The Updated State of the Mets' 2012 Budget

by Chris McShane on Dec 12, 2011 1:00 PM EST

Back in October, I put together a rough estimate of the Mets' 2012 payroll commitments, and an update is obviously necessary after the signings of Jon Rauch and Frank Francisco and trade of Angel Pagan for Ramon Ramirez and Andres Torres.

By midnight tonight, the Mets figure to tender Mike Pelfrey, Manny Acosta, Ramirez, and Torres contracts for 2012 while non-tendering Ronny Paulino. Salaries for those arbitration-eligible players tendered contracts are, of course, estimates.

Pos.	Player	$ (Millions)
C	Josh Thole	0.4
1B	Ike Davis	0.4
2B	Daniel Murphy	0.4
3B	David Wright	15.3
SS	Ruben Tejada	0.4
LF	Jason Bay	18.1
CF	Andres Torres	3.5
RF	Lucas Duda	0.4
Bench	Mike Nickeas	0.4
Bench	Justin Turner	0.4
Bench
Bench
Bench
SP	Johan Santana	24.0
SP	R.A. Dickey	4.8
SP	Jon Niese	0.5
SP	Mike Pelfrey	5.9
SP	Dillon Gee	0.4
RP	Frank Francisco	6.0
RP	Jon Rauch	3.5
RP	Ramon Ramirez	2.5
RP	Tim Byrdak	1.2
RP	Manny Acosta	1.0
RP	Bobby Parnell	0.4
RP	D.J. Carrasco	1.2
Total		91.1

Given Sandy Alderson's indications that the Opening Day payroll for the team will be approximately $95 million, they've got about $4 million left in their budget this winter. With the bullpen seemingly settled, that money will most likely be spent filling the three spots on the bench that appear to be open.

That Jason Bay salary sure is an eyesore, isn't it?

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LF Jason Bay 18.1

brb, barfing

The artful muppet formerly known as KrmtDfrog.
Please read my sardonic wit and over-blown sense of self over at headkicklegend.com

by Cory Braiterman on Dec 12, 2011 1:07 PM EST reply actions 3 recs

With Tony Reagins gone there is only one way to get rid of Bay:

Convince Dayton Moore that he used to be a Braves farmhand.

by Shevshevy on Dec 12, 2011 1:11 PM EST reply actions

Or package him to the Royals with Acosta for Myers

by Shevshevy on Dec 12, 2011 1:11 PM EST up reply actions

or ANYONE

"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"

by feslenraster on Dec 12, 2011 1:30 PM EST up reply actions

Yankees for Soriano?

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:39 PM EST up reply actions

Hmm...

Figure Rottino gets a bench spot because of his versatility. Satin as well. Might as well add Danny Herrera to the pen and go with eight men, because, being a Mets fan, I have an innate fear of my bullpen.

Given that that would roughly cost $1.5 million or so, I might go out and sign a reliable back-end pitcher for about $3-$4 million, so that we aren’t left in the dust if more than one pitcher goes down. Jason Marquis to give us the theoretical innings durability, or perhaps Aaron Cook, who might serve as Chris Capuano did last year as a moderate-risk, moderate reward kind of guy if he rebounds.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 1:23 PM EST reply actions

Rottino, really?

His minor league stats look okay, never heard of him. You have to figure Turner and Nickeas (yuck) are locks right now, probably Hairston comes back as well, so that leaves 2 spots with 12 pitchers.

by David G on Dec 12, 2011 6:11 PM EST up reply actions

gotta love Omar

"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"

by feslenraster on Dec 12, 2011 1:30 PM EST reply actions

Santana K doesn't look so hot, either.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 1:38 PM EST reply actions

He's 25% of the entire budget ....

by brooklynlou on Dec 12, 2011 1:47 PM EST up reply actions

But we knew what we were geting into with Santana

A chance to win in 2008 & 2009 with a back-loaded contract and a real chance of him being injured. We took our shot and we missed. At least he was good for some of the deal.

Who the fuck thought the Bay deal was a good idea at time? Certainly not me us. Beside Omar.

Granted, we didn’t think he’d be this bad, but his is one of the worst contracts we’ve ever signed.

by JJJ on Dec 12, 2011 1:54 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs

Believe it or not

some of us figured the Santana deal would blow up in our faces, too.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 1:59 PM EST up reply actions

But if a deal is going to blow up

At least Santana has always been either effective or injured. It’s the death-by-a-thousand cuts lack of productivity that makes the Bay contract so painful.

by Walter Gropius on Dec 12, 2011 2:04 PM EST up reply actions

Agreed

I’d rather have a potential difference maker from seasons past being the thing weighing us down than useless dead weight like Jason Bay, who was overpaid, and was given all of that money at a time when the team was out of contention for anything anyway.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 2:51 PM EST up reply actions

pitchers are better then hitters in this case

santana, even if overpaid… doesnt block a spot from what could be a more productive player.

worst case, he is our #5 starter.

Bay on the other hand takes up a very valuable position spot. Not only does the money suck, but by having him out there it prevents us from putting a better player on the field.

I think it was Bobby V who said: "You are never as good as you are when you are at your best, and you are not as bad as when you are at your worst."

Like the really funny uncle with a healthy bourbon habit who matches every brilliant Thanksgiving story with one or two ill-advised racist jokes or boob grabs, we’re stuck with Melo. So we might as well learn to love him — quirks and all. http://knickerblogger.net/2011-report-card-carmelo-anthony/

by gbaked on Dec 12, 2011 2:59 PM EST up reply actions

Totally agree, we all KNEW it would kill us in the final years

But it seemed to make sense to get the elite pitcher in baseball (in exchange for very little in terms of talent).

The Bay one never really had an upside. That’s my point. It was a stupid deal from the get-go. One of the worst.

by JJJ on Dec 12, 2011 2:08 PM EST up reply actions

No one thought Bay would be as bad as he's been.

But I would never say it looked good at the time. It didn’t.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 2:18 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

I'm trying to find the original AA article analyzing the Bay signing, but couldn't find it.

Much of the disappointment comes with his production. Though the projection systems at the time pegged him for around 3-4 WAR, he ended up posting 1.5 and 0.7 WAR despite his better than expected defense.

For the $/WAR market value at the time, his break even point would be around 3.5 WAR.

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 2:39 PM EST up reply actions

Found it

http://www.amazinavenue.com/2009/12/30/1224941/on-jason-bay

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 2:50 PM EST up reply actions

Except most people who though it was bad at the time did so because...

…they over-trusted UZR saying he was awful defensively. With the UZR adjustment, he was probably as reasonable an investment as Holliday, who many people did want to go after. I see no reason to have expected that Holliday was going to go on being good and Bay to suddenly crater. The real reason not to go after Bay—the general way it would make the roster really top-heavy and inflexible in case of the potential worst-case cataclysms that actually did happen—was not the one most people were citing, and would’ve been as true for getting Holliday. (The right thing to have done, of course, would be to spend the money on two two-year $8Mish deals for a competent left-fielder and starter, which would’ve probably made us .500 teams the past two years and saved us some seriously troubles now.)

by djletz on Dec 12, 2011 5:09 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

this

though I didn’t expect him to decline so fast and then become a black hole. It’s basically become what I considered worst reasonable case scenario.

one does not simply walk into mordor...unless winter is coming

by Gina on Dec 12, 2011 2:32 PM EST up reply actions

This entire payroll is kind of hilarious. And really telling of how rapidly their financial state changed .4 .4 .4 25 million .4 .4 .4

also it’s really depressing. if we’d have some of these 4 million or less players in 06-08 we’d probably have multiple play-off berths. Now they’re all the best players on the team.

I mean did we have anyone as productive as Thole, Duda, Murphy, Davis, Tejada making up the lower end of our payroll in those years?

I’m going to go drink some lighter fuel. And cry.

one does not simply walk into mordor...unless winter is coming

by Gina on Dec 12, 2011 2:28 PM EST reply actions

If Omar knew how to fill the peripherals of a team, we'd be World fucking Champtions

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 2:52 PM EST up reply actions

It's not Omar's fault that he didn't have guys like Niese, Gee, Duda, etc. there to fill in the empty spots on the roster.

by Brian Mangan on Dec 12, 2011 3:08 PM EST up reply actions

It is absolutely Omar's fault that he signed

worthless players who didn’t contribute to the team in meaningful ways, like Alex Cora or Aaron Sele, or a very done Marlon Anderson in 2008, or trading Ramon Castro for Lance Broadway, or the infamous Bannister trade.

Again, if Omar knew how to fill the peripherals of a team, we’d be World fucking Champtions. He didn’t, and as a result, those holes were the end of us.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:18 PM EST up reply actions

FWIW

The 2006 team was pretty perfect, and Omar had a lot to do with that. But your right in that after that near miss, he stopped being proactive in filling out the roster, and fell into the old trap of “We’re only one piece away”. So every offseason, he went out and got that one piece…Santana when we needed pitching, K-Rod/Putz when our bullpen collapsed, Bay when it seemed like the team had no power, etc.

"I only wanted a few things out of life -- a wife, children, to play baseball and to hunt deer." - Turk Wendell

by Rey-O on Dec 12, 2011 5:01 PM EST up reply actions

if Omar had traded Aaron Heilman for a pack of peanuts we would have been World Camptions.

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:43 PM EST up reply actions

The same Aaron Heilman who had an 3.27 ERA and a 130 ERA+ in 208 games (201 relief appearances) between 2005 and 2007?

The guy who averaged about 1.0 WAR over those three years according to BB-Ref and 1.5 WAR according to Fangraphs?

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions

To be fair, that trade SUCKED

We got Sean Green, Jeremy Reed, and JJ Putz.

We gave up Heilmann, Joe Smith, Jason Vargas, Mike Carp, Endy Chavez, and two other guys who now have some replacement-level MLB experience.

Learn something new every day: http://dlewis.net/nik

by Dan Lewis on Dec 12, 2011 5:17 PM EST up reply actions

If we had Joe Smith, Jason Vargas, Mike Carp, Endy, and Carrera back

I’d be happier than I am now.

Joe Smith, I loved Joe Smith.
Jason Vargas, he’s better than a lot of the pitchers we’ve been using since 2009 (especially 2009).
Mike Carp, he raked for most of the second half of the year, and didn’t play absolutely horrible defense given that he was out of position.
Ezekiel Carrera, a nice blend of OF speed and average.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 6:36 PM EST up reply actions

The thing that I hated most was how they let Putz walk away after 2009

and he went to the White Sox for $3 million and had an awesome year as a setup man. I understand them declining his expensive option for 2010 but after giving up all of those players to acquire him, you’d think they’d want to at least bring him back and try to squeeze a little value out of the deal. Just a total waste, especially considering how awful Reed and Green were. How do you deal 7 players away and not bother to get a physical for the key piece in the deal?

Ridiculous.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Dec 12, 2011 8:05 PM EST up reply actions

me me me I know this one!

How do you deal 7 players away and not bother to get a physical for the key piece in the deal?

It’s called an “Omar.”

I.M. Forme
"When you get yourself into trouble is when you feel you have to do something, and then you get yourself in trouble." --Omar Minaya

by itsmetsforme on Dec 12, 2011 11:04 PM EST up reply actions

Omar

Verb

To fail to do something very obvious, that comes back to bite you in the ass later.

“Yeah, I was going to give JJ Putz a physical, but it slipped my mind.”
“Dude, you totally Omared yourself.”

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 13, 2011 1:43 PM EST up reply actions

This ...

Heilman was solid til he got overworked. And the mistake in game 7 was Willie sending him out for a second inning with Wagner available.

by David G on Dec 12, 2011 5:57 PM EST up reply actions

He sent him out for a second inning because Wagner was awful in he NLCS

He blew game two and came close to blowing game six too. He and Mota were the goats of that series imo.

by graves9 on Dec 12, 2011 6:45 PM EST up reply actions

For a blog that specializes in a rational sabre-perspective, my message is this

Don’t hate the player/manager/one choice, hate the small-sample size playoff games. The Mets were plenty good enough to win in ‘06 (tied for best record in majors that year). It just didn’t happen.

by enigma2029 on Dec 12, 2011 10:21 PM EST up reply actions

We just need to wait 2-3 years then we can field a team with min salary/arb players.

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 3:05 PM EST up reply actions

This

by Brian Mangan on Dec 12, 2011 3:08 PM EST up reply actions

Usually when I say those last things about the mets

it’s a joke. Right now this list is actually making me contemplate it. I don’t think I’ve ever been as depressed about the mets as I am now. Even during the Omar years I was convinced either he’d accidentally get us somewhere or he’d fuck up so badly he’d be replaced by someone (like Sandy) and a new era would reign and wright and reyes would still be young and productive enough to build a 95+ win championship contending team for multiple years around. Instead we finally got Sandy and he’s doing all the awesome small things Omar could never do but the franchises finances have gone up in smoke and, really there’s no reason to think anything will be different in the next 2-3, maybe even 4-5 years, outside of 1. sheer blind optimism 2. belief that the universe can’t be this much of a dick and eventually something will have to turn in our favor.

But at this point where are we going to get another Reyes&Wright. Let alone another Reyes, Wright and truthfully underpaid Carlos Beltran? I mean we were getting like 18-20 WAR a season at a cost of like 30-50 million total. Now we’re paying Bay and Santana that much to combine to contribute like 2 WAR.

I hate everything

one does not simply walk into mordor...unless winter is coming

by Gina on Dec 12, 2011 2:31 PM EST reply actions

On the bright side

we do have new uniforms

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 3:50 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

I thought we were the Dodgers, not the O's

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:23 PM EST up reply actions

The way our division is starting to stack up

we’re the O’s.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 4:53 PM EST up reply actions

The best value/dollar will always be young prospects rather than stars after a big signing.

So are we likely to find another wright and reyes? Yeah, we are, somewhere in ours or someone else’s farm system. Another Beltran? Maybe, maybe not, but that wasn’t exactly the best outcome it could have been. He was hurt a lot, even though he generally produced well when on the field.

by enigma2029 on Dec 12, 2011 10:26 PM EST up reply actions

Here's the thing that kills me about this -- if payroll was $140 million or so, wouldn't we be able to field a competitive team right now?

Not that I’d suggest spending it this way, but $40 million would let us add Aramis Ramirez, CJ Wilson, and a couple other important pieces. A team with those parts added would be competitive today.

by Brian Mangan on Dec 12, 2011 3:09 PM EST reply actions

Aramis Ramirez?

We need our third 3rd baseman on the roster? I don’t think CJ Wilson was taking that discount if he wasn’t going to get to play in LA.

I’ll tell you where you can shove your OPS.

Here’s what puts food on the table for Jason Bay and his family – his ability to hit HRs and drive in runs – RBIs

by piazza62 on Dec 12, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions

Aramis Ramirez is this seasons Jason Bay.

Bad luck will hunt down and strike the dumbass GM who signs him to a $15m contract.

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions

Even a payroll of ~$110M

would have allowed us to keep Jose.

Mr. Wilpon, you have done enough. Have you no sense of decency sir, at long last? Have you left no sense of decency?

by Ownbey4Mex on Dec 12, 2011 3:53 PM EST up reply actions 3 recs

Believe what you want

but from what Sandy keeps saying it wasn’t a lack of funds that stopped us from signing Reyes, rather Reyes insistence on a sixth year.

A deadline has a wonderful way of concentrating the mind.-Professor James Moriarty
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.- Former Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan

by Blame-everyone-else on Dec 12, 2011 5:08 PM EST up reply actions

This, I don't believe

I see that more or less as trying to save face in public. The Mets very well could have theoretically included a team option, or a mutual team/player option for a sixth year, allowing them to only have five guaranteed years, but appease Reyes with a sixth option year.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 6:37 PM EST up reply actions

It was stated over and over that Reyes wanted the guaranteed 6th year

and more importantly, the guaranteed 100 million. An option year and incentives to get it up to 6 yrs/100 million just wasn’t going to get it done, as long as there was another team in the bidding.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Dec 12, 2011 8:08 PM EST up reply actions

I saw an interview with Reyes in a gross Marlins uniform

They asked him about leaving the Mets, and he seemed sad and disappointed, saying the Mets never even made him an offer. Maybe we didn’t because we knew he wanted more years that we were willing, but man did that break my heart. We couldn’t even properly low-ball the guy?

by enigma2029 on Dec 12, 2011 10:27 PM EST up reply actions

MLB Trade Rumors @mlbtraderumors
Mets Claim Jeremy Hefner; Sign May, Olson bit.ly/tl1mLU #mlb

"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"

by I'mGivingYouARaise on Dec 12, 2011 3:12 PM EST reply actions

I don't get this. Is this our new #4 starter?

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 3:16 PM EST up reply actions

I guess so

I don’t know much about him.

"WHO WOULD LEAD?! THE CLOWN?!"

by I'mGivingYouARaise on Dec 12, 2011 3:31 PM EST up reply actions

AAA depth no?

by cpins on Dec 12, 2011 3:32 PM EST up reply actions

Since he was claimed off waivers, does he need to be added to the 40-man or 25-man roster?

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions

Hefner doesn't have above average K or GB rates, he gave up a bunch of HR in a HR suppressing park.

And he walks more guys than he should. What am I missing here?

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 3:32 PM EST up reply actions

From MLBTR

""Hafner has…three average offerings and feel for the strike zone make him ideally suited to fit in the back of a rotation.""

our #5 starter for 2012. If he sucks in ST then we offer him back to Pittsburgh who say “no thanks” then we sign him to a minor league deal

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:48 PM EST up reply actions

He does have the potential for some very awesome memes, however.

For it!

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 3:51 PM EST up reply actions

"That Jason Bay salary sure is an eyesore, isn't it?"

Even before i read your comment his 18.1 stuck right out. It is obscene for the amount of output he gives us.

To make his contract even out production/$$$ he would have to bat .400 with 65hr per season. I think he has a shot at this, anyone else?

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:38 PM EST reply actions

Looking at our line-up above

I began thinking, how many HRs can we expect. A little over/under time.
Wright +/- 28
Ike +/- 35
Duda +/- 40 (throwing that one out there)
Murphy +/- 15
Bay +/- 9
Tejada +/- 2
Thole +/- 7
Torres +/- 3
Dickey +/- 74

by CCE718 on Dec 12, 2011 3:38 PM EST reply actions

I think...

Wright goes over, Ike over, Duda under, Murphy under, Bay over, Tejada ?, Thole about right, Torres ??, and Dickey, well, he will go way over that mark.

by CCE718 on Dec 12, 2011 3:39 PM EST up reply actions

The only one that I would put money on going over

is Andres Torres.

by TheBigStapler on Dec 12, 2011 3:45 PM EST up reply actions

Tejada hit 3 HR in 231 PA last year!

(Nevermind that was on AAA lol)

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 12, 2011 3:49 PM EST up reply actions

Hmm, lets see...

Wright under
Ike under
Duda under
Murphy over
Bay over
Tejada over
Thole stick with 7
Dickey way way over.

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 3:49 PM EST up reply actions

Did you really just predict that Lucas Duda would hit 40 HR?

As the OVER/UNDER?!?!??!?

The word is wow.

Under.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 3:53 PM EST up reply actions

I was bored

And as I said “throwing that one out there”. Wanted to see how crazy everyone thought I was.

by CCE718 on Dec 13, 2011 9:20 AM EST up reply actions

Crazy? You're gone, man, gone.

by Curtis3331 on Dec 13, 2011 7:40 PM EST up reply actions

Hate to say it, but

Wright – Under
Ike – Under
Duda – Um, under.
Murphy – Under
Bay – Over
Tejada – push
Thole – Under
Torres – Under
Dickey – Over

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions

I think most of these is what you can expect for the most part

Duda isn’t hitting 40 but I can see him hitting 30-33.

I’ll tell you where you can shove your OPS.

Here’s what puts food on the table for Jason Bay and his family – his ability to hit HRs and drive in runs – RBIs

by piazza62 on Dec 12, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions

If that's true

I shudder to think about the home runs our pitchers will give up.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 3:56 PM EST up reply actions

It has nothing to do with walls

Duda and Ike will make any park small. The pitchers suck anyway so it’s no surprise there, no big deal.

I’ll tell you where you can shove your OPS.

Here’s what puts food on the table for Jason Bay and his family – his ability to hit HRs and drive in runs – RBIs

by piazza62 on Dec 12, 2011 3:58 PM EST up reply actions

I hope so

but it’s really not easy to hit 30-35 HR in the majors. Davis has prodigious power, and has the better shot, I think, but let’s give him a couple more trips around the league before he’s Prince Fielder.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 4:11 PM EST up reply actions

That seems overly optimistic to me.

Wright – Push
Ike – Under. I’ll say 25ish for him.
Duda – Way under. I think 25, 30 max for him. He’s a good hitter but I don’t think he’s going to come out of the gate with 40.
Murphy – Under. I think he hits 10.
Bay – Over. Of course, that requires him hitting well and getting playing time.
Tejada – Push.
Thole – Way under. I see him hitting maybe 3 or 4.
Torres – Over. If he gets playing time, he’s got some pop. He hit 16 in 2010 in SF, which is a huge park. I’d be comfortable predicting 10 for him, with regular playing time.
Dickey – Over. Way over.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Dec 12, 2011 4:07 PM EST up reply actions

I agree with Steve, except that I think a full season of Murphy might be worth 15.

by Curtis3331 on Dec 13, 2011 5:30 AM EST up reply actions

Hmm

Over
Under
Under
Over
Over
Under
Over
Over
Over

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:26 PM EST up reply actions

Let us recall

that there was a smidge more wrong with Wright than just where the wall was.

by tmu on Dec 12, 2011 4:54 PM EST up reply actions

la-la-la-la-la

can’t hear you….

by David G on Dec 12, 2011 5:59 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs

He hit 29 home runs in 2010, after having his craptastic 2009 season

He hit 14 in 2011, in 102 games. Advance that pace to account for 150+ games, and he’s firmly in 20-25 range, taking into account he was playing injured for some time.

If he is healthy in 2011, I have no doubt that he sniffs 30 HR again. The walls being moved only helps.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 6:41 PM EST up reply actions

Agreed

I’m just more concerned with his batting average and strikeouts now.

"I only wanted a few things out of life -- a wife, children, to play baseball and to hunt deer." - Turk Wendell

by Rey-O on Dec 12, 2011 8:24 PM EST up reply actions

This.

I’d rather see him hit .330 with 20 homers and maybe 110 whiffs.

by Curtis3331 on Dec 13, 2011 5:32 AM EST up reply actions

The "saberist" in me says

who cares about his batting average and how many times he strikes out, as long as he is getting on base a lot, and is slugging at a nice clip (a la Adam Dunn), but seeing Wright with a batting average lower than .300 just doesn’t feel right. And, strikeouts are goats, and no one should be happy with a lot of them.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 13, 2011 1:46 PM EST up reply actions

I don't know how you can keep the rotation exactly the same

and dare to say the team has a chance to be competitive.

There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only BLUE WALLS.

The 2012 Mets: Fortune cookie says come back in 2015

by Syler on Dec 12, 2011 3:47 PM EST reply actions

While I don't expect the team will be competitive

the rotation will not be exactly the same this year.

There’s a non-zero chance that Santana will provide value (at least more than Gee or Schwinden) and that one or two prospects are contributing as early as the all-star break.

by TheBigStapler on Dec 12, 2011 3:52 PM EST up reply actions

i was trying to forget Schwinden was even on our team

Thanks for nothing!

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Dec 12, 2011 4:01 PM EST up reply actions

a move like this makes it seem like he won't be on it for much longer.

"No curses, only incompetent ownership" - Russ

by Help!I'maRock! on Dec 12, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions

Could be worse

At least he’s not Brian Lawrence, right?

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:29 PM EST up reply actions

Oh God.

Just hearing that name makes me want to throw up.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Dec 12, 2011 4:34 PM EST up reply actions

It was between Brian Lawrence and Dave Williams

Lawrence is slightly hated more by me, only because Dave Williams is such a generic name, and as such, so easily forgettable. Brandon Knight comes in close third. Eh, basically everyone in the scrub starters we used between 2006 and 2008 FanPost I wrote comes in third.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 12, 2011 4:38 PM EST up reply actions

It's Lawrence for me

He got 6 freaking starts and the Mets lost 5 of them. And all down the stretch, and he was terrible. The worst thing that happened was he won his first start. He managed .-6 WAR in 6 starts, lol. WHIP of 1.9 and 43 hits in 20 innings. And they lost out on the playoffs by a game…

by David G on Dec 12, 2011 6:05 PM EST up reply actions

Williams only made a start or two in '07

so he didn’t do too much damage. Lawrence making big starts the last six weeks of the sason was killer.

by graves9 on Dec 12, 2011 6:48 PM EST up reply actions

it's simple using metsense

one does not simply walk into mordor...unless winter is coming

by Gina on Dec 12, 2011 7:27 PM EST up reply actions

Right side of our infield making <1MM

If only that could stay that way…

Mets, Devils, Jets, Knicks
Follow me on Twitter: @KovalRise
Dickey be Praised!

by santana9237 on Dec 12, 2011 3:48 PM EST reply actions

so..

…next season when I’m all:

I’ll know that the reason is:

by BurleighGrimes on Dec 12, 2011 4:28 PM EST reply actions 1 recs

Blame Canada!

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Dec 12, 2011 4:34 PM EST up reply actions

it's not even a real country anyway.

"No curses, only incompetent ownership" - Russ

by Help!I'maRock! on Dec 12, 2011 4:39 PM EST up reply actions

That original Bay article

Was like nails on a chalkboard. Made sense at the time, but EGAD…. “I am pleased that we finally have a left fielder that can hit” … not for another four years, sorry.
WORST OFFSEASON EVER

by tfinnz on Dec 12, 2011 5:13 PM EST reply actions

The Comments Weren't Much Better

Kind of puts the I told you sos in perspective.

by WT Economist on Dec 12, 2011 6:24 PM EST up reply actions

The more I look at this

the more signing Rauch for 3.5 was idiotic. Ramirez and Francisco was enough for now. It’s preventing them upgrading at either catcher or the starting rotation. They may not have been able to upgrade both, but one of those was doable.

by David G on Dec 12, 2011 6:01 PM EST reply actions

I kinda agree

it’s the first Alderson signing that I think is kind of a bust from the get-go. Is there really not a better way to spend 3.5 million than Jon Rauch? Of course, it’s only a one year deal and not much of a big deal either way…but still.

by BurleighGrimes on Dec 12, 2011 10:10 PM EST up reply actions

If he's any good, he can be traded at the deadline for whatever

He only costs around $2 million then, and turns into a prospect/player of some sort.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 13, 2011 1:47 PM EST up reply actions

Big if

And we saw what kind of package K-Rod returned (and that was with Mets paying salary).

by David G on Dec 13, 2011 2:24 PM EST up reply actions

That's because that contract was ridiculous

The Brewers knew no team wanting a closer would want K-rod because of that horrible vest. Even getting a Danny Herrera in return is better than nothing.

I’ll tell you where you can shove your OPS.

Here’s what puts food on the table for Jason Bay and his family – his ability to hit HRs and drive in runs – RBIs

by piazza62 on Dec 13, 2011 4:10 PM EST up reply actions

A New Way to Look at that List

If they could just get rid of Wright, Bay and Santana and add six players making the major league minimum, they’d be down to around $35 million!

Of course to accomplish that two years from now, when it might be possible, they’d have to get rid of a bunch of then arbitration eligible players and replace them with rookies. But that’s pretty much the plan anyway, isn’t it?

by WT Economist on Dec 12, 2011 6:22 PM EST reply actions

Why the hell

Are we paying Pelfrey nearly $6 million to flat out suck

by Revis Island on Dec 12, 2011 10:22 PM EST reply actions

My bad

What i wanted to say is why the hell are we paying Pelfrey nearly $6 million to suck

by Revis Island on Dec 12, 2011 10:22 PM EST up reply actions

I don't get what was wrong with the first comment...

I’ll tell you where you can shove your OPS.

Here’s what puts food on the table for Jason Bay and his family – his ability to hit HRs and drive in runs – RBIs

by piazza62 on Dec 12, 2011 10:29 PM EST up reply actions

Its better than paying $12M

to Ollie to suck so bad we can’t even stand to play him because we’d have to watch

by enigma2029 on Dec 12, 2011 10:35 PM EST up reply actions

Lance!

Broadway!

I.M. Forme
"When you get yourself into trouble is when you feel you have to do something, and then you get yourself in trouble." --Omar Minaya

by itsmetsforme on Dec 12, 2011 11:08 PM EST reply actions

.

John Olerud, Hall of Famer. Got a nice ring to it.

by squid92 on Dec 13, 2011 1:07 AM EST reply actions

2010 season I thought the Mets were contenders.

2011 I thought they had an outside chance if everything swung right.
Now 2012… I don’t even think that. It depresses me to say but I think we’re fighting for 3rd (maybe 4th) place in the NL East. Can’t blame Sandy (although I haven’t seen him hit one out of the park yet). Wilpons have just gotta go. I don’t know how they’ve stuck around so long but a budget of $95m for a NY based team is just unacceptable.

by guyfish on Dec 13, 2011 7:21 AM EST reply actions