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Around SBN: 7 Important Questions About The Heat Vs. Celtics Series

Mets Who Might Get Traded + The Future


I don't really know anything about prospects around the league and I don't have enough time to follow all the blogs and fanposts to stay up to date on opinions and hypotheticals, so I wanted to throw some questions up here to try and get myself up to speed.

I do know at this point that its pretty obvious that the Mets aren't going to make any substantial additions to the roster before the 2012 season begins. With Bautista getting signed today, that fills the swingman role Sandy mentioned, so it's possible that we dont sign anyone else at all. We're pretty much running with what we've got at this point and focusing more on rebuilding than trying to compete in an increasingly competitive NL East.

My view on the roster is kind of split. I love all the young players, but it seems the selection we have doesn't really fit our needs.

For starters, Duda is a somewhat promising player, but my gut tells me he will never be anything too special. Ike is probably the superior first basemen and hitter. So lets assume Duda does well at the plate the first half of the season and manages to not embarrass himself in right field. Do Sandy and co. try to move him? He clearly does not belong in the outfield. Seems much better suited to be a DH/1B. If he is doing well at the plate in the first half and he is moved, what kind of return would we expect on that type of player? And what type of player would be best suited to play RF for us longterm?

Next, Daniel Murphy. I love this guy. I loved watching him play all of last season, but everyone has serious doubts about his ability to play 2B every day. If he hits as well as he did last season, but is struggling at 2B, does Sandy and co. try to move him? I think he is best suited to play 3B and I'm sure there would be significant interest in him if he continues to hit the way he did last season. What kind of return could we expect for someone of his skill set? And what is the realistic type of 2B the Mets need longterm?

Mike Pelfrey. I hate him. A few years ago I was a big fan, but he is just so disappointing. He doesn't seem to care at all. I have zero faith that he will be anything more than an innings eater (yes, I know that has value in helping to not tax the bullpen, etc..) If he has even a decent first half, I PRAY that Sandy moves him for... anything. I'd take back a bag of balls in return for him. Can we ever expect to get any value in return for him? I highly doubt it.

Finally, David Wright. I think there is a very real chance he gets traded. It would break my heart, but I wouldn't be shocked. When Sandy said something along the lines of "don't worry about losing Reyes and Wright in the same year...", that indicated to me that while he wouldn't lose them both so close together, he has little reservation of moving him later. Being that his contract is about to expire, even if he has a huge bounce back year, it seems like that is really going to reduce the return we could get for him at the deadline. If he gets back to near his career best numbers, with his expiring contract being considered, what kind of return could we expect for David? What type of 3B do the Mets need long term?

I asked that same question for each player- What kind of player do the Mets need long term for RF/2B/3B? What I mean when I ask that-- what type of player do you THINK Sandy and co. would want to fill that spot with? I'm not exactly sure what type of team they're trying to build yet. Of course I've read Moneyball and know about Sandy's "chicks love the longball" attitude, but I'm not exactly sure how his philosophy is translating to the Mets. Over the past few seasons, during the Omar years, we were very focused on speed, but obviously that is going the way of the buffalo. So what type of team does the front office intend to have a few seasons from now when the rebuilding process starts to show up on the field at the major league level? I'm fully aware of the solid pitching prospects we have and the intentions for the future rotation seems fairly clear, but its hard to tell what type of defensive and offensive team is going to be on field a year or two from now.

If those pitching prospects are filling up the rotation in 2013 and it looks like theres a decent shot at contention, do we go out and get a young center fielder? Is Sandy going to try and be a home run slugging team?

Very interested in hearing everyones opinions. Most of what I read is about how pathetic everything is now and how we have to wait for 2013-2014 for when pitching prospects are ready to take over, but I never see much about what the rest of the team might look like at that point.

Apologies if these kinds of discussions have already gone on, but like I said, I just don't have the time to follow all the blogs, so I hope the community here can help me get up to speed.

This FanPost was contributed by a member of the community and was not subject to any vetting or approval process. It does not necessarily reflect the opinions, reasoning skills, or attention to grammar and usage rules held by the editors of this site.

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I am going to sit here watching my screen until someone says "Who?"

Just so that I can say “Yes”

Bobby Baseball - The future of Amazin' Avenue.

by Bobby Baseball on Jan 10, 2012 5:26 PM EST up reply actions  

Yes!

Bobby Baseball - The future of Amazin' Avenue.

by Bobby Baseball on Jan 10, 2012 8:06 PM EST up reply actions  

Miguel Batista?

"You're boring. You probably don’t even drink beer while you watch baseball."

by WinstonSmith on Jan 10, 2012 8:04 PM EST up reply actions  

no

see above

2012 New York Mets, World Series Champions!

by astromets on Jan 10, 2012 11:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Uh
When Sandy said something along the lines of “don’t worry about losing Reyes and Wright in the same year…”

…it is no longer the same year.

Happy New Year!

"..."

by Thaddeus Ballpheasant on Jan 10, 2012 5:44 PM EST reply actions  

.
What I mean when I ask that— what type of player do you THINK Sandy and co. would want to fill that spot with?

Good players.

/end unhelpfulness

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 10, 2012 8:08 PM EST reply actions  

I expect Sandy to build a power pitching/power hitting team similar to the Frank Cashen Mets of the 80’s, and Sandy’s own Bash Brother A’s.

by sturock on Jan 10, 2012 9:57 PM EST reply actions  

It depends on our record by the trade deadline,

but seeing as how we are likely to be in last place, there may be quite a few trades happening. It also depends on how each individual player is doing and how much value they have. As for returns, I would suspect Sandy is looking for prospects that are close to reaching the majors or young guys with little service time. I think they will be trying to target a good catching prospect, young pitching or maybe a good SS or 3B prospect.

I think Duda is a good bet to be traded and like you said he would fit best in a 1B/DH role so possibly to Toronto or Tampa.

Murphy’s value to the Mets depends on his ability to start. If any of 1B, 2B, or 3B positions has a hole this year Murphy will probably not be traded this year. I don’t see Murphy as a longtime starter for this team though. His defense will probably not hold up at second and his bat, while awesome, is a little light on power for a corner IF spot. He would make a good starter on a second division team and I suspect he will be traded next offseason.

Sadly I don’t think Pelfrey will have enough value to be worth a trade. Teams at the trade deadline that are trying to get to the playoffs usually only want good pitchers.

As for Wright I really have no idea. The whole summer is going to be filled with BS articles about wether he gets traded or not and I’m sure they are going to rehash all the Reyes BS from this summer. If Wright plays more like we know he can I would like to see the Mets extend him to a reasonable 4-5 extra years at around $15-17M per year. Once Bay and Santana are gone this team has no more bloated veteran contracts, and we might as well keep our one good veteran player instead of overpaying for some FA. If Wright continues to strikeout a ton and plays embarrasing defense though, I think he might be traded next offseason after we pick up his option. As we saw this year even after a down year Wright still has value in other teams minds. I don’t think it makes sense to trade him in the middle of the season though because then Wright can void his option and he will be worth a lot less to other teams.

by crazycarLUXC on Jan 11, 2012 9:01 AM EST reply actions  

3B and 2B have the same positional adjustment.

His bat is just fine for 3B.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 11, 2012 4:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Fair enough

I guess to me it just seems like his bat would be more of an asset at 2B based on the Mets recent history with third and second basemen.

by crazycarLUXC on Jan 12, 2012 8:10 AM EST up reply actions  

Wright’s contract also lets him become a FA if his option is exercised and he’s traded.

by Steve from Norfolk on Jan 24, 2012 2:51 PM EST up reply actions  

9 Weeks' + Power Pitching

My theory is, the Mets should draft nothing but speed and power arms. Tailor the system to teach defense, OBP, durability and change ups.

Use Citi’s dimensions to inflate young arms to trade for more expensive, developed power hitters. Only keep pitching prospects as long as they project to be aces.

Supporting Assumption: All but top 10 pitchers and power hitters are neutralized by Citi Field. You can emulate the production for all but elite power hitters with high solid+ OBP guys with speed.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 6:31 AM EST reply actions  

I liked the idea of speed and defense

last year. New dimensions changes that view now. We’re going to need some mashers and GB pitchers.

by SFloridaMetsFan on Jan 13, 2012 10:56 AM EST up reply actions  

That was also the plan the Mariners wanted to stress these last couple of years

It really didn’t work out too well. Lots of variables, but…

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
Ryder or Riot #WWWYKI

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest | 1st place- 2012 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 13, 2012 12:54 PM EST up reply actions  

Dickey and Niese are huge groundball pitchers, as is Harvey

"Let them be stud muffins"
-Tom Seaver
Proud Mets, Jets, Knicks, Islanders fan.

by piazza62 on Jan 13, 2012 2:56 PM EST up reply actions  

Wright Trade

Wright for Kendrys Morales for John Hellweg and Dan Tillman

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 6:54 AM EST reply actions  

that's an awful trade

the Mets don’t need another 1B, and the other 2 pitchers are bullpen arms at best.

by secret defense on Jan 12, 2012 8:41 AM EST up reply actions  

Scouting Report

Morales – Plays a decent RF. Has a very strong arm.

Hellweg – Posted dominant stats as a starter. Failed as a reliever. Sits upper 90s.

Tillman – He’s a high upside reliever with a nasty slider.

If he’s healthy, Morales is a better hitter than Wright. This deal attempts to cash in on him getting healthy, while acquiring 2 high upside arms and shedding over $10 mil in salary. Fair enough if you’re not into it.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 9:21 AM EST up reply actions  

.

Morales – is not an outfielder, especially not one suited for Citifield, injury might further hamper range, plus he’s in the 2nd year of arbitration, so he isn’t cheap and under control for many years, and when both are healthy is not a better hitter than Wright relative to their positions.

Hellweg – those are nice numbers as a starter but it’s only 64 innings

by secret defense on Jan 12, 2012 1:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Value

If Hellweg posted those stats over 200 innings, he alone would cover most of Wright’s value in a trade.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 8:13 PM EST up reply actions  

But he didn't.

And that’s the point.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 12, 2012 8:39 PM EST up reply actions  

My point is....

….this is why we also get Morales, instead of a lesser player.

There isn’t much potential variance on what Hellweg and Tillman are. Any disagreement really hinges on what you think of Morales.

I’ve been a fan of Morales’ since he was a prospect and have followed him very closely. I think the guy is a stud and a rare power hitter that can sustain elite OPS in Citifield. I can understand others not being sold on him.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 8:46 PM EST up reply actions  

I'd guess that Morales doesn't have much value right now, though.

He hasn’t played baseball in a year and a half. That’d be a really risky acquisition, for a guy who’s not even a good fit defensively.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 12, 2012 9:24 PM EST up reply actions  

He's 28.....

….and OPS-ed 924 at 26 years old. Also, Wright doesn’t fit defensively neither. There’s more to being a major league caliber 3B than standing near 3B.

The history of position players returning from injuries like this while still young is quite good.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 9:29 PM EST up reply actions  

He was supposed to be back Opening Day 2011

and then ended up missing all of the season. That sounds really risky to me.

And while Wright has seen his defensive numbers drop the last few years, he still can stand at 3rd base and make most of the plays on the balls he gets too. I wouldn’t be comfortable with Morales playing right field, on a leg that has been injured for nearly two years now. Not in exchange for David Wright. It’s just a bad fit.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 13, 2012 2:55 PM EST up reply actions  

3 mil vs 15 mil

Don’t forget this. Not only do we make up for the risk in additional prospects, we make up for the difference in big bucks.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 9:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Morales is at his best

As good of a hitter as the 2010 version of Wright, which doesn’t compare to what I still think is the “real” Wright. I’d say Morales = Duda with the bat.

I wouldn’t know how to react if Wright gets traded for someone who would be the third 1st baseman on the team. And high upside relievers are still relievers.

"Let them be stud muffins"
-Tom Seaver
Proud Mets, Jets, Knicks, Islanders fan.

by piazza62 on Jan 12, 2012 2:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Fair enough.

I just think those arms are as good as we’re going to get if we’re getting a former top 5 (I think) MVP finisher in his prime. Players have returned from injuries like this before and reverted back to their peaks.

Regarding defense, Morales is at least as much a RF as Wright is a 3B. As much as I like Wright, I’ve never been a fan of is defense. His offense makes him worth it, as is the case with Morales. With this said, Morales hasn’t had as much opportunity to develop in RF as Wright has had at 3B, so I think there’s still a chance he can put his arm to good use. (His arm is overshadowed by his power, but it’s really good.)

Anyways, just a thought. I have high expectations for Morales, so this works for me, and I’d like to see the Mets gamble on guys like Hellweg. Tillman is 1 step towards overpaying relievers in the future. Understandable if you aren’t into it.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 7:50 PM EST up reply actions  

Meant to say....

1 step towards NOT overpaying for relievers in the future. (Papelbon for $50+ mil. Sean Marshall for an experienced young lefty SP and a solid MI prospect. Yikes.)

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 7:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Based on what Sickles has to say

I’d want guys who are less of unknowns than those guys.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 12, 2012 7:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Hellweg

He’s 23, 6-9, 210 lbs. After he became a starter, he did this: 2.12 ERA, 80/28 K/BB in 64 innings, 5.00 GO/AO

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 9:28 AM EST up reply actions  

But Morales is the centerpiece of that deal, and he's useless to the Mets.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 12, 2012 6:13 PM EST up reply actions  

Well

we can always move Ike to RF for Morales

by SFloridaMetsFan on Jan 13, 2012 10:58 AM EST up reply actions  

The Ultimate Warrior's name was Jim Helwig

Every time John Hellweg is mentioned, I think of the Ultimate Warrior on the mound, facepaint and tassels and everything. That would be awesome.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
Ryder or Riot #WWWYKI

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest | 1st place- 2012 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 12, 2012 8:09 PM EST up reply actions  

Ultimate Warrior

A gif of Jim Helwig in a Mets cap would be wonderful. (I don’t have the skills. sad face)

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 8:12 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't either, but this would have to be the starting point

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
Ryder or Riot #WWWYKI

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest | 1st place- 2012 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 12, 2012 8:21 PM EST up reply actions  

I said Jim Helwig....

….not Roger Clemens.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 12, 2012 8:24 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

To be honest, I think there are too many variables right now to say anything for certain

Regardless, of the money and ownership issues, and all of that: Pelfrey probably will be traded this season for something, so hopefully he has one of his good even year campaigns. I don’t think that Murphy or Duda have places on the team long term, either.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
Ryder or Riot #WWWYKI

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest | 1st place- 2012 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 12, 2012 12:32 PM EST reply actions  

Trade Pelf

He has one useful commodity and thats IP. We get the same amount of Dickey with a better ERA. Some team needs a guy on the mound to eat innings.

by Trambone on Jan 13, 2012 1:33 AM EST reply actions  

Yeah, the Mets do

considering Santana might only pitch a start or three before his arm falls off

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Jan 13, 2012 10:41 AM EST up reply actions  

why do the Mets need IP?

We aren’t planning on winning so far… by the halfway point he can be traded and use Schienden to eat up the innings.

by Trambone on Jan 13, 2012 10:37 PM EST up reply actions  

Because that sounds horrific and I actually intend to watch this season?

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Jan 13, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions  

We're very unlikely to get any real value for Santana.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 14, 2012 1:31 AM EST up reply actions  

He's talking about Pelf, I think

who might give us some value, I guess; still not sure I would want to trade him halfway through this year

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Jan 14, 2012 5:11 AM EST up reply actions  

Me neither, although he could bring a decent haul, if he gets off to a good start again.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 14, 2012 3:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Meh.

If he gets off to a good start and they could get a good prospect or two in return, I’d pull the trigger. He seems like he is what he is at this point and if some team is going to give you something of value, might as well capitalize on it.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 14, 2012 11:02 PM EST up reply actions  

We'd have to eat a ton of money to move him, I think.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 15, 2012 1:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Pelfrey?

Good or bad, he’s probably going to make anywhere between $4.5 million and $5.5 million (likely closer to the left of the number line than the right). Keep in mind that guys who profile similarly to him, in terms of perception and whatever else, are making $2 – $5 million dollars for the year. If he has a good Pelfrey season, that $4.5 million and $5.5 million that any team trading for him might have to pay (which would be prorated to some degree) doesn’t seem much of a hurdle.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
Ryder or Riot #WWWYKI

AA Gamethread Embiggening Record Holder- 458 posts (08/24/11)
3rd Place- 2011 AAOP Contest | 1st place- 2012 AAOP Contest

by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 15, 2012 10:19 AM EST up reply actions  

Sorry, conflating Santana and Pelfrey again.

Not sure how I keep confusing them.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 15, 2012 11:42 AM EST up reply actions  

Why do the Mets need IP?

Because even though they aren’t going to be very good, there are still 162 games on the schedule, last I checked.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 14, 2012 11:00 PM EST up reply actions  

Another Dickey?

If you can replicate Dickey, why stop at 2? Build 5 Dickeys and dump the entire staff.

Most arguments are really about context.

by SheaWasBettor21 on Jan 13, 2012 1:50 PM EST up reply actions  

The sole purpose of this comment

is to refute the notion that Ike Davis is a far superior hitter to Lucas Duda.

Because he by no means is.

by METSMETSMETS on Jan 13, 2012 6:03 PM EST reply actions  

Agreed

His defense is always going to take away from the fact that he has a truly special bat and was by far the best rookie hitter in baseball, at least aside from Lawrie who didn’t play much. I don’t see much regression coming from him considering he hit like Willie Harris before the break.

I think both will be awesome.

"Let them be stud muffins"
-Tom Seaver
Proud Mets, Jets, Knicks, Islanders fan.

by piazza62 on Jan 13, 2012 7:36 PM EST up reply actions  

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