Phillies 10, Mets 3: Two Ninth Inning Homers Not Enough As Mets Come Up Short
by James Kannengieser on Apr 29, 2011 10:22 PM EDT
Email
Print 
I'm trying to figure out what Mike Pelfrey does well. He doesn't miss bats -- that's been known for awhile. His control is average at best and terrible this season. He used to be a kinda-sorta groundball pitcher if you squint. That's disappeared. I suppose he's effective at suppressing home runs when pitching at home. If that is your only skill, you probably are not long for the big leagues.
Pelfrey endured another poor start tonight. He lasted just 4.1 innings, allowing 4 runs on 8 hits, including a 2-run homer to Ryan Howard. He did strike out three, but one came against the opposing pitcher, Vance Worley, and the other two were against walking corpse Raul Ibanez. They're not saying "RaUUUULLL" -- they're booing. Pelfrey's BABIP is obscenely high but that's not a viable excuse given his awful peripherals.
The Mets need to figure out what to do with Pelf. His velocity is down, his ERA is 7.39 and there's really nothing to like about his performance this season. Maybe his splitter is a positive -- he threw 15 of them tonight and 10 went for strikes. What to do? Send him to the minors? Trade him? Let him ride this out? Pelfrey has been remarkably atrocious on the road, as Mark Simon of ESPN notes. Should the rotation order be tailored to have Pelf pitch only at Citi Field? Maybe he'll improve the next time out, further removed from the effects of the flu.
Terry Collins called on Dillon Gee to relieve Pelfrey with one out in the fifth inning. Gee hasn't pitched out of the bullpen in years and it seemed like a strange decision. Even more curious was not summoning Tim Byrdak to face Howard in the sixth inning with two outs and the bases loaded. If Byrdak isn't used in that spot then he may as well not be on the roster. Gee induced two swinging strikes against Howard before allowing a grand slam. That made the score 8-0 and killed any slim hopes of a comeback.
Ike Davis and Jason Pridie both homered in the ninth inning to thwart the shutout. Ike's was a solo shot to center and Pridie's was a two-run job to right-center. The Mets' offense was non-existent until that point against the rookie Worley, who struck out five (all looking) in six shutout innings. He had some help from home plate umpire Gary Cederstrom, who expanded the outside corner of the strike zone for lefthanded batters. Here is his strike zone plot for righthanded batters -- this is from the catcher's point of view. Red = strikes; green = balls. Click the plots to embiggen:
Not bad. Almost robot-like, if pitch f/x is assumed to be accurate. And for lefthanded batters:
Yikes, check out the wide left side of the zone. At least he was consistent.
Happy birthday to the best play-by-play guy around, Gary Cohen. It's Jon Niese vs. Roy Halladay tomorrow at 1:10 on Fox.
Unintentionally sexual quote of the game: "Suppose he goes down below, what's he gonna work on?" -- Bob Ojeda
K Counter by sparbz
SB Nation Coverage
* Traditional Recap
* Boxscore
* Amazin' Avenue Gamethread
* The Good Phight Gamethread
Win Probability Added
Big winners: David Wright +3.9%, Daniel Murphy +2.6%
Big losers: Mike Pelfrey -17.5% (as pitcher), Jason Bay -8.3%
Teh aw3s0mest play: Carlos Beltran walk +6.8%
Teh sux0rest play: Ryan Howard two-run homer -19.1%
Total pitcher WPA: -19.7%
Total batter WPA: -30.3%
GWRBI!: Ryan Howard
Game Thread Roll Call
Nice job by MetsFan4Decades; her effort in the game thread embiggens us all.
| Num | Name | # of Posts |
|---|---|---|
| 1 | MetsFan4Decades | 81 |
| 2 | fxcarden | 70 |
| 3 | itsmetsforme | 53 |
| 4 | aparkermarshall | 51 |
| 5 | BurleighGrimes | 51 |
| 6 | reyoreyo | 49 |
| 7 | sparbz | 49 |
| 8 | Michkin | 40 |
| 9 | Evan_S | 40 |
| 10 | HotChipWillBreakYourLegs | 39 |
161 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
If there was a God, he'd strike down every single Phillies fan with a syphillis plague. Like right now.
Proud supporter of a New York baseball team and a Boston football team. Yeah, deal with it!
"We don’t listen to the hype. I don’t think we ever have. We really take after our coach and he says ‘When you win, say little. When you lose, say less.'"--Tom Brady
The 2011 New York Mets: Facepalm...
Staunch Parishioner Of The First United Church of R.A. Dickey
He did that years ago
Why do you think the place looks like that
_______________________________________________
$100 to CARE per No-No and $1 per David Wright Homer.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Apr 29, 2011 10:27 PM EDT up reply actions 4 recs
Apparently, they're not dead for some reason.
He’s fucking with the rest of us decent folk.
Proud supporter of a New York baseball team and a Boston football team. Yeah, deal with it!
"We don’t listen to the hype. I don’t think we ever have. We really take after our coach and he says ‘When you win, say little. When you lose, say less.'"--Tom Brady
The 2011 New York Mets: Facepalm...
Staunch Parishioner Of The First United Church of R.A. Dickey
You tell him, Bobby O.
‘You either accept your assignment to triple A to fix it, or you continue to fail up here’.
‘But you might have some fake positives down there. It’s a lot easier to get guys out down there. It’s mound presence, it’s game plan, that’s the problem up here’.
In other words, Ollie being on the roster was allowing Pelfrey’s mental make up out there to slide under the radar?
by MetsFan4Decades on Apr 29, 2011 10:25 PM EDT reply actions
He's been shitacular since July of last year
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2011 Mets- Rock bottom: We haven't reached it yet
He was so-so in August, but had a decent September.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 12:58 AM EDT up reply actions
"In August"
when there was no pressure. Pelfrey sucks. And now, he doesn’t even have any trade value.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
There was no pressure the entire 2010 season, practically.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions
lol
Good point.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
The closest we were ever, was like less than 5 back in mid-to-late June?
The whole crash-and-burn part started during that Puerto Rico trip. Ugh…
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:13 AM EDT up reply actions
you mean, he sucks? (to Ogre)
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Apr 30, 2011 6:54 AM EDT up reply actions
Love the title
How many more starts like this before he gets bumped from the rotation?
by brooklynberger on Apr 29, 2011 10:25 PM EDT reply actions
Given that we don't really have anyone better?
The rest of the season?
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 12:58 AM EDT up reply actions
Dillon Gee is better than Pelfrey
Gee has a better breaking ball and is tougher mentally on the mound.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
Mike Pelfrey is better than Dillon Gee
Minor League numbers, and Major League numbers
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:04 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Well, to be accurate
I will amend my statement to say that the jury is still out on Gee given the small sample size we have, but the jury has come back on Pelfrey.
As for minor league stats, sometimes they mean something, sometimes they don’t. In this case, I don’t think they mean very much.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
"and is tougher mentally on the mound."
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Apr 30, 2011 1:10 AM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Does mentality make a difference?
I mean, Lincecum is a pothead but hes never accused of a bad mentality
Squeezed to Song and Bendtner and Song and Nasri oh lovely lovely lovely!
-Peter Drury, the one time his commentating has ever been acceptable.
by Aidan Gibson on Apr 30, 2011 1:34 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Why would being a pothead and having a bad mentality go hand in hand
Maybe Pelf needs to get a medical marijuana script so he’ll chill the heck out.
Makes about as much sense as Pelfrey "looking defeated" or "not having the right mentality".
(Not saying you specifically have said that, but others have said similar things.)
Save Jenrry Mejia!
I would definintely agree that Gee is better than Pelfrey
My case is based on the fact that Gee is actually a complete ‘pitcher’. He knows how to work the zone and locate pitches, can throw many pitches for strikes and it seems like he is comfortable on the mound and knows what he is doing. On the other hand Pelf can’t throw anything for a strike, can’t locate any pitches and looks lost before he eve throws a pitch.
Who knows what is going to happen with Pelf if he cant figure something out or not. But I wouldn’t mind replacing him with Gee for a while while Pelf goes to the minors. And then when/if Johan comes back we could just trade Pelf away for another missed prospect.
This goes without saying, but
We are in for a LONG year.
There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only GRISSIONZ
The 2011 Mets- Rock bottom: We haven't reached it yet
How R.A. spent his day off
_______________________________________________
$100 to CARE per No-No and $1 per David Wright Homer.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Apr 29, 2011 10:26 PM EDT reply actions 7 recs
TC just about speechless here in the post game.
Said ’it’s my fault’. Meaning he should have known better with Pelfrey being sick and not listened to the ‘I can do this’ mindset. ‘I asked him to do something today I probably should not have’.
Said ‘I sent him out there’.
That may very well be, but he wasn’t out there throwing that ball.
by MetsFan4Decades on Apr 29, 2011 10:30 PM EDT reply actions
Right
Plus, I have to believe that Collins asked Pelfrey if he ok to pitch and Pelf said “give me the ball.” That’s on Mike, not TC.
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
And if he said "I don't think I can go"
you can bet the MSM would jump on it and call him gutless and weak-willed.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
This.
I would have been more evidence that he’s mentally soft.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 11:12 AM EDT up reply actions
As bad as Pelf was Terry wasn't much better tonight
The decision to walk Schneider wasn’t smart , and not bringing in Brydak to face Howard down 4-0 didn’t make sense. It was laughable to see Brydak come in to face Howard down 10-0. The bats did nothing tonight. The Bay at bat in the 6th was killer.
True
"Never throw a slider to The Glider."
- Ed Charles, No. 5
"Who has more fun than people?"
- Ralph Kiner
Gonna ruin Gee
I don’t understand the logic behind trying to make Dillon Gee a relief pitcher. A couple of spots like what he got thrown into tonite and he will fall the way Pelfrey has. Let the kid start…he deserves it after a 2.15 ERA in September. That is better than any pitcher on this staff!
That's fucking logic.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 12:59 AM EDT up reply actions
agree too
really with Pelf being sick he should have started and pushed Pelf back a couple of days. but leave him as a SP in the minors and call up when needed. I bet he will end up with 15 starts this season due to injuries anyway
Any task BIG or small, Do it well or not at all
by Rickfansince76 on Apr 30, 2011 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
I doubt they're trying making him into a reliever.
It’s much more likely that they saw that the likelihood they’d need a spot starter (or a very-long reliever) in the (then) coming week was pretty high.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Maybe
But this is the kind of crap that can screw up a marginally good pitcher, especially when he’s young
It's a week.
If he’s still in that spot after a month, then we can start panicking.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Rotation
He should be in the rotation now.
Debatable.
As bad as Pelfrey has been, his trade value come almost solely form his ability to give you 100 mediocre innings. Moving him to the pen would kill that value so they should give him every chance to work out of his (largely BABIP-induced) troubles.
Chances are that they see Capuano and Young is the same light (as movable assets). They are much more valuable at the trade deadline if they are starters than they would be as relievers.
Again, if Gee is still serving as the longman in a month, then I’ll start complaining. It’s not going to kill his development to fill that role for a week or two.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Thing is, though, what more does Gee really have left to develop?
He had good success in the low Minors, stopped having success in AAA, seemingly mostly because of giving up too many HRs, since his peripheral numbers were good, and has been mostly good thus far in his limited MLB time. If we send him back to AAA, asides for building stamina or whatever, what does he need to work on? His K/9 rate is high, his BB/9 rate is reasonable…
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:03 AM EDT up reply actions
I think that as long as they use him properly he should be fine
However, bringing a young starter into an inning with guys on base made no sense whatsoever. Bring in the specialists to put out the fire, the let Gee start an inning. TC [and all managers really] just make really dumb decisions that seem so odd even at the time. I find myself saying “stop trying to manage the game” while watching the Mets since Bobby V really. Stop walking the terrible hitting 8th hitter, stop bunting, stop getting fancy with the bullpen, stop double switching, etc. Just let the game breathe already. Ryan Howard up with bases loaded, bring in the lefty specialist. Down and run in the 9th with a man on first and no outs, stop bunting.. Never, ever, walk Brian Schneider. These managers really make things so damn hard. To get back to the original point, it is easy to see how Gee in long relief could have been useful and even a good experience for him tonight on a night where the started was recovering from illness. Why bring him into the middle of an inning though? Just dumb.
by Bruce Wayne on Apr 29, 2011 10:45 PM EDT up reply actions 6 recs
Good job batman
_______________________________________________
$100 to CARE per No-No and $1 per David Wright Homer.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Apr 29, 2011 11:04 PM EDT up reply actions
They kept saying last night
how Gee is pitching thru a partially torn labrum, and they said that it is better for him to start because he can fully warm up. Warthen, of course, thinks Gee is a habitual liar.
One day, this team is going to kill me.
by fxcarden on Apr 30, 2011 9:56 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
Walking Schneider
Really a headscratcher, especially seeing as that (walking the 8th batter to face the pitcher, thereby ensuring he doesn’t leadoff next inning) backfired against the Braves just recently against the Mets. Schneids had 2 hits (albeit homers) all year.
The bottom line is
It’s wonderful to have a functioning 6th starter in case of injury, rainouts, and oh yeah, how about when a starter loses ten pounds due to the flu over the course of three days? Pelfrey pitched okay against the D’Backs his last time out, but without being a Monday morning quarterback, Terry should’ve skipped Pelf for Gee here. This was a good time to get Gee work while understanding that Pelfrey might not be 100%. If I was busy yakking all week and I lose the weight of an infant, I might not be ready to face a World Series contender in a little league park immediately thereafter. Just sayin’…
Amazin Avenue Offseason Plan Contest Winner - 2011 Mets
by MattT516 on Apr 29, 2011 11:54 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Why must the Mets make AAAA scrubs look like Roy Halladay
when they have to face the real one tomorrow? Glad that I did not watch this game
Why must God persist in sending Tornadoes across the southern states causing misery and destruction
when he could send them on Philly and actually make the place look better?
There are no answers to these questions
_______________________________________________
$100 to CARE per No-No and $1 per David Wright Homer.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Apr 29, 2011 11:10 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
id be ok with a few tomahawk
Missiles aimed at philly
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:42 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
just avoid my place please
… and the Linc :)
And The Penthouse Club.
Proud supporter of a New York baseball team and a Boston football team. Yeah, deal with it!
"We don’t listen to the hype. I don’t think we ever have. We really take after our coach and he says ‘When you win, say little. When you lose, say less.'"--Tom Brady
The 2011 New York Mets: Facepalm...
Staunch Parishioner Of The First United Church of R.A. Dickey
no linc goes down
It is hot zone 2 of just awful things.
Die eagles die
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 12:46 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
no linc goes down
It is hot zone 2 of just awful things.
Die eagles die
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 12:47 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Ha!
First time to top the embiggen chart. I must really like pain to stick with this one ’till the end.
(just a minor note though. That’s Ms. MetsFan4Decades.)
by MetsFan4Decades on Apr 30, 2011 12:10 AM EDT reply actions
Ike Davis and Justin Turner padding their stats with meaningless home runs.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:04 AM EDT reply actions
*Jason Pridie
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Apr 30, 2011 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Yeah, him. Whoops
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:14 AM EDT up reply actions
Pelfrey was done as soon as the Mets put the pressure of naming him #1 starter.
He does not pitch well under pressure (proven) and I would never rely on him to pitch well in a big game.Please do not waste what little $ the Wilponzies have on this.His stats on the road and his AHW is laughable.
Everytime things start going wrong you can see it all over his face and he does not have a
secondary plan to fall back on like most quality pitchers.An out pitch would help but he lacks one.Would you resign him for (Boras) money which is probably 5 yrs for $75 million.
by Putnan Prince on Apr 30, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
Everything after the (see it all over his face: thing makes sense. The lack of an out-pitch is huge.
Still waiting for that proof that “he does not pitch well under pressure”.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
lol boras money?
just because he is his agent doesn’t mean he is going to get than money. if a pitcher is turrible he is not going to make Burnett money or anything close to it. Pelf is going to be lucky to get 3 or four years with anybody.
Hopefully he reestablishes himself and then we can sell him to a team for some other useful part.
Certified terrible pitcher Scott Schoeneweis
got a 3 year/10 million dollar deal with Boras at his agent. The guy works miracles.
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Apr 30, 2011 2:05 PM EDT up reply actions
From Omar.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 2:21 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
You're providing a false observation, not proof
__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden
"He does not pitch well under pressure (proven)"
Define pressure. And, there is no proof. Define proof.
He does not pitch well in stadiums that do not mask his weaknesses- mainly, preventing FBs from turning into HRs.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!"
Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 453 posts (10/03/10)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest
by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Apr 30, 2011 1:15 AM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
How about proving it to the rest of us, then?
Because we’re not so easily convinced.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions
Maybe we can flip Pelf to the Twins for
struggling Lirano. Lirano reunited with Santana for the cost of nothing. Ahh I can dream right?
Liriano? I'd rather have some prospects at this point
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
by feslenraster on Apr 30, 2011 6:57 AM EDT up reply actions
What's up with Liriano?
Is it control or velocity issues? Because if it was a fixable issue, I do that deal in a heartbeat.
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Apr 30, 2011 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions
Best part of the box score
Mets pitchers hit 4 Philly batters today, including Loserino and Howard. I don’t wish for anyone to get hurt… hell yeah I do, especially those two.
by tfinnz on Apr 30, 2011 3:26 AM EDT reply actions 1 recs
yeah but they should be beaning them not just grazing their feet
_______________________________________________
$100 to CARE per No-No and $1 per David Wright Homer.
by ScottfromPeekskill on Apr 30, 2011 10:26 AM EDT up reply actions
damn, i owe more money for the kidz now
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 11:29 AM EDT up reply actions
sigh ...should've traded Pelfrey when he was valuable
"Fantasy, reality, science Fiction. Which is which? Who can tell?"
except that everybody
thought he could be an ace. now he’s just an ass.
One day, this team is going to kill me.
If the MSM says something
you can go ahead and assume the opposite.
The the FO ever come out and say “ace potential”?
Save Jenrry Mejia!
Not the current FO, but I distinctly remember our buddy Minaya
talking about “ace potential” regarding Pelfrey. I remember guys like Ed Coleman jumping on the bandwagon. It has definitely been said more than once. Even Bobby Ojeda has said it on air at SNY. So, it has been said plenty of times, usually when Pelfrey does well for as few starts.
One day, this team is going to kill me.
Who really cares what the sports media says?
They’re generally useless and most often wrong.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 11:35 AM EDT up reply actions
Nice Picture of Sonny
Better call in that favor from Buonoserra to embalm Pelfrey.
DUDE
Not here to troll, just have to say that the recap picture is effing brilliant (regardless of the teams involved) and I laughed heartily for a good while at it.
Kudos to JK.
by Chutley's Impressed by Mac's Speed on Apr 30, 2011 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions 2 recs
He does deserve kudos
as do all the mods and members who give us some hilarious pics, gifs and ms paint posts.
Good job on the recap, James
for today and tomorrow’s game, whoever is writing the recap, should probably have it ready by the 3rd inning.
One day, this team is going to kill me.
The mets just couldn't get anything going against [Halladay] [Lee] today.
There, I got it started
I believe in one Dickey, Maker of knuckles and balls
by HotChipWillBreakYourLegs on Apr 30, 2011 10:52 AM EDT up reply actions
Parnell
What’s the story with when he may be able to return?
Tiny sample size, but the profile of plate discipline against him makes it seem like he isn’t pitching worse than last year, other than walks. But he had one intentional walk. And his zone % is actually slightly up. Zone contact slightly down. Outside contact against slightly down. Swinging strike rate up. Contact rate down. Outside swing is slightly down and zone swing slightly up, but given that overall contact rate is down, that hasn’t hurt much.
Like I said, tiny sample. He may have been pitching fine and then just lost it against a couple batters. Likely when his finger issue cropped up. All other signs suggest he was fine. One or 2 fewer unintentional walks is all that would have been needed to make his peripherals match up with last year.
Add to that his HR/FB rate this year
He really shows signs of getting kinda unlucky in the start of the year. I mean 25% HR/FB is beyond unsustainable.
Pelfreys best asset is his ability to project negativity
I think there is so much more going on with him than what we can physically see. It looks like he has so much inner conflict going on. He just looks like he does not want to be out there. With every move he makes, good or bad, he looks like he’s stressing out. Even when he’s pitching well, it’s almost as if his brain is trying to convince him that he sucks. I’m telling you this guy has mental issues. He doesn’t trust in anything he does. He doesn’t need coaching he needs a psychiatrist. This guy is starting to pick up some speed as he moves closer and closer to the edge.
He has pitching issues
Plain and simple. What is that, Occam’s Razor. I’d be stressed out too if my velocity was down, I can get enough swinging strikes, groundballs, etc.
I don't really see it that way
You see it as him having issues specifically because his velocity is down. I see it as his issues causing his velocity to plummet. Even when he was pitching “well” and his velocity was up, he kind of had the same body language as he does now. Always seems unsure of himself, never really seems like he has any confidence at all.
Wait a minute
if he had the same look to him/body language when he was successful as he does now (when he’s struggling), doesn’t that tell you that his appearance means nothing?
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Apr 30, 2011 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 1 recs
I will concede
that there isa mental make-up aspect to pitching. Pelfrey’s problem seems to mostly be the pitching aspect of pitching. He has had some modicum of success (fluctuating mostly depending on luck, when he is getting grounders or when he has a tad more control), but he always had little margin of error to slip in his control, velocity, grounders. That slight slippage in those areas are disastrous for him, and he didn’t have stamina after being sick.
It is mostly that he needs another pitch, not lack of composure. Hard to have composure when major leaguers can hammer your slop. Look at Jon Broxton, albeit a reliever. Lose 3 mph and suddenly you’re a punching bag even throwing 92-94.
Agreed.
I don’t think anyone is saying that there is absolutely no mental aspect to the game, just that we have no way of knowing how much a certain player “has” or how much it even effects the outcome.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
I don't understand why its so hard for people to accept Pelf might just not be that good
some people are acting like he’s the next Cy Young, and all thats holding him back is his own lack of “can-do” attitude. He had a good run for a month or so last year that seems to have skewed the expectations of people. As you say, the problem with Pelf is he’s always had stuff that was just good enough, and it’s just not getting the job done now. His problem is artificially inflated expectations as much as it is his pitching. His xFIP- has never been below 100, meaning he’s never been better than average for any season in his career so far by FIP. Why do we suddenly think he’s something more?
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 11:37 AM EDT up reply actions
I agree with you
But at this point it doesn’t look like he will be working on developing any type of out pitch. So, I’m just taking it face value.
NO
His success was short lived. He always had poor body language but it’s terrible now.
Just out of curiousity,
are you a psychologist? Do you know Mike Pelfrey? What qualifies you to make statements about his allegedly poor body language with any authority?
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
NO
No, No and none. Why, does it take a qualified psychologist to figure out someone has poor body language?….Just out of curiosity?
Because you're speaking as though you have some authority on the matter.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 2:22 PM EDT up reply actions
I mean you're talking about his body language like you have a good idea what his means.
But without having any training on the subject, or better, knowing Pelfrey, it’s just meaningless speculation.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 3:08 PM EDT up reply actions
So no one can speculate on AA May as well shut it down.
by Putnan Prince on Apr 30, 2011 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions
.
DO
Rely on fact-based analysis. This is not a stats-first site, it’s a facts-first site. Intellectual honesty means being accountable for your assertions, so if you’re going to argue a point you better be sure you have the evidence to support it.
DO NOT
Rely on tired baseball platitudes to make your point. If your comment/FanPost is indistinguishable from a random Joe Morgan Q&A (i.e. sub-moronic drivel) do yourself and everyone else a favor by not posting it.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
by Ogre39666 on Apr 30, 2011 4:42 PM EDT up reply actions 5 recs
Thank you for making my point for me.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 5:41 PM EDT up reply actions
Facts.
I love ’em!
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Apr 30, 2011 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions
So his poor body language is the reason why he doesn't strike anybody out?
It’s the reason why he gives up so many hits?
Or is it that he may or may not have poor body language, but that doesn’t really matter because he just doesn’t have an out pitch and his FB velocity has dropped?
The latter is much more plausible to me.
Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
by Steve Schreiber on Apr 30, 2011 4:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Exactly
If Pelfrey was pitching at his best, people would be calling him “ice cold.” He’s pitching at his worst so people practically think that he should be institutionalized.
__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden
mini golf is correct term
So pelf needs his happy place?
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:24 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
im of the opinion
Major league 3 doesn’t exist.
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:37 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
it's a good opinion
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
baseball comedys i can only watch 5
In no order
Major league
Major league 2
Bull durham
Rookie of the year
Sandlot
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:44 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
what
no love for Danny Glover?
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 11:46 AM EDT up reply actions
i did not care for angels
That team in the movie lacked grission
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:52 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
The original was grainy as hell though.
Leave it to Hollywood to un-grissionify America.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
#blamedeadpsychiatrist
Going to hell
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:23 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Can't
get enough swinging strikes, meant to say.
Of course I can’t get any swinging strikes.
Pelfrey can live with getting low SS rates though
Assuming he keeps his GB rate high. What has seemed to be his issue this year, IMO, is twofold. First, his stuff is clearly off. His FB velocity is down to 91.1 (fangraphs PitchF/X), which is 1MPH less than last year and last year his FB velocity dropped a bit from the 2 years prior to that. His FB has also seemed to have lost some of that sink that it used to have a couple years back.
Secondly, his pitch selection at times seems to be terrible, and his ability locate is average at best. For example, last night he threw a few splitters, to righties on the outer half of the plate, missed and left it sitting right in the middle. I realize I am isolating a single event, but in my watching him (this could be totally off) this happens a decent amount of the time. He just seems to use pitches (or mis-execute) with alarming frequency.
His GB% isn't that high, though.
For his career it’s 49%. Considering his reliance on a two-seamer, it ought to be a lot higher.
"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."
by BobbyV_Incognito on Apr 30, 2011 11:18 AM EDT up reply actions
I mean its not Derek Lowe levels
In 2008, 2009 (when Pelf was starting to show improvements and his potential IMO) his GB rates were 49.6% and 51.3%. Those are pretty solid. For some perspective they were around the 15th best in MLB those years.
The issue really is that instead of continuing that and building upon it, Pelf has seemed to take a step back.
He can live with the low swinging strikes,
as long as he is exhibiting Pineiroesque control and groundballs. Which means little margin for error. Living with it for him means having some years of 5 e.r.a.s, some of 3.50-3.75, with his xfips always 4.50 ish. And then slipping further in the areas where he has shown some success means the disaster you see now.
Is it mental that he throws a slower fastball? No. is it mental that he isn’t throwing strikes? I’m not sure he isn’t, but maybe he thinks strikes will be hit hard. Is it mental he doesn’t have another pitch. Likely not. Is his pitch sequence out of whack? Ask Thole.
I bet if he had another pitch, and 2-3 mph more he had when younger in the minors, his mental mak-up would suddenly seem to improve.
Pelfrey can certainly get by with his current pitches
If he could command his slider and splitter worth a damn.
I hate to use Lowe as an example all the time with Pelf, but the comparison is apt. He throws his FB, SL and CH. Pelf throws the same stuff basically. The difference is Lowe can actually hit his spots (or at least used to) and throw his non-FB’s for strikes with some consistency.
Solution
Pelfrey needs to start drinking heavily.
Same thing
I meant another good pitch. Meaning sure, his assortment in and of itself is fine, if he could, uh, actually throw them well, such as hit his spots with them, like you said.
big pelf
The only thing he is cooking is a steaming bowl of suck
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 11:17 AM EDT via mobile reply actions 1 recs
Terry made a couple bad decisions
Brian Schneider was intentionally walked with two outs and a runner on 2nd in the 4th inning to face the pitcher. Schneider is having a garbage season and if Pelf got him out, the pitcher would have led off the 5th. Instead, Victorino led off the 5th, got on base, and Pelf was out of the game 4 batters later. The IBB was universally panned.
His mid-game bullpen management was suspect too. Byrdak was brought in to the game when it was 10-0 when he should have entered at 4-0 and Howard up with the bases chucked.
by James Kannengieser on Apr 30, 2011 11:47 AM EDT up reply actions
yea the byrdak thing confuses me to no end
I can’t even fathom what prompted that decision
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 11:48 AM EDT up reply actions
Starting Pelfrey at all
Bringing Gee in mid-inning, etc.
The Byrdak thing was really bad IMO
While I didn’t agree with the IBB either, not using Byrdak there made absolutely zero sense. Especially because Gee’s big weakness is giving up HR’s and they were playing in CBP.
Warthen
Amazingly, Dan Warthen was encouraged by Pelfrey’s performance. He claimed that he can’t wait to see Mike’s next 25 starts. This is part of the problem. Pelfrey keeps regressing and Warthan keeps bragging about him. Dan is part of the old regime that is in denial while over-rating their talent.
where did you see these Warthen comments ?
please provide a link.
One day, this team is going to kill me.
havent seen these comments, but I do wonder what horrible pictures of the Wilpons Warthen must have to keep his job
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 12:26 PM EDT up reply actions
Who has really developed
under his tutelage. Not just one good year but consistently. He’s not Dave Duncan or Don Cooper (is that his name, White Sox guy who has helped turn Danks and Gavin Floyd into good pitchers, although I supose I jumped the gun too fast on Edwin Jackson).
not just that, but our pitchers seem to get progressively worse the longer they're around him
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
im amazed our pal bud selig
Still believes the pons are capable owners still.
I hate Philadelphia so much.
by the caveman on Apr 30, 2011 12:40 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
He doesn't
That’s why he forced them to bring in Sandy Alderson. Or so a source close to another team’s executive may have said.
sources close to someone who is familiar with a team source said they think Sandy Alderson might be someone Bud Selig is fond of
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Apr 30, 2011 1:10 PM EDT up reply actions
sources close to someone close to the source
said the source knows something about someone
One day, this team is going to kill me.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Amazin' Avenue
Related FanShots on Amazin' Avenue
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recommended FanShots
Recent FanShots
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recommended FanPosts
Recent FanPosts
Baseball Nation Recent Stories
In Association With
Big League Stew - MLB - Yahoo! Sports
- Get a grip: Reds’ Todd Frazier loses bat, still connects for home run (Video)
- Eric Hosmer redefines the Baltimore chop with infield double (Video)
- College player makes impossible over the fence catch to save tournament game (Video)
- Security!: Camden Yards guard collides with Royals’ Mike Moustakas
- The Juice: Nelson Cruz matches career high eight RBIs, Pujols stays hot in Seattle
