prospect and our farm system would be much more highly ranked…but it wouldn’t actually change the team’s situation one bit.
We just used up the rookie eligibility of 6 of our top prospects this year, so obviously the upper levels are a bit weak now. But there’s better depth at the lower levels than the Mets have had in a while, with a number of “toolsy” guys who’ve actually performed well and could be primed for big breakouts.
yeah but most teams used up the rookie eligibility of multiple players this year
so it’s not like we’re looking worse relatively because of it. And most of our players who’s rookie eligibility was used up but who weren’t really contributing on the major level (i.e they shouldn’t have had their eligibility used up), and we’re not even sure which players Law did and didn’t include, weren’t likely to make a big difference in rankings.
I feel bad for my little brother. He walked in and saw that the score of the Nugs-Magic game was 88-89 and thought it was high scoring.
All he knows is the Nets.
by Maxyboy on Dec 14 2010
Rex Ryan lobby for championship toe ring.
Most teams don't graduate six of their top 10 prospects every year
Incidentally, check out the likely opening day roster for the St. Lucie this year:
SS Wilmer Flores
SP Matt Harvey
OF Cesar Puello
SP Jeurys Familia
OF Cory Vaughn
OF Darrell Ceciliani
OF Matt Den Dekker
3B Brian Harrison
3B Jefry Marte
SP Brad Holt
SS Robbie Shields
SP Kyle Allen
SP Armando Rodriguez
C Blake Forsythe
RP Nick Carr
It’s one team, but just this squad arguably contains more talent than our entire top 20 prospects list from a couple years ago (remember Mike Carp? Eddie Kunz? Hector Pellot? Greg Veloz? Deolis Guerra? Kevin Mulvey? Brahiam Maldonado?)
It is almost too much talent
There are four legitimate OF prospects there. I think that one, perhaps Ceciliani will start in Savannah.
I think that Blake Forsythe might start in Savannah because that he didn’t hit well in Brooklyn in 2010. My guess is that Francisco Pena will repeat in St. Lucie, with Kai Gronauer getting promoted to Binghamton.
At SS, there could also be Rylan Sandoval, as well as Wilmer Flores and Robbie Shields. My guess is that one will play 2B.
If Flores is moved to 3B, then Brian Harrison or Jefry Marte can move to 1B. DH duties can be rotated.
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
I imagine Marte will be the first to get bumped down to 1B
Brian Harrison is supposed to be a legitimate 3B glove. I think they’ll keep Wilmer at SS, maybe give him some games at 3B later in the year if he makes it to AA. Shields might go to 2B, with Sandoval getting groomed as a utility guy.
Forsythe might go to Savannah, but he’d probably be battling for playing time with Albert Cordero and Juan Centeno. It’s a bit of a logjam however you slice it.
Ceciliani in Savannah sounds likely. They could also bump Den Dekker straight to AA, since he’s a bit old for A-ball…well, that’s what Bernazard would do, at least.
I can't believe how much hype Pena got for how little he's ever done.
Beyond terrible hitter who is still a bad defensive catcher after 3 years of trying to learn it.
But but but, in their perspective, it's always fun to bash the Mets.
In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis
The Unwritten Rules of AA
Got to agree
with the need of youngsters on the roster the past few seasons no wonder we have almost no one in the minors.
Didnt Bobby Parnell come out of the minors?
I hate Philadelphia so much.
Consider this
26th is probably a little too harsh (and perhaps vindictive, even), but the Mets only have about two prospects on the top 100 list – given that there are 30 MLB teams, the Mets should have at least 3 on that list to move up closer to the middle. To be fair, though, I think looking at the top 200 is a more accurate approach, to account for sample size. I will get back to you with those results, courtesy of scoutingbook.com (with an updated prospects list for 2011), and applying point values based on ranking of prospects.
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If you look at John Sickels’ prospect rankings, he realizes that the value of the Mets farm system is its depth at mid range prospects. Law seems to have ignored that entirely.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:41 PM EST up reply actions
I would have to agree
Ignoring those other prospects is a pretty considerable error. With about 9,000 or so minor leaguers in the farm systems combined, at least 200 of them are bound to succeed in the big leagues. 50 alone is far too shallow a list to base a farm system on!
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Injuries: One reason to undervalue the Mets farm system
Reese Havens, Steven Matz, who else am I missing?
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
No longer a prospect
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
Oh, did he already meet the minimum requirements? My bad. He appears on so many lists this season, I’d forgotten.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:53 PM EST up reply actions
Although I do agree with a lot of minor league sites that include Mejia and Fernando on their lists. They might not have rookie eligibility anymore but they definitely qualify as prospects.
by Lunkwill Fook on Jan 26, 2011 2:55 PM EST up reply actions
Oh, boy, he used "parsimony."
I’d respond, but my response is for subscribers only.
To those who cheer Jon Rauch, we salute you.
Glad to see
Keith Law is making good use of his new 2011 word-of-the-day calendar.
"There’s talent in these here waters. Alderson just has to clear up the algae around the edges." - RJ Anderson / Fangraphs
by Dandy Salderson on Jan 26, 2011 3:21 PM EST up reply actions
Based on the prospects list and scoring system I used to value them
The Mets are 23rd in farm system strength. This system is based on talent and farm system depth. (Many rankings seem to ignore the depth portion of their rankings.) Here are my findings:
01. TB (125.5)
02. KC (108.5)
03. SD (101.6)
04. ATL (99.6)
05. CIN (88.9)
06. MIN (83.9)
07. TOR (81.9)
08. SEA (81.6)
09. BOS (79.3)
10. CLE (75.9)
11. WAS (68.1)
12. OAK (66.8)
13. LAA (66.2)
14. TEX (65.5)
15. PHI (65.3)
16. NYY (63.0)
17. COL (59.2)
18. CHW (59.1)
19. CHC (57.4)
20. PIT (56.6)
21. STL (52.9)
22. SF (51.7)
23. NYM (49.0)
24. BAL (48.2)
25. LAD (46.3)
26. DET (46.2)
27. ARZ (46.1)
28. HOU (34.5)
29. FLA (30.2)
30. MIL (26.1)
Organizations like the Padres are ranked so highly in comparison to other lists, due to the considerable farm system depth, while the Yankees are considerably lower than the consensus rankings due to relative lack of farm system depth. These rankings may not be accurate, but when considering surprise prospects as well as there being no such thing as a sure thing, it may offer insight into how the farm system will change for that organization moving forward.
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23rd, 17th, 26th, who cares?
Like Alderson says, there is no excuse why this farm system should not be in the top ten every year, given its resources.
This is not directly at you, just a statement in general.
Now, kids, being eaten by a crocodile is just like going to sleep; in giant blender.
With enough time
We’ll eventually get there. Let’s hope that Rudy Terrasas’ replacement (Chad McDonald) can get us there for next year by making the right draft picks, alongside continued uniform development of the farm system.
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In addition
The one advantage the Mets do have is that if one doesn’t account for sheer depth of farm systems, it does seem like they do rank higher, which suggests, based on several implications, that while we have a few ‘A’ prospects, we’re chock full of ‘B’ prospects. What this means is that if the farm system is managed more efficiently and development programs are improved, we will rise up the ladder very rapidly.
Also, it appears that despite some recent significant improvements to their staff, Milwaukee’s long-term projections look grim in its current state, especially if farm system depth isn’t considered. The fact that Milwaukee traded Brett Lawrie further demonstrates this point. And with Price Fielder trade rumors looming, things aren’t looking quite as good as that Brewers’ depth chart would have many believe.
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Price Fielder, lol
Pun unintended as this was an accidental typo, yet it sounds quite fitting
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Not sure
But talk about it is quite prevalent. While I don’t have all the details, it was one of the issues brought to the forefront on MLB Network’s Hot Stove show. He might stay in Milwaukee, but I’m not sure which way this issue is headed as of now.
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See #6 in the article at the link below
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/jon_heyman/01/26/winter.stars/
If the Brewers fall out of contention in the days leading up to the trade deadline, then he will likely be traded. Fielder will be a FA next season, and is reportedly unlikely to re-sign with the Brewers.
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I like most of those rankings
I’m curious whether you considered Mejia and Martinez eligible, or if you went by rookie eligibility (including days on roster).
According to the list I used
both were eligible, though F-Mart came in 148th and Mejia 57th (this ranking here does seem aberrant)
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This ranking is way too low for the Mets.
There’s no way you’re 26th. And to repeat what was said above, it’s pretty laughable to have the Phillies ranked 5th. You’re telling me they’re only two spots away from the Braves? Yeah…okay.
"That guy mvhsbball is really an insufferable schmuck." - FuquaManuel
by Scott Coleman on Jan 26, 2011 4:20 PM EST via mobile reply actions
Biased Judgement is Biased
But seriously, folks… 8th or 9th is probably closer to the mark if you follow the Sickels metric.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 26, 2011 11:32 PM EST up reply actions
It's all subjective
I think the only real consensus is that there is 3 great systems, 3 really bad ones and the middle 24 are either a middle reliever apart or one top prospect making the majors from free falling in the rankings.
True Story
Your ideas are intriguing to me and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 26, 2011 11:48 PM EST up reply actions
Oh Shit, there's stickers!
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 27, 2011 12:36 AM EST up reply actions
For the people utterly confused, watch this epic clip.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=djQZhUc-0U0
“Plus, he’s hot”
“Of course he is”
"No...
Well, yes, in many ways I do love him."
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 27, 2011 7:50 AM EST up reply actions
in all honesty its probably one of the best episodes
the one where they head to atlantic city this past season…continues the gag to epic proportions
I hate Philadelphia so much.
Sweet Dee is Dating a Retard is my fave.
It combines their best bits, Sweet Dee dating a retarded white rapper and Charlie’s dyslexia and latent homosexuality with NightMan.
Great episode.
I think I may prefer The Gang Solves the Gas Crisis, but it’s close.
I am willing to wait to build a world class franchise (h/t to millsy)
by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 28, 2011 1:32 AM EST up reply actions
seriously
All these analysts just love kicking the mets, like its their job. No doubt Atlanta has a top farm system, but Philly? Once you see them listed at #5, you should stop reading the list and disregard it as stupidity. I am not saying the mets system is good, by any stretch, but it is not this bad. Remember, this terrible farm system for the past 3-4 years has produced solid ML contributors. Maybe Ike Davis, Jon Neise, Bobby Parnell, Daniel Murphy aren’t stars. I’ll grant you that, but they are solid young players. Add to the pipe Mejia, Flores, Rodriguez, Harvey, and even FMart all still with major upside and star potential, to rank just above the Astros is insulting to all baseball fans.
Keith Law is a bit
of a pompous, snarky douche. He is the kind of guy I would hate to work in the same office with. It’s great to have an opinion, but he delivers it an unfunny, passive-aggressive style that just reeks of a bitterness. By often stating his opinions as fact, he seeks to hide a great deal of his insecurity. He’s missed big time on a lot of his rankings over the years.
There is no official body to certify one as a scout
but Law seems like a poser to me. If he weren’t raking in ESPNbucks with his Peter Sellers imitation, I get the impression he’d rather be doing something else although probably criticizing others would be the core of his activities.
To be fair, he does have front office experience.
But he can be a bit of dick at times. That part is not disputable.
One thing to remember
Even experts can be biased. An expert who is, for example, a die-hard Cardinals fan, may try to find an excuse to move KC to 5th on the list, for whatever reasons could be found
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This is the first impression I got, too.
Admittedly, I don’t know all that much about him, and what he says, and all of that, but with so much exposure to the sports MSM, I’ve started taking everything that is said with a grain of salt, and a dash of “you think you know what you’re talking about, but you really don’t.”
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 27, 2011 1:24 AM EST up reply actions
He's a pretty good prospect guy.
But he tends to fall into stereotypical Ivy League snob from time to time.
I can see ranking the Phillies in the Top 10
but I’m stunned he has them ranked above the Yankees.
To place Philly in the Top 10 you really have to be very high on a lot of guys that other people aren’t, like Phillippe Aumont, Jiwan James, and Tyson Gillies (whom I think could be better than Domonic Brown if he gets his shit together). There’s a myriad of toolsy guys in the Phillies system, but they’re heavy boom/bust guys like Anthony Hewitt.
I do not think the Mets are that bad, but I’m really only high on Harvey, Mejia, and Flores. This could be the year in which the Mets’ prospect ranking increases by a lot or stays stagnant because it is very ‘wait and see’. Akeel Morris and Matt den Dekker are my picks to take off this year, for the record.
Why so high on Den Dekker?
I hear he’s a great glove at CF, but his bat is just okay. You think the doubles power might turn into homers or something?
Right, but he's 23 now and had zero homers in 122 ABs.
He also Ks at a decent clip which wouldn’t mean much if he hit for power. I hope he’s the next Pagan, but he looks more like Endy which is cool too.
122 AB isn't much of a sample
He also hit 15 2B, which projects out to 67 2B over 600 PA.
And he hit 13 HR in 247 AB (.563 SLG) in college last year, so it’s not like he has no power whatsoever. Anyway, obviously 4th OF is the most likely outcome for him, but he does have upside.
Aluminum bats in college don't forget.
It is SSS for his minor league career though. Odds are though, 0 homers in 122 ABs at age 23 means you’re not going to hit for much power in the majors.
I think we're all missing the bigger issue here.
The Phillies system is obviously considered so good because of the rampant steroid and PED use…
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Jan 26, 2011 6:44 PM EST reply actions 3 recs
I've heard about the widespread PED use in the Phillies system
I read it here, so it must be true.
"The Mets are gonna be amazin'!" - Casey Stengel
"Bounding and astounding!" - Clyde Frazier
I think rampant is not a strong enough description.
Blatant, open, endorsed usage is rife. I also hear there is a lot of child molestation, devil worshiping, robbing old people, brigandage, pillaging etc. They should be broken up and the talented players split up.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Jan 27, 2011 12:50 AM EST up reply actions
You don't get out much do you ....
“I also hear there is a lot of child molestation, devil worshiping, robbing old people, brigandage, pillaging etc.
That’s just Philly in general. If it wasn’t for the cheesesteak sandwiches they would have cordoned off the place a while ago.
PS – You forgot to mention how ugly they are …
by brooklynlou on Jan 27, 2011 11:41 AM EST up reply actions
From the Philly NBC Station
Here is an article about them being the ugliest, as well as unfriendly and unathletic. It also discusses Philly’s inferiority complex. The guy who wrote it must be from NY or something.
It's a triumph of number crunching over the human spirit...aaaaaand, it’s about time. -- Play-by-Play Announcer, The Simpsons.
by MookieTheCat on Jan 27, 2011 12:02 PM EST up reply actions
While I'd be remiss if I didn't post this-
-I must also applaud the use of “brigandage”.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Jan 27, 2011 8:15 PM EST up reply actions
AA is sooo glass is half empty.
Why not say “Mets Have Twenty Sixth-Best Farm System In Baseball”
Historically, the Mets farm has often been over-hyped by the media.
However, the last two or three years, I think the system has received much more criticism than it deserves. Look at how Ike Davis and Jonathan Niese were rated by Sickles, Law, and the ilk as they were going through the system. Based upon their performances last year, both have much higher ceilings than they were ever given credit for when they were in the minor leagues. You can make a legitimate argument that Niese has more potential than Bumgarner in San Fran. That certainly wasn’t the picture presented by Sickles and Law a couple of years ago. I think that has more to do with Niese being undervalued than it does Bumgarner losing some of his luster.
Looking at system, I think many of our prospects are being similarly under-touted. We certainly do not have an elite system, but #26? Really?
Yeah Niese is interesting
in that everything we were told about him was that he was likely a #5 starter if his curve developed correctly but he seems to have far surpassed that already. Some of it probably has to do with the development of his cutter, I’d imagine.
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Jan 26, 2011 9:13 PM EST up reply actions
Yeah, to be fair, Niese is lefty and had a plus curveball
But I could see how a scout loses interest quickly after that. Usually pitchers don’t learn a plus pitch within a year which is what Niese did to push him from a back end starter into mid rotation status. Ike and Thole were criminally under rated though.
I'm no expert on the minor leagues
but our system can’t be that bad. Just from the players I know from the majors, we’ve produced Jose, David, Ike, Pelf, Niese, Thole, Pagan, Parnell, Gee.
Plus there’s the likes of Heath Bell and Octavio Dotel who are long gone thanks to bad GMs.
John Franco (shoulda been) HOF 2011
The Mets are anywhere between 17th and 24th
That about describes the truth – there’s no question, unfortunately, that our farm system is below average, though we’re still much much better than the Brewers and Marlins in this department.
(Your ad here)
I only read about Mets prospects
and hear about how loaded KC and TB are
so the Mets are at least top 3, right?
"..."
by Thaddeus Ballpheasant on Jan 26, 2011 11:17 PM EST reply actions
they're the third best you're familiar with then
but the hierarchy is glorious gold, so-so silver, and shameful bronze, so we’re still out of luck.
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Jan 26, 2011 11:24 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
I love when these come out
So I can listen to people defend how terrible our farm is. Poor job.
R.A. Dickey "I do have thoughts on that. I don’t want to make them public."
THE WALTER REED 3 - Terrible Teammates, Worse Human Beings.
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