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Mets Hire Turnaround Consultants, Put Bankruptcy On Table?

A source familiar with the situation has said that the Mets have hired CRG Partners — the turnaround consultants that handled the Rangers' bankruptcy sale — and that a team sale with or without bankruptcy is on the table. The Mets have confirmed the hiring, stating that they have "engaged CRG Partners to provide services in connection with financial reporting and budgeting processes."

Hiring turnaround consultants doesn't necessarily mean that the team is specifically preparing for bankruptcy and a sale — consultants like these are brought in to figure out how a struggling business can become profitable — but it further underscores the Mets' moribund financial situation. Also, a turnaround company typically gets only a modest fee if it comes in and merely makes recommendations; it has a considerable economic incentive to push for a huge sale when a sizable commission is in the offing.

Paired with the recent report that the Mets are dissolving their Gulf Coast League team in St. Lucie, and the lack of any big-ticket player acquisitions in the offseason, even a casual observer might reasonably conclude that the team is slimming down for a potential sale.

The ongoing financial morass for Mets ownership also looms large — their difficulty in finding minority investors suggests that their personal Madoff-related financial problems may have colored the perception of the team, its viability, and its availability. If Irving Picard, who represents the victims of the Bernie Madoff Ponzi scheme, gets the full $386 million he seeks from the Wilpons, they may be forced to sell the team in order to recover that money. If you're a prospective investor, why settle for a small piece of the pie when you can bide your time and scoop up the whole team later?

Mets fans would be understandably excited about the prospect of a bankruptcy situation considering how well the Rangers' situation panned out. However, bankruptcies have a lot of moving parts and the Devil, as they say, is in the details. Every bankruptcy sale has three parties: the ownership group that is in debt, the creditors, and the buyers. If this process is indeed in the Mets' future, it could be a long and difficult one with no shortage of delays and acrimony to come. William Snyder, the CRG consultant who led the Rangers' bankruptcy sale, made many enemies along the way — including new Rangers owner Chuck Greenberg, who said that he'd "met some duplicitous people in my life, but [Snyder] set a new standard." But part of the reason that the sale worked was because the bidding process upped the price and brought in more money for the team's creditors.

Plenty of billionaires will be interested in owning some or all of the Mets, particularly given the strength of their home market and the value and reputation of SNY, but there are still some key differences between their situation and that of the Rangers.

Star-divide

For one, there's the question of upside. When the Rangers were sold, the prospective buyers had an enormous carrot dangling in front of them: a potential television extension that was awaiting signature from the new owner. That extension, signed by the new group in 2010, was worth $3 billion over 20 years and helped fuel much of the reinvestment in the team. Some thought it signaled the end of the regional sports network, and the Mets' inability to count future bids for their TV rights as a team asset in today's situation seems to point in the same direction.

Maury Brown of the Biz of Baseball says that juxtaposing the Rangers' and the Mets' situations amounts to an "apples to oranges comparison." He pointed out that not only was there the prospect of a television deal with the Rangers, but that the team was also "horribly underutilized as the season ticket base was very small." This year the Rangers' attendance was up around 20%, their ALDS with the Rays was the second-most attended division series of all time, and World Series ticket prices hit astonishing highs. It seems the new ownership group has righted that ship. The Mets have similar upside overall, but their season ticket base may not have the same underutilization built in.

The particulars of the owners' situations are also very different. Former owner Tom Hicks's holding company for the Rangers was bankrupt, and it had a buyer in place. CRG Partners was called in to manage the turnaround, and on behalf of the creditors, they created the bidding process in order to push the asking price higher. Even though the same MLB-favored Greenberg-Ryan group that first had a deal in place eventually bought the team in the end, they wound up paying more after the bidding process than they would have otherwise.

Could the two situations become more comparable? There's still the potentially crippling Bernie Madoff clawback lawsuit hanging over the Wilpons' heads in New York, and despite Bud Selig's confidence in a positive resolution, its specter continues to negatively affect the team. In the past when the Mets needed money, the Wilpons could just inject cash of their own. That's no longer a realistic option, and if the Wilpons themselves go bankrupt this process will start to look a little more like the Rangers' sale.

The Mets did hire Steve Greenberg to assist in finding minority owners to help the team and the owners stay afloat, but that was back in January 2011. Subsequent dalliances with prospective owners like David Einhorn then suggested that the Wilpons are difficult to work with and don't want to sell anything close to a majority stake. Even extending the search to family members — and adding "perks" like exclusive events with Mr. Met — hasn't resulted in a workable solution for the Wilpons. They clearly don't have a buyer in place like the Rangers did.

But possibly hiring the 2010 Turnaround Consultants of the Year would signify a change of heart. They might be ready to listen to offers.

Perhaps things have become so dire that even the Wilpons can't see an elegant way out. The team has yet to repay last season's $25 million loan from Major League Baseball, and paired with a more recent $40 bridge loan, that outstanding debt still pales in comparison to the loans on the team and SNY that come to term over the next three years. Our own Dan Lewis did a great job outlining all of the particulars of the team's finances, but add it all up and the ledger shows a lot of debt — maybe even more than the $427 million reported before this season.

But it's not all doom and gloom for the Mets. This is a team in a large market with a new stadium and a regional sports network. If the Wilpons are really willing to sell the team, they'll be sure to have enthusiastic bidders lining up.

Comment 138 comments  |  13 recs  | 

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by Russ on Jan 5, 2012 9:04 PM EST up reply actions   2 recs

or better yet

finds out the guru is a multi-billionaire, then uses his Jedi powers to talk him into buying the team

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 9:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Or even better yet

Dickey talks the guru into giving him some of his billions of dollars, which Dickey then uses to buy the team himself.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 5, 2012 10:03 PM EST up reply actions  

RAmen!

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 10:06 PM EST up reply actions  

The New York Dickeys

Our new logo: A Dickeyface

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 11:10 PM EST up reply actions  

I'd like me some Dicknotoad please..

"Intelligence is not a genetic predisposition. Think stupid!!"

by Wright of passage on Jan 5, 2012 11:29 PM EST up reply actions  

Mascot.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 5, 2012 11:31 PM EST up reply actions  

ALL...REC...THE DICKNOTOAD...

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 11:56 PM EST up reply actions  

please do not mention

bankruptcy until it is a fact. don’t tease me until my dream comes true.

by TomCarvel on Jan 5, 2012 8:45 PM EST reply actions  

I hear you buddy

But source was adamant and even a little glimmer of hope is a little bit of goodness, no?

by Eno Sarris on Jan 5, 2012 8:51 PM EST up reply actions  

yes true

Sources have been adamant before, i just hopt this one is for real. Yes it was a nice bit of goodness. When I read it I almost thought my blood donation today might be worth more than saving a life; instead of being used as a store being built up for zombie Wilpon.

by TomCarvel on Jan 5, 2012 9:10 PM EST up reply actions  

Eno, you're the best.

Well, second best — after this news.

by Brian Mangan on Jan 5, 2012 8:57 PM EST reply actions  

Please make this happen

There is no hope.... there is no future....there is only BLUE WALLS.

The 2012 Mets: Fortune cookie says come back in 2015

by Syler on Jan 5, 2012 9:22 PM EST reply actions  

I'm not getting my hopes up

this means nothing in it of itself.

"I only wanted a few things out of life -- a wife, children, to play baseball and to hunt deer." - Turk Wendell

by Rey-O on Jan 5, 2012 9:23 PM EST reply actions  

here's something you can take away

there’s probably no minority investors lining up to help them if this is the case. so they’ll be forced out eventually.

by Eno Sarris on Jan 5, 2012 9:35 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Stop toying with me

"I only wanted a few things out of life -- a wife, children, to play baseball and to hunt deer." - Turk Wendell

by Rey-O on Jan 5, 2012 9:42 PM EST up reply actions  

.
there’s probably no minority investors lining up to help them

Save Jenrry Mejia!
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by Ogre39666 on Jan 5, 2012 9:48 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

If, say, a majority portion of the team was put on sale as early as the end of the season, how long might the whole process take?

I didn’t really follow the details of the Rangers or Dodgers situations (not that their situations are the same), nor am I a financial major or anything, but is this just a new phase in the long, drawn out process we’re in, or might it actually be the catalyst that changes things relatively sooner than later?

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 9:24 PM EST reply actions  

Didn't

The Rangers thing only take about a year? Hicks was in trouble during the year, they hired CRG near the end of the year, sale during offseason.

by Eno Sarris on Jan 5, 2012 9:35 PM EST up reply actions  

I have no clue: That's why I'm asking!

All I know is that, at some point, they were bankrupt, and then there was a period where there was uncertainty, and then Nolan Ryan’s group bought the team.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions  

There are a few instances of pro-francishes changing hands relatively quickly.

The Texas Rangers are one (I think the bidding step slowed it down somewhat) and the Buffalo Sabres and Atlanta Thrashers are two others.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 5, 2012 9:46 PM EST up reply actions  

Looks like the Rangers declared bankruptcy on May 24, 2010

and were sold at auction to Greenberg/Ryan on August 5, 2010. But they’d already been talking sale for a few months before that, too.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 5, 2012 9:53 PM EST up reply actions  

I don't know anything about anything

But I’d expect that the Wilpons would not say uncle until they were absolutely compelled to say uncle (if this is, in fact, a sort of saying uncle). So maybe they would want it done fairly quickly if it’s come to the point of having to be done? Also, there’s a buyer who’s already been approved by MLB.

On the other side, though, is the mess of what’s owed to the Madoff victim fund.

by SuperT on Jan 6, 2012 2:19 PM EST up reply actions  

Also, it looks like someone is holding a gun to Fred's head in that picture

I take that as a good omen.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 9:28 PM EST reply actions   2 recs

Please.

I’ll be keeping my fingers crossed.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 5, 2012 9:30 PM EST reply actions  

I lobby you make DJ Carrasco your personal man-servant

and then drop VP of Business Dave Howard down a well.

Chamption of the R.A. Dickey Face contest and "Cromulent Photoshopper Extraordinaire" of Amazin' Avenue!
You might know me as mistermet.

by Steve Schreiber on Jan 5, 2012 9:56 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

I'll put in a bid on Ricco

I could use a yes man to call my own.

"RBI’s does measure something – Wins."
-Bayonne Mets Fan on MMO

by Dandy Salderson on Jan 5, 2012 10:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Rick-O, not Reek-O

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 6:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Mark Einhorn?

Is he any relation to former Toronto Blue Jays pitcher David Eichhorn?

"He's definitely mixing it into his repertoire. That's French for 'repertoire' " - Keith Hernandez

by Catsmeat Potter-Pirbright on Jan 5, 2012 9:42 PM EST reply actions  

einhorn is finkle

__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Jan 5, 2012 9:45 PM EST up reply actions  

EINHORN IS A MAN?!!

"I got my pregnant wife (the Yankee fan) with me. Hoping my kid learns to kick her everytime the Mets score." -Schifftis-

by future on Jan 5, 2012 11:03 PM EST up reply actions  

OMG!!! EINHORN IS A MAN!!!

fake vomits brushes teeth with whole tube of toothpaste plungers face fake vomits again lights clothes on fire

"I reject your reality and substitute my own"
-Adam Savage

by blueandorange4life on Jan 5, 2012 11:14 PM EST up reply actions  

I had to go to youtube

And watch it right away.

"I got my pregnant wife (the Yankee fan) with me. Hoping my kid learns to kick her everytime the Mets score." -Schifftis-

by future on Jan 5, 2012 11:28 PM EST up reply actions  

He WOULD have been THE man

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 11:55 PM EST up reply actions  

Hmm. Interesting.

Certainly with Hicks and Gillet there was a slimming down of operations, down to selling the Rangers, limiting funds for Liverpool, etc.
This would correspond with the Wilpons dissolving of the GCL Mets, and the salary lowering.

AAARRRRRRRSSSSSHHHHHHHHAAAAAAVVVVVIIIIIIIIIIIINNNNNNNNNN!
Dream goal!

by Aidan Gibson on Jan 5, 2012 9:42 PM EST reply actions  

If there is a fast sale to a quality owner

I want a Mets parade on Broadway with a rally in front of City Hall.

__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Jan 5, 2012 9:48 PM EST reply actions  

as said before, the team for which to cheer....

is the Irving Picard legal team!

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 9:54 PM EST reply actions  

The team released a statement

That they are indeed working with CRG ‘on budgeting’ and that minority sale is going fine. I don’t believe those things can both be true. Turnaround consultants don’t come in to well-run, tight ship orgs. Something is going on here.

by Eno Sarris on Jan 5, 2012 10:14 PM EST reply actions   1 recs

the Wilpons

they sit on a throne of lies!

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 10:23 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Baseball is a game of thrones

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 5, 2012 11:11 PM EST up reply actions  

I hear that show is badass.

Proud supporter of a New York baseball team and a Boston football team. Yeah, deal with it!
"We don’t listen to the hype. I don’t think we ever have. We really take after our coach and he says ‘When you win, say little. When you lose, say less.'"--Tom Brady
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by R_Adragna on Jan 6, 2012 12:46 AM EST up reply actions  

I watched 4 episodes

And wanted to be captivated, but I was not.

by SuperT on Jan 6, 2012 2:22 PM EST up reply actions  

Which 4 episodes?

The beginning was good, the middle was meh, but the end was awesome.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 6, 2012 4:24 PM EST up reply actions  

Correction

The beginning was amazing, the middle was enthralling and the end was epic.

by Evan_S on Jan 6, 2012 8:23 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

Correction is correct

I’ve watched the first season 3 times now. Incredible.

by Joamiq on Jan 6, 2012 10:35 PM EST up reply actions  

What didn't you like about the middle part?

It slowed down a bit but I don’t think it ever became boring. You have to do some setup stuff at some point and I thought the characters were interesting enough to carry it along well.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 9:06 PM EST up reply actions  

I still watched it.

I just felt it wasn’t as entertaining as the beginning or end comparatively speaking.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
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by Ogre39666 on Jan 6, 2012 10:36 PM EST up reply actions  

It has quite a bit of exposition

But they do a great job with it. The cast is top notch.

by Joamiq on Jan 6, 2012 10:43 PM EST up reply actions  

It was pretty good

Overall, I think that the general lack of any type of good live action fantasy shows make the ones that are decent look that much better.

Same with literature. Generally, fantasy is a lot of schlock. Average books, like Game of Thrones, or Sword of Shenarra, look better as a result.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 1:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Interesting theory but my wife, 2 siblings and a couple other normal people i know

love Game of Thrones. I’m a geek and full of bias but I go off of them that it’s an actual good show.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 3:13 PM EST up reply actions  

I am a nerd, have read the books/watched the show, etc.

A Song of Fire and Ice is a decent series, a step up or three from the generic schlock that you’ll find in the fantasy aisles, but I find it really overrated- it’s Gorge Martin’s homebrew D&D campaign world, complete with stereotypical geek tropes- an intense fascination/detail to developing language, exaggerated sexuality written in detail. It certainly is no Tolkien, but it realistically isn’t better orthan worse than homebrewthan worlds I, myself, have detailed, or ones people I know/know of have.

The TV show, it had a good budget, and with that, you’ll have a good show.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 6:14 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I disagree

Martin is a phenomenal writer. He’s not Tolkein, but he’s damn close. And for the most part, the series isn’t really that much fantasy. Most of it is grounded in reality, especially the first series, with the exception of two undead characters and a few mythical beasts, it’s basically a middle ages drama.

by Evan_S on Jan 6, 2012 8:26 PM EST up reply actions  

I'm not a big fantasy person, not that I have anything against it

but I don’t find GoT to be very “fantasy”. To me it’s a show about power struggles and how they affect all the people caught in their sway.

by Joamiq on Jan 6, 2012 10:38 PM EST up reply actions  

Completely disagree

As a writer, he’s nothing to write home about, but it’s not like he’s a 5th grader either. The writing itself is what it is, just there- not hurting or helping. The content of the first book especially, and three and four if I am remembering the order correctly, is chalk full of all the thinks we scoff at in bad fanfiction.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 7, 2012 2:10 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

I haven't read any of his fiction (yes)

but I love the few Martin essays I’ve read. Seems like a very intelligent and interesting dude.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

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by Terry_is_God on Jan 7, 2012 3:41 PM EST up reply actions  

* (yet)

some day there will be an edit feature on this site.
it will be glorious.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Jan 7, 2012 3:44 PM EST up reply actions  

Also, good budget, good TV show?

That’s ridiculous. The show is as perfect a recreation of the book as can be, so while a big budget is necessary, the source material was there to begin with. My guess is Heroes had a pretty big budget, how did that turn out?

by Evan_S on Jan 6, 2012 8:33 PM EST up reply actions  

Sci Fi might be even harder to pull off than Fantasy.

All the network Sci Fi shows were terrible unless you count Lost which was great until it became Sci Fantasy.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 9:07 PM EST up reply actions  

Battlestar was great

And Fringe is wonderful when they stick to the story. The procedural nature really kills the flow, but when it’s focused it’s really amazing. The saving grace in the useless episodes where it’s juts like a sci-fi cop show, is that John Noble is perfect as the crazy genius scientist. I love that Dinklage won the best supporting acting Emmy, but Noble, who wasn’t even nominated, puts on as good a performance week in week out this side of Cranston.

by Evan_S on Jan 6, 2012 11:32 PM EST up reply actions  

Really?

Some of the best episodes came at the end of the series. The only part of the series I was meh about was the first half of season two, before Pegasus. Everything else I really loved. Even the finale I enjoyed. It wasn’t the epic conclusion we all wanted, but when a show starts and in the first 20 minutes, nearly 10 billion people are wiped out, any ending is going to be a letdown.

by Evan_S on Jan 7, 2012 6:54 AM EST up reply actions  

I think the bad explanations of everything towards the

end soured people on what was a pretty good 4th season. But all the ghost Starbuck, crappy Opera House payoff, Baltar in general, etc.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 7, 2012 7:58 PM EST up reply actions  

I guess, but there were some fantastic moments in season four.

If i remember correctly, The Oath and Blood on the Scales were two of my favorite episodes of the show. Truly outstanding. The ending was okay. It wasn’t great but I really can’t think of another way to end it where everyone would be satisfied.

by Evan_S on Jan 7, 2012 8:08 PM EST up reply actions  

Hell, Noble often puts on 2 amazing performances.

Yeah, can’t believe I forgot about Fringe. Now that’s a show that really got it together – the jump in quality from S1 to S2 is incredible.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 7, 2012 2:05 AM EST up reply actions  

True, Heroes had a big budget,

but the writing staff had no long-term plan. I do have to say that SciFi has done a nice job with Alphas, and if you had ever told me that SciFi would be the first network get superhero shows right, I would have laughed at you.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 6, 2012 9:52 PM EST up reply actions  

Alphas is good.

And Being Human is good considering the subject matter has become overplayed.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 6, 2012 10:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I saw the first couple episodes of the UK and thought it was

just okay. It fell into that semi serious Buffy, Angel, Charmed area that I don’t care for. How’s the US version?

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 11:06 PM EST up reply actions  

I would say it's a pretty serious take but their are humerus moments.

I didn’t watch any of the shows you mentioned so I don’t can’t compare it but I enjoy it. It’s kind of hard to explain in words how they portray the characters; like they just want to be normal – not sure if that’s different from the UK version. I think the cast is good so that probably helps overall.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 7, 2012 2:26 AM EST up reply actions  

Out of curiousity,

have you seen the BBC version? My friends who have say they couldn’t watch the American one.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 7, 2012 2:06 AM EST up reply actions  

I didn't know it existed until you and Franco mentioned it.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 7, 2012 2:28 AM EST up reply actions  

It's a mostly light hearted show that becomes dead serious

for moments here and there. I just didn’t like the actors enough I guess to enjoy the tonal shifts.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 7, 2012 8:00 PM EST up reply actions  

The US version is the exact opposite then.

Serious with a lighter moments here and there.

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by Ogre39666 on Jan 7, 2012 8:57 PM EST up reply actions  

Never watched Heroes

Had a huge following and great ratings, as I remember.

Look at the Lord of the Rings. Make a low budget, crappy movie, and no matter how good the story is, it bombed. Give it a decent budget, or an over the top budget, and it’s winning record-breaking amounts of awards. Same exact story, two very different reactions regarding the movies.

If HBO didn’t have the budget to produce what they did, and it was a series with the acting, bad costuming, poor specialon effects, and so on that categorizes low-budget Scify Channel movies, it’d have a much different reception among critical viewership.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 7, 2012 2:18 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Heroes had great ratings early on,

but fans jumped ship pretty quickly. I think the ratings started to dive in Season 2. The writing was so terrible, it’s one of only 2 shows I’ve sworn off.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 7, 2012 7:37 PM EST up reply actions  

I really don't get your point other than the obvious more money means better effects.

Of course to do Lord of the Rings or A Song of Ice and Fire right, you need a big budget. But the budget itself is not why they are great, it’s just necessary to tell the story properly since places like Rivendell and Winterfell, dragons, orcs, etc. Don’t actually exist and to portray them realistically costs a lot of money. If you’re gonna bring movies into it, there are probably 10 times more big budget movies that suck (Every Michael Bay movie for example) than ones that are great.

I mean really, how many actions scenes has Game of Thrones had up to this point. The big battle wasn’t even shown. The money seems to be going to the sets and wardrobe mostly. It’s not like people are watching the show is awe of effects. It’s basically a Wire-esque storyline in a medieval fantasy-ish setting.

I’m really curious about what specifically you dislike about the show/books. The two things I’ve heard, relating to the books are that he kills off too many main characters which makes perfect sense seeing that these people are in a gigantic war, and the second being that Feast didn’t have their favorite characters in it, which again when you have 40 main characters it’s hard to fit all of them in one book.

by Evan_S on Jan 7, 2012 8:04 PM EST up reply actions  

That is my point

A smaller budget results in a product with a lesser cast, worse costumes, worse special effects, less actual airtime/episodes, all the technical camera/crew stuff, and a lot fewer people raving about it- the fate of many a fantasy concept/series on par with Martin’s stuff.

As books, I find the series to generally be slighly above average. The TV series, above average to good.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 7, 2012 10:57 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

As I brought up with the two different Lord of the Rings movies

That’s not the case.

Dress anything up enough, and it can be passable. Go full retard, and even something awesome can be crappy.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 8, 2012 10:02 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Also

Since from your comments, I’m assuming you’ve read a decent amount of fantasy novels. I’ve always loved fantasy, but everything was always a disappointment compared to Lord of the Rings, so even though I was excited for the series, I read a lot of reviews before finally delving into A Song of Ice and Fire. I’d love to get my hands on some other top notch fantasy stories worth my time.

by Evan_S on Jan 7, 2012 11:19 PM EST up reply actions  

I think this applies to all entertainment really

Just look at awards shows like the Oscars. When 90% of everything is crap, the best of the passable remainder is lauded as excellent, when truly excellent material is actually very rare.

"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "

– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf

by Terry_is_God on Jan 6, 2012 4:59 PM EST up reply actions  

Probably

Music is a good analogy.

With fantasy books, 95% of the stuff on the shelves is dreck. With converting fantasy into live action, it’s even worse. I mean, there’s Lord of the Rings…and that’s pretty much it.

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 6:17 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

What? Are you saying stuff like Willow, Dragonslayer, Conan,

Sword and Sorcerer, Krull, Flesh and Blood, Labyrinth, Legend, Ladyhawke or Red Sonja weren’t good?

Actually I still like Flesh and Blood for being really twisted.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 6:30 PM EST up reply actions  

Ah, Willow

Best thing I can say about Willow was that it’s a movie…

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 6:40 PM EST via mobile up reply actions  

Possible that it is just debt restructuring

But more likely, Saul Katz is making Fred take Jeff’s toy away.

"RBI’s does measure something – Wins."
-Bayonne Mets Fan on MMO

by Dandy Salderson on Jan 5, 2012 10:36 PM EST up reply actions  

SELL THE TEAM!

(robble robble robble)

ESPN, Mike Francesa, NY Post, NY Daily News, Fox Sports = Propaganda

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by BlueChill on Jan 5, 2012 10:23 PM EST reply actions  

wilpons say

Dey took r jerbs!!!!!!!

I hate Philadelphia so much.

by the caveman on Jan 6, 2012 9:28 AM EST via Android app up reply actions  

Will Alderson

keep his job? The guy has a plan and vision for the team and its kinda hard to execute it with 2 twigs and some gum.

by Trambone on Jan 5, 2012 10:34 PM EST reply actions  

If a new owner comes in, I think Alderson has enough of a good rep to be kept on the job

ESPN, Mike Francesa, NY Post, NY Daily News, Fox Sports = Propaganda

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by BlueChill on Jan 5, 2012 10:35 PM EST up reply actions  

This.

Alderson is too widely respected for a semi-intelligent new owner to fire just to put his stamp on the franchise.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 5, 2012 11:36 PM EST up reply actions  

I'd say Alderson

is actually one of the assets being sold, not a liability.

by Kepler on Jan 6, 2012 1:37 PM EST up reply actions  

in most cases

new ownership wants to have “their” team in place. Best case scenario is that the new owners know Sandy and, most of all, that he trusts them

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 10:36 PM EST up reply actions  

Or maybe Selig pushes for him to stay on as GM.

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 5, 2012 11:01 PM EST up reply actions  

Though the new owner should fire

the entire medical staff….. Dr. Nick, Ray Ramirez, and Dr. Zoidberg….. ugh

by Trambone on Jan 5, 2012 11:22 PM EST up reply actions  

I doubt Alderson wants to be around for the long haul

I always assumed he was there for credibility reasons and he was just grooming D3PO from the job in 3-4 years.

by FrancoTAU on Jan 6, 2012 12:35 AM EST up reply actions  

Beginning of the end?

I lobby for a short sale.

by MetsFan4Decades on Jan 5, 2012 10:35 PM EST via mobile reply actions  

can't help but wonder

if Nelson Doubleday is still alive, or has a successor to buy the team.

Hoping the Wilpons become the Will-pawns

by exbrooklynite on Jan 5, 2012 10:39 PM EST reply actions  

Last I knew he was alive, but didn't have the money.

I suppose he could put together a team of investors, but he’s been down that road before.

by Curtis3331 on Jan 7, 2012 1:32 AM EST up reply actions  

Yep

AA is all growns up

"RBI’s does measure something – Wins."
-Bayonne Mets Fan on MMO

by Dandy Salderson on Jan 5, 2012 11:03 PM EST up reply actions  

If the Wilpons sell their stake in SNY

You can bet Comcast and Time Warner will exercise their rights to buy the Wilpons’ stake outright. Which seriously weakens the Mets and the amount SNY can contribute to the fortunes of the team.

by chakrabs on Jan 5, 2012 11:09 PM EST reply actions  

??

The new owners won’t have the rights to buy it?

by Trambone on Jan 5, 2012 11:23 PM EST up reply actions  

Comcast and TWC have right of first refusal to buy the Wilpons' stake in SNY.

And since Comcast just bought NBC and is starting up its own sports channel, buying a bigger share of SNY would be a nice easy way for them to get their foot in the door in the NY market, where they currently don’t have a presence (sports-wise).

"And that's why anybody who invested with Lenny Dykstra should really call that number. Lawyers are standing by."

by BobbyV_Incognito on Jan 6, 2012 1:43 AM EST up reply actions  

yeah, this

I don’t understand how transfer of ownership works with SNY. Are there things that can be done / might be done that can cripple the team in the future?

Have the Wilpons already smashed the china so to speak?

by dirtycrumbs on Jan 6, 2012 12:19 AM EST via mobile up reply actions  

If the team can't generate

through a TV station in 20 years we’ll be the A’s with payroll

by Trambone on Jan 6, 2012 12:40 AM EST up reply actions  

New ownership can threaten to move the Mets off of SNY when the contract expires

SNY without the Mets is worthless.

__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Jan 6, 2012 7:03 AM EST up reply actions  

Yeah thats pretty much it

I recently read an article, I think by Howard Megdal, that pointed out the horrifying possibility of the Dolans buying the Mets. Although they’d be equally awful owners as the Wilpons, they’d be able to offer the Mets a ton of revenue through the MSG Network.

by chakrabs on Jan 6, 2012 9:04 AM EST up reply actions  

Dolan as owner

Thats just horrifying

ESPN, Mike Francesa, NY Post, NY Daily News, Fox Sports = Propaganda

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by BlueChill on Jan 6, 2012 10:26 AM EST up reply actions  

SNY when Mets games are not being broadcast is worthless

"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.

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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Jan 6, 2012 1:39 PM EST up reply actions  

I watch Mets Classics

The rest is a steaming pile. I would rather watch Yankeeography than Loud Mouths, and I would rather be burned alive than watch Yankeeography.

"Let them be stud muffins"
-Tom Seaver
Proud Mets, Jets, Knicks, Islanders fan.

by piazza62 on Jan 8, 2012 2:44 PM EST up reply actions  

so basically.........

pizza

One day, this team is going to kill me.

by fxcarden on Jan 8, 2012 5:09 PM EST up reply actions   1 recs

The Mets, the Eastman Kodak of baseball

And Jason Bay is about as dated as a roll of 35mm film.

Of course, this can’t be anything but good news if it’s the first step towards selling the team to a less incompetent ownership group.

Mark Cuban for owner! Save us from the Wilpons!

by Greenpoint Ian on Jan 5, 2012 11:43 PM EST reply actions  

That picture of the Wilpons reminds me of a Mandrill and a bonobo

but i think both primates may be smarter than the Wilpons.

__________________________________________________________________
Really good kid.A very good player.Not a superstar. #BlameWilponz. Never Forget

by ScottfromPeekskill on Jan 6, 2012 1:11 AM EST reply actions  

I Doubt This Works Out Well For the Mets

The issue is debt. That’s where the revenues are going, and why there is no money for players.

The more the Mets sell for, the more debt the new owner will have as well.

Moreover, if the stadium and SNY are sold separately, the Mets could be subject to huge rent increases from the former and lose the revenues from the latter. Of course both Citifield and SNY need the Mets, too.

Just remember; what the Wilpons have done with the Mets the City of New York has done, the State of New York has done, the MTA has done, the federal government has done — mortgaged the future to benefit the past. At least the Wilpons did it to themselves, and will leave behind a building. What an era!

by WT Economist on Jan 6, 2012 7:32 AM EST reply actions  

It probably means less debt for the Mets

The Mets are currently in violation of MLB’s debt rules. Any new ownership group will likely be required to be compliant when they purchase the Mets.

__________________________________________________
"He who gets the best players usually wins" - Bobby Bowden

by Russ on Jan 6, 2012 10:20 AM EST up reply actions  

Does hosting an All Star game in 2 years work as an incentive?

The MetsCast: Dedicated to the New York Mets and the community of fans that supports them.

by Donal on Jan 6, 2012 10:23 AM EST reply actions  

That's not official.

But I would imagine if a new ownership group came in with the promise of spending and turning the franchise around that league would be more likely to let Citi host.

Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place

by Ogre39666 on Jan 6, 2012 4:28 PM EST up reply actions  

Either something is up or further proof of incompetence

Unless they’re still blind to the fallout from hiring a group like CRG, they had to know that news of it will negatively impact their ability to sell minority shares. If they really were just weeks away from having minority share sales wrapped up it would make sense to wait those few weeks before engaging CRG.

So either their blind to the negative impact of engaging CRG, the sales are not going anywhere near as well as they’d have us believe or the cash crisis is so severe that they just couldn’t wait to bring in CRG. And if it’s the first, it could well contribute to the 2nd becoming more likely.

by cpins on Jan 6, 2012 10:44 AM EST reply actions  

Why would anyone invest 20 million in the Mets with this news?

Having this go public right when the team is trying to recruit or finalize deals with minority investors is REALLY BAD news for the current owners. It’s analogous with negative news coming out about a company in the stock market. Investers SELL their investments when news like this come out. Just look at Kodak’s stock price after the most recent news that came up recently. The end is much closer for the Wilpons and Katz’s then anyone is letting on. I predict new owners by the end of the 2012 season.

by DeepMetsThoughts on Jan 6, 2012 10:52 AM EST reply actions  

I know I'm late

but cromulent work breaking this story, Eno. Awesome job.

WRITTEN IN THE STAAAAARS, A MILLION MILES AWAAAAAAY

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by Thomas Wachtel on Jan 6, 2012 1:51 PM EST reply actions  

that thing behind Fred's head

looked like the barrel of a gun

One day, this team is going to kill me.

by fxcarden on Jan 6, 2012 6:42 PM EST reply actions  

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