Pelfrey in the Pen?

It has to be an idea worth exploring, his mental lapses cost the team so many games.

6 months ago BlueChill 39 comments 0 recs |

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No,

His pitching cost the team games.

Astro Travellin'

by BlackOps on Nov 19, 2011 11:18 PM EST reply actions

No no no

The article says the main thing that has derailed Pelf as a starter is losing his focus. Shouldn’t have clicked.

Astro Travellin'

by BlackOps on Nov 19, 2011 11:22 PM EST reply actions

The comments are even better.

Apparently, one guy wants to bring back Octavio Dotel because of how much “heart” he showed in the 1999 NLCS.

Oy.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Nov 20, 2011 12:23 AM EST up reply actions

I'd bring him back because, well, he had a pretty good 2011 season and would be cheap

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 20, 2011 12:45 AM EST up reply actions

Yup and that's a valid reason I agree with.

Basing anything off of the 1999 NLCS, let alone basing it off “heart” is just hilarious and absurd.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Nov 20, 2011 1:00 AM EST up reply actions

Yeah, we can't sign Rogers cause he walks too much

ouch, that still stings

Still Amazin'.
Jose Reyes is a MET in 2012.

by piazza62 on Nov 20, 2011 1:11 AM EST up reply actions

seriously

we are talking about 1999 performances when we are heading into 2012??

2012 New York Mets, World Series Champions!

by astromets on Nov 20, 2011 2:27 AM EST up reply actions

Heart has no expiration date

Sign Walter Johnson!

by psiogen on Nov 20, 2011 2:28 AM EST up reply actions

Heart?Captain Planet for closer!

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Nov 20, 2011 7:58 AM EST up reply actions

If Reyes leaves, there's only one candidate to replace him: Honus Wagner.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Nov 20, 2011 8:57 AM EST up reply actions

Old Hoss is rarin' to go!

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 20, 2011 11:56 AM EST up reply actions

Putting him in the pen takes away his most valuable quality

being able to pitch 180-200 innings.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Nov 20, 2011 12:09 AM EST reply actions 3 recs

this

then we just have a bad pitcher in the pen

2012 New York Mets, World Series Champions!

by astromets on Nov 20, 2011 2:28 AM EST up reply actions

He doesn't miss bats and he's not really a groundball pitcher

other than that, he'd make a perfect reliever

by Ownbey4Mex on Nov 20, 2011 6:43 AM EST up reply actions

I doubt pitching him in relief is going to help him much.

His issue is that he doesn’t have a swing and miss pitch. Being a reliever isn’t suddenly going to get him to generate strikeouts, even if he gains an extra couple of MPH on his fastball. He’s a one pitch pitcher who’s best attribute is his durability. I just don’t see him being a good reliever.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Nov 20, 2011 12:13 AM EST reply actions

I don't get it.

Mike Pelfrey is an average starter, which means he’s worse than people hoped he would be but better than a lot of starters in baseball. More importantly, he’s better than most of the starters the Mets would be able to sign for one year and $5-6 million this offseason.

by Eric Simon on Nov 20, 2011 12:17 AM EST reply actions

Pelfrey is nowhere near an average starter.

49th out of 50 qualified in xFIP in the NL last year.

by djletz on Nov 20, 2011 9:40 AM EST up reply actions

Not sure I understand this

If there are 16 NL teams, and at least 5 starters per team, wouldn’t 49th put you around the middle of the bell curve?

by Ownbey4Mex on Nov 20, 2011 9:59 AM EST up reply actions

It's actually 47th out of 48.

That line of thinking only works if you assume Pelfrey is better than everyone who didn’t qualify under innings pitched. Do you really think he was more valuable over the season than Beachy, Niese, Zimmerman, Cueto, Karstens, Jurrjens, etc.?

by djletz on Nov 20, 2011 10:26 AM EST up reply actions

I'm no great Pelfrey fan, believe me,

but there is some value in making the cut for IP’s. You have to play at least 9 × 162 innings (unless it rains), and someone’s got to keep your relievers’ arms from falling off over the season. That’s an element of value.

If I I were a GM, I sure agree with you that I would take Beachy, Niese etc. before I would take Pelfry. But I think the main critique of the Pelfrey-to-Bullpen line of thinking is that to the extent he shows any “plus” attributes, it’s as an innings-eater. Which means he’s better used as a starter, rather than out of the bullpen.

by Ownbey4Mex on Nov 20, 2011 10:50 AM EST up reply actions

Isn't it precisely the fact that those guys couldn't pitch a full season part of why Pelfrey is valuable?

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Nov 20, 2011 1:54 PM EST up reply actions

I'd rather have any of those guys for 140 innings---

And give the remaining 60 to Miguel Batista, than let Pelf pitch 200 again.

by djletz on Nov 20, 2011 2:12 PM EST up reply actions

The dropoff from Beachy et.al to Batista is pretty steep.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Nov 20, 2011 3:33 PM EST up reply actions

Since becoming a starter four years ago, Pelfrey has accumulated 8.6 WAR

If you figure 2.0 WAR is about league average, that comes out to be about 2.2 (2.15 to be exact) WAR per year, making Pelfrey pretty much league average. He’s had some rises and dips in value skewing his value (good in 2008, bad in 2009, good in 2010, bad in 2011), but overall, he is what he is, a completely generic guy who throws nothing particularly flashy, doesn’t do any one thing particularly well, but toes the rubber every five days on the dot, and gives the team a chance to win ballgames, more or less.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 20, 2011 12:03 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

I'm sure you know

that one year doesn’t tell the whole story. Over the past four seasons he’s been thoroughly average, which is unsexy but still plenty useful.

by Eric Simon on Nov 20, 2011 12:14 PM EST up reply actions

The whole story--

Is that outside a two-month period in 2010 when he was featuring a pitch that he no longer throws, Pelfrey is consistently a 5 K/9, 3 BB/9 pitcher with a xFIP perpetually in the 4.5 range who’s gotten fewer and fewer groundballs every year. That’s not even close to an average pitcher—it’s a bad pitcher, and when you’re a bad pitcher, the fact that you’re pitching a lot of innings is not a good thing.

by djletz on Nov 20, 2011 2:10 PM EST up reply actions

This again?

No. Pelfrey’s biggest (perhaps only) asset is his durability.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Nov 20, 2011 12:26 AM EST reply actions

Yeah, I was about to say, deja vu

This was discussed by the “professionals” quite a bit early in the season.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Nov 20, 2011 12:45 AM EST up reply actions

I don't even know what to make of this

" I agree with Ray Sadecki about Dotel. I’ll never forget how much heart he showed in the ’99 NLCS.I’d bet he’s got another year of closing in his arm. Whatever he’s got, you can bet he’ll give 110% any time you call on him."

It’s not even a bad idea- just piss poor reasoning.

Still Amazin'.
Jose Reyes is a MET in 2012.

by piazza62 on Nov 20, 2011 12:29 AM EST reply actions

This one was too funny.

I’m all for putting a decent amount of money into the bullpen, although Reyes needs to be the number 1 priority. but c’mon, that was a decade ago.

Down 2 in the bottom of the ninth?
Lets Bring in Willie Harris!

by ShaqKazaam on Nov 20, 2011 1:41 PM EST up reply actions

I'm pretty much over Reyes by this point

This whole drama has soured any affection towards him. Call me heartless, but it is what it is.

All things equal, I’d go after Joe Nathan and Dotel and have them compete for closer. Parnell can be the 7th inning guy (I really wish he would close, he certainly has the talent, but just…can’t).

Still Amazin'.
Jose Reyes is a MET in 2012.

by piazza62 on Nov 20, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions

Hell I'll give 110% anytime I'm called on too

Doesn’t mean I would be a good ML pitcher

by ZZPops on Nov 20, 2011 5:10 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

Yes

because there will be no mental lapses coming out of the bullpen

One day, this team is going to kill me.

by fxcarden on Nov 20, 2011 9:22 AM EST reply actions

Yes

Lets turn a mediocre starting pitcher into a mediocre middle reliever. Thats getting maximum punch for your money

Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?

by KeithsMoustache on Nov 20, 2011 6:55 PM EST reply actions

Enjoy your trip into the

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Nov 20, 2011 7:11 PM EST up reply actions

Ya know something always bothered me about this picture

Why is he facing upwards with his arms outstretched to the sky? It looks like he was running backwards for some reason.

A deadline has a wonderful way of concentrating the mind.-Professor James Moriarty
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.- Former Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan

by Blame-everyone-else on Nov 21, 2011 12:34 PM EST up reply actions