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KO Goes for Bobby V Knockout

When I posted my story on the question of Bobby Valentine: True SABR?, I promised that would be my last Bobby V post for a very long time. AA colleague Chris McShane doubted my ability to make good on this promise; an obvious choice, in retrospect, because here we are.

The reason I'm writing about Valentine yet again is because there's someone else who's been writing about him quite a bit this week, and in far less glowing terms. That would be Keith Olbermann, pundit and baseball fan, who wrote a lengthy blog post detailing exactly why he believes Valentine "was clueless" when he was managing the Mets. During Valentine's press conference on Thursday, he tweeted quite a few snide remarks about the proceedings. He even cited Murray Chass's attempted hit job on Valentine as further evidence of Valentine's unfitness for the job, or any sort of gainful employment among civilized humans.

I was seriously taken aback by the frequency and virulence of Olbermann's attacks. I've seen plenty of people question the choice of Valentine as the new Red Sox manager, but only Olbermann made it seem like a sign of the End Times at Fenway. Citing a crank like Chass--one with a long, unfair history of attacking Valentine almost as often as he hatchet-jobs Mike Piazza--indicates a certain level of desperation in trying to prove his point.

What I found most strange is that, while there are definite blemishes on Valentine's resume, Olbermann's post wasn't a laundry list of complaints. Rather, it concentrated on game 2 of the 2000 World Series, and a decision Valentine made that (to Olbermann) betrayed a fatal lack of judgment on the manager's part. He goes so far as to say it "might be the dumbest World Series managerial move since Casey Stengel completely messed up his 1960 pitching rotation."

I wasn't on the scene for game 2 as he was (he was a sideline reporter then for FOX; yes, FOX), but I've delved deeply into that season and series. As such, his post strikes me as weirdly nitpicky, devoid of context, and indicative of a larger narrative surrounding the 2000 Mets.

Star-divide

00wsgm2_payton_medium
The decision that so appalled Olbermann came in the top of the ninth. The Mets had improbably clawed within one run after trailing 6-0, due in large part to a stunning three-run homer Jay Payton knocked off of Mariano Rivera, who seldom gave up longballs. The next batter due up was light hitting shortstop Kurt Abbott, and Valentine left him in to face Rivera; he explained himself later by saying he had no shortstops left on his bench. Abbott struck out looking to end the game, which allowed the Yankees to hang on and take a 2-0 lead in the series. (Olbermann separates Looking into its own one-word sentence and italicizes it for good measure, just in case you missed it.)

Olbermann counters Valentine's excuse by saying that there were better hitters available he could have turned to, and he could have winged it at shortstop with any one of them if the Mets somehow forced a bottom of the ninth. It's a fair argument. In fact, I'd be inclined to agree with it were it not for one very big factor. Namely, that whoever pinch hit for Abbott would still be facing Mariano Rivera.

The remaining options on the Mets' bench might have been better hitters than Abbott to varying degrees, but Rivera was a great leveler. All batters had a similar record of futility against him, particularly in the postseason. Rivera has given up 11 earned runs in 96 career posteason appearances, and Payton's HR accounted for two of them. Could Rivera have been tiring, since he pitched two innings in game one? Possible, but wouldn't count on it. Yes, in most situations, someone like Matt Franco or Bubba Trammell would have been a better choice. Against the greatest closer of all time, it's probably a lateral move.

Can you say that Valentine still should have taken a shot with someone else, even if it provided a .001% better chance of success? You certainly could. It's not Olbermann's contention that's unreasonable so much as the tone he uses to make it. Valentine's move (or lack thereof) is not simply a questionable one; it is one of the worst ever. Valentine's failure to execute it is presented as a glaring, irrefutable indication of his incompetence. To say it "might be the dumbest World Series managerial move" is neither fair to Valentine nor dumbness.

It's also important to put this game in perspective. This was, after all, the same evening as the infamous Shattered Bat Incident between Piazza and Roger Clemens. Before it started, the game raised the already sky-high hype level of the Subway Series even further, because it was the first time Clemens faced the Mets since he beaned Piazza, seemingly deliberately, with a 96 mph fastball.

Clemens' bat chucking cast a pall over the entire proceedings and made everything that followed seem weird and unnecessary. If you watch the game, you'll notice that even the Yankee Stadium crowd feels uncomfortable with cheering too loud. It was one of the most disturbing World Series games ever played, and if a manager did not make the best moves by the end of it, I can understand the extenuating circumstances.

Last year, I revisited the game, watching it again and surveying the contemporary accounts, to write this recap. I came to the conclusion that Clemens' heinous act--once he inexplicably got away with it, as the umpires somehow chose not eject him--was a brilliant bit of gamesmanship. He placed the Mets in an impossible spot. They could retaliate and be seen as animals; just imagine what kind of condemnation would have rained down on them if they dared start a fight during a World Series in the sacred confines of Yankee Stadium.

The alternative was to keep their heads, not let anyone (least of all Piazza) get ejected, and try to play the game. The Mets chose this course of action, and doing so meant they would have their "fight" questioned forever after. They now were said to be lacking something the Yankees had: the will to win at any cost.

The Yankees were in the midst of an historic dynasty. Anything they did to maintain that dynasty was justifiable, since winning is its own excuse. Clemens was such a "winnner" he'd hurl projectiles at people to make it happen! If you questioned that, you questioned excellence itself.

Olbermann's criticism of Valentine is essentially this POV in reverse: to praise Valentine (and his Mets) is to praise failure. I noted that he chose to applaud Clemens' performance that night (eight shutout innings, nine Ks) while also blasting the Mets for not "charging the mound or anything"--or mentioning the likely source of Clemens' sudden dominance of a team that had formerly owned him.

He harps on the fact that Valentine's teams have never finished in first place, ignoring the fact he was forced to go head-to-head with some juggernauts, like the McGwire-Canseco A's when he managed the Rangers. Valentine's inability to beat Bobby Cox's Braves or the Yankee Dynasty means he was a failure, in Olbermann's book. The list of great baseball figures who never finished first is a long one, and it is an unfair metric by which to judge anyone, at least without any other context.

As a sports fan--as a human, really--I prefer not to believe that every team that doesn't win it all should be regarded a failure. I also prefer not to look at one questionable decision made in an absolutely insane game and extrapolate a person's worth from it.

I realize that asking Olbermann to tone it down is like asking the ocean to quit the whole "being wet" thing. Still, I wish he hadn't couched his critique in his usual language of worsts and absolutes. It was a singular decision made at the tail end of a brutal game against one of the best postseason pitchers ever. It's like punching someone in the arm for 10 minutes and expecting them to do pushups.

If this is really the worst thing you can say about Valentine, you'd be better off saying nothing at all. But we all know silence is not in Olbermann's skills set.

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Olberdouche and Murray Chass are a lot a like

No surprise that he doesn’t like Bobby either.

by graves9 on Dec 2, 2011 12:49 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

I was at game 2

And to this day, I believe there is no reason whatsoever why Clemens should not have been immediately ejected from the game. The whole incident allowed only him to setle down and pitch lights out and I believe it turned the entire series. A failure on the part of MLB to let the prima donna off the hook instead of staring the facts in the face….
Olbermann’s comment is ridiculous.
One silver lining was I still relish the pure terror on Yankee fans faces before that last out in the ninth. they were surely lucky to get out of that game alive and they knew it…

by nynjmetsfan on Dec 2, 2011 1:09 PM EST reply actions  

Olbermann is a punk

He’s a pathetic sports reporter, he’s a pathetic political commentator, and he’s not even that good on-air. He belongs in the same category as blowhards like Chass (sports) and Beck and Maddow (politics): IGNORE. His attempt to do both just makes him even worse. I appreciate the defense of reason, Matthew, but taking a shot at Olbermann is just feeding the troll.

"F***ing shocker." -Billy Wagner

by nymgb44 on Dec 2, 2011 1:13 PM EST reply actions  

Not to delve into politics,

but I’m a fan of Maddow & wouldn’t place her in the same category as Beck, Olbermann & others.

Live ironic and whatnot.

by Brian. on Dec 2, 2011 1:21 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Maddow utilizes facts that help her narrative

Beck utilizes cherry-picked twisted half-truths that help his narrative.

Big difference, yes.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 2, 2011 1:29 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

This

I used to enjoy Countdown on MSNBC, but always recognized KO as a righteous blowhard with an odd mean streak. Rachel Maddow, on the other hand, is much more level-headed, focused, and fair in the way she does her job.

Isn’t Olbermann a Skankee fan anyway? Who the hell cares what he thinks about Bobby V’s time with the Mets?

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Dec 3, 2011 3:54 PM EST up reply actions  

I also miss Glenn Beck's show dearly...

if that helps you understand how I approach cable news punditry as entertainment

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Dec 3, 2011 11:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Agree with all your points

The only success he ever had was co hosting Sportscenter. He got terrible ratings on Msnbc, but was tight with tptb so he stayed on the air for a long time. He is now on a network no one ever heard of. Bobby V on the otherhand was and will be a top manager again.

by graves9 on Dec 2, 2011 1:25 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I don't post often, but I will for this

Joe Torre batted Randy Velarde second in the lineup in Game 2 of the 2001 World Series because he was 19-for-42 lifetime against Randy Johnson, benching Tino Martinez in the process. Tino’s slash that year was .289/.329/.501 – not remarkable, but still a nice 113 OPS+ to go along with 34 HR. I get that this move was all about getting a righty into the lineup over a lefty and Velarde had decent numbers against Randy (four of those 19 hits were DOUBLES), but I always found this legitimately insane. Drop the lefty down in the lineup, sure, but benching a guy who hit 34 HR (thanks in large part, I’m sure, to the short porch that so benefitted LH hitters and handsome shorstops with the ability to hit the ball 314 feet to RF) for RANDY F’ING VELARDE??

Unlike Olbermann, I obviously don’t base my opinion on all of Torre’s managerial skills on this one decision, but does anyone else remember this/think it was absurd that it actually happened? It has obviously stuck with me.

by guidishfish on Dec 2, 2011 1:21 PM EST reply actions  

For the record

Velarde went 0-3 that night and Johnson three-hit the Yankees as the D’Backs won 4-0. Thus, Torre is the WORST MANAGER EVER!!!

by guidishfish on Dec 2, 2011 1:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Because a single play really gives an accurate account of a 20+ year career

Gold Glover-calliber defenseman Bill Buckner knows a thing or two about that.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Dec 2, 2011 1:26 PM EST via mobile reply actions   1 recs

"Because a single play really gives an accurate account of a 20+ year career"

Bill Buckner sez #blameBeltran /timewarp

In lobby for: Jaime Cevallos, Zack Lutz, orange unis and Rickroll as the 7th inning song.
The Unwritten Rules of AA

by Michkin on Dec 2, 2011 1:32 PM EST up reply actions  

the comments to olbermann's post are redicullous too

you got to read them. they are mind-numbing

"it's not easy being green"-kermit the frog
"we the mets are an improved ball club, now we lose in extra innings"-casy stengel
i cant spell a nosebleed
The Official Seinfeld Gif-Man of GGN!!!!!!!!
i'm a moderator for GGN. I will accept tribute.

by rexthejet on Dec 2, 2011 1:30 PM EST reply actions  

one guy wrote
Keith, you wrote this on the birthday of another famous CLEMENS…Samuel! I thought this quote about baseball could teach Bobby V. something. As usual, your masterful style and dexterity with the language just blows me away

"it's not easy being green"-kermit the frog
"we the mets are an improved ball club, now we lose in extra innings"-casy stengel
i cant spell a nosebleed
The Official Seinfeld Gif-Man of GGN!!!!!!!!
i'm a moderator for GGN. I will accept tribute.

by rexthejet on Dec 2, 2011 1:35 PM EST reply actions  

Murray Chass and Keith Olberman

They seem legit

Proud supporter of a New York baseball team and a Boston football team. Yeah, deal with it!
"We don’t listen to the hype. I don’t think we ever have. We really take after our coach and he says ‘When you win, say little. When you lose, say less.'"--Tom Brady
The 2011 New York Mets: I don't know what to describe them as...
Staunch Parishioner Of The First United Church of R.A. Dickey

by R_Adragna on Dec 2, 2011 2:48 PM EST reply actions  

Olberman conveniently neglects to mention

Kurt Abbot hit a double in the ninth off of Rivera in game 1. Perhaps that’s why he was allowed to hit?? And unfortunately, Todd Pratt was on first and was not pinch run for. That was a bigger error by Bobby V. imo. Pratt was catching and Piazza was DHing, but Piazza could have switched to catcher, and the Mets would have a pitcher spot in the lineup to contend with, but so what? It was the ninth inning and they had a 1 run lead. If a fast runner had scored on Abbot’s double (not a guarantee, but who knows?), the Mets go up 2, Benitez has another run to work with and maybe the whole series changes.
/still mad.

by David G on Dec 2, 2011 5:23 PM EST reply actions  

Olberman

Professional Strength Douchebag

One day, this team is going to kill me.

by fxcarden on Dec 2, 2011 6:57 PM EST reply actions  

for when regular strength just won't cut it!

Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?

by KeithsMoustache on Dec 3, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions  

Hindsight 20/20 and all that, but I thought the move was a mistake at the time

However, disregarding an entire body of work and basing your opinions of Bobby off of one play is just sensationalist journalism.

A deadline has a wonderful way of concentrating the mind.-Professor James Moriarty
Everyone is entitled to his own opinion, but not to his own facts.- Former Sen. Daniel Patrick Moynihan

by Blame-everyone-else on Dec 3, 2011 7:59 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

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