Am I crazy?..
Or do the mets have a legitimate chance of being a solid ball-club this year? Say what you want about the division, but that's not what I am talking about. I am talking about the mets and the squad they will be running out there in the coming months. I could be overly optimistic but I gotta feelin' (blackeye pea's music drops).
1.torres/Tejada 2. Murphy 3. D Wright 4. IKE 5. Duda 6. Bay 7. torres/tejada 8. thole 9. Pitcher
Any what do we have a deep bullpen now? Three closerish types rauch, parnell, and franky. Set up with beato,ramirez and byrdak. SOLID bullpen.
Starting staff has more questions than answers but could have a few surprises in store for 2012. Could Santana be back to Santana? Can Dickey keep it going? Is Niese able to become they guy that he shows in flashes? GEE get off to a start like he did last year? Pelfry not be a total trainwreck?
Am I crazy? Could this be a surprising year for the mets? Or is this just the reoccurring tradition that happens in every spring?
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They are going to win the WS!
2012 New York Mets, World Series Champions!
You're not (completely) crazy, but...
This team could surprise and chase a wild card spot. It could happen.
They could also surprise us with injuries and/or down years for multiple key positions. Nothing between 60 and 90 wins would really surprise me with this team. Too many variables.
Ike, Wright, and Duda are poised for solid years by all accounts with Ike maybe outperforming everyone in the group.
This is true, but Ike is no sure thing right now, Duda could flounder so much defensively that he would neutralize his own offense, and while Wright seems to be due for a good season with his health back and the walls in, you can’t count on that to pan out either.
Our starting pitching is the main reason your optimism might be a little on the crazy side.
If Pelfrey’s knack for being pretty good on even-numbered years continues, that would be awesome, but he’s just as likely to post an ERA around 5. Gee’s a likable guy who will flat out suck unless he somehow improves his control significantly. Will Santana give you 100+ pretty good innings, or will he never even make an appearance? We don’t know, and if we can’t milk enough starts out of him I dread the pummeling that will ultimately befall Chris Schwinden and whatever other AAAA crud is trotted out. I am relatively high on Niese and I think he will continue to improve, but what if he doesn’t? (Dickey, however, will throw like 25 perfect games, so no worries there.)
The bullpen LOOKS solid on paper and I am half expecting them to be very effective, but in reality it’s going to be a crapshoot. Rauch in particular I am not dying to see in action. Also, Parnell is “closerish”? No, just no.
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "
– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf
Solid-(adj) of definite shape or volume; not liquid or gaseous.
but in normal everyday sports people talk it means good not great.
And most people would accompany that with a wins total.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place
this team probably won't be painful to watch, except maybe the starting rotation outside of Dickey
but it would take an awful lot of things going right for us (and wrong for the Braves and Phillies) to make a run at the playoffs.
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Feb 15, 2012 6:12 PM EST reply actions
Niese isn't painful to watch, hopefully Santana won't be either
I think Niese can be a pretty damn good pitcher this season. Justin Masterson had a very good breakout season for Cleveland, accompanied with a 22-point dip in BABIP, and his peripherals were similar to Niese’s (with slightly less K’s, and a lower HR/FB). He had a 4.9 fWAR season (4.1 bWAR), I’d say that’s a reasonable expectation for Jon.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand."
-Wes Westrum
"I'm a huge advocate of pitching"
-Tom Seaver
I'd love to see Niese put up a 4+ fWAR
but so far he hasn’t come close to that. Not to say that he can’t but I have tempered expectations for him. I have him pegged for a solid middle of the rotation option, but he’ll have to prove to me he’s more than that.
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Feb 15, 2012 8:53 PM EST up reply actions
That's because he was shut down early last year with injury
His FIP, xFIP, and SIERA all have him pegged for an ERA south of the mid-3’s. Do I think he’ll be an ace lefty? No, but I have no reason to be pessimistic on him right now.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand."
-Wes Westrum
"I'm a huge advocate of pitching"
-Tom Seaver
an olay-off sounds very festive somehow
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Feb 15, 2012 8:51 PM EST up reply actions
that makes all of us
Hey, wait! I'm having one of those things. You know? A headache with pictures?
by KeithsMoustache on Feb 16, 2012 1:43 AM EST up reply actions
not in my place of work.....
where every other week, the news is…………. " o layoffs "
One day, this team is going to kill me.
Yes
One day, this team is going to kill me.
by fxcarden on Feb 15, 2012 7:56 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Crazy are the people thinking the team will struggle to win 70 games
The team isn’t that great, no doubt, but for everything that happened this off-season, not much of a case can be made that it lost around 10 wins worth of talent, factoring in improvements that were made.
"Blinding ignorance does mislead us. O! Wretched mortals, open your eyes!" Gil Hodges IS a Hall of Famer.
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by Brooklyn Dodgers Mets Fan on Feb 15, 2012 8:32 PM EST reply actions
I think their argument is that the division got better which is going to make those 36 games
vs the Marlins and Nats a little tougher even if the talent didn’t drop off more than a couple WAR with Tejada for Reyes.
3 game series against each team at a time, that's SSS
You can just as easily say that with the new dimensions, the Mets will surely be over 500 because they had a winning record on the road, or that the Mets will collectively win more games against National League Central teams due to those subtracts, etc.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand."
-Wes Westrum
"I'm a huge advocate of pitching"
-Tom Seaver
Fact
Fact is the Mets have been extremely unlucky with injuries to key players over the last 3 seasons. At the same time – except for Reyes in the 1st half of 2011 – there really haven´t been any “career type” seasons produced by anyone where you´d expect a significant natural regression.
Of course, this trend may continue. Santana is weak and he throws less than 50 IP, Niese or Dickey blows out his elbow and is gone for the year so Chris Schwinden and Miguel Batista become fulltime rotation members, Ike Davis´ ankle issues recurr and he has two lengthy DL stints, Daniel Murphy shows early he´s absolutely unable to play 2b so Justin Turner has to take over there for good, Lucas Duda breaks his leg falling in the outfield and Scott Hairston takes over, Ruben Tejada breaks his arm on a collision at 2b and Ronny Cedeno becomes the SS – and voila, the Mets indeed may struggle to win 70 games. Unfortunately, bad luck like this is expected by Mets fans.
Just like a heavy attrition rate for top flight pitching prospects is already expected as well – ever since “Generation K” basically flopped (not counting Izzy´s later success), Grant Roberts´ elbow didn´t hold up, Phil Humber blew out his too and Mike Pelfrey merely became Mike Pelfrey and not Roy Halladay. While things like that happen, it´s not automatic. Sometimes a trio of high-end pitching prospects becomes Tim Hudson – Mark Mulder – Barry Zito or Tim Lincecum – Matt Cain – Madison Bumgarner or at the very least Josh Johnson – Ricky Nolasco – Anibal Sanchez and things suddenly look a lot better. Sure, odds are that of Harvey – Wheeler – Familia – Mejia, only one becomes a quality SP and maybe more a # 2/3 instead of a front-end type and another one a solid RP while two others never have a meaningful career while struggling through various surgeries. However, sometimes things go right and all of a sudden you may get two quality frontline SP and a shutdown closer from such a group and even get some value back while trading the 4th of them. Is it likely ? No. But it has certainly happened in the past.
All in all, if the Mets core players like Wright – Tejada – Davis – Duda – Murphy – Niese – Dickey manage to avoid the DL except for maybe a couple of normal 15-day stints and Santana is able to make 25+ starts and throw 150+ innings, then this team has a very realistic chance to play .500 or better Baseball.
While the NL East improved, there is no ueber-team in this division either.
The Marlins won 70 games in 2011 and while they improved, it seems like a very volatile group of players that could easily implode and turn into a cast of missfits.
The Phillies average age is now well into the 30s and their offense is a Chase Utley injury away from totally collapsing. And while they do have “3 aces”, what if one of them finally suffers a serious injury ?
The Braves have strong pitching but their offense isn´t all that exciting with a hole at SS, brittle Chipper Jones at 3b only good against the Mets and really all hopes resting on Jayson Heyward breaking out in a big way.
The Nationals have some highly promising young talent too and could have the makings of a strong rotation if everyone stays healthy. They have a bunch of offensive and defensive question marks too though and are no guarantee for 85+ wins either.
All in all, the 2012 Mets should win somewhere between 70 and 85 games. If you´re a pessimist and expect things to go generally go wrong, then 70 wins is probably closer to reality. If the core players finally stay healthy and a couple of young players like Niese and Davis take a step forward, this could easily be a .500+ win team, maybe more if there are a few career years in between or Bay surprisingly bounces back, Santana pitches like Pedro Martinez of 2005/2006 and starts 30 games and someone like Jeurys Familia emerges by the 2nd half as either a strong surprising SP or shutdown reliever.
So, to answer your question: No, you are not crazy. You are merely taking the optimistic approach that generally hasn´t gone all that well for Mets fans over the past few years.
by Doob on Feb 16, 2012 1:08 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
slim just left town
The main problem I think the 2012 Mets will have is a lack of depth. On paper, they could be a 90+ win team IF Wright, Davis, Murphy and Bay all return to form, if Torres shows that 2010 wasn’t a total fluke, if Thole and Tejada can be everyday players for the first time in their careers and IF Santana’s arm doesn’t fall off, Niese makes the leap and Franky leads a revamped bullpen. As each one of those things falls a little short, 90+ starts to creep ever-closer to 70 because there is no legit plan B for any of them.
Mets are snakebitten I tell ya!
You just don’t know what is going to happen but this much is clear… they may have injuries and they won’t trade to cover for those injuries. They may get off to a decent start but they still won’t fortify the team around the all star break to make a run.
Mets have a fair enough order, but that pitching staff is a mess. Pray for 75 wins.
Or don’t pray; you could sacrifice a lamb or sue a church for all I care. Your O/U is 75.
DRaysBay: Home of garbage-level analysis and circle-jerking writers.
under
by probably at least 5 wins
FREE GUYER!
by SandalsNoPants on Feb 18, 2012 2:30 PM EST up reply actions
Oho, these two Rays fans don't like our team
I get where you’re coming from, but so help me god, I will use everything in my power to condemn Matt Moore to a career of Jason Isringhausen-dom.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand."
-Wes Westrum
"I'm a huge advocate of pitching"
-Tom Seaver
Nah, I want to see Moore dominate the Yankees for the next 10 years.
Save Jenrry Mejia!
2012 Amazin' Avenue Offseason Plan: 2nd place
Dylan Bundy's my guy
At least O’s fans are empathetic.
"Baseball is like church. Many attend, but few understand."
-Wes Westrum
"I'm a huge advocate of pitching"
-Tom Seaver
The O's shouldn't be allowed to draft promising pitchers anymore.
They’ll ruin him the way they ruined the last batch.
Man, I’m negative today.
FREE GUYER!
by SandalsNoPants on Feb 18, 2012 6:26 PM EST up reply actions
I'm also a Mets fan
The team stinks. STINKS!
It’s like rooting for the Knicks a few years back.
FREE GUYER!
by SandalsNoPants on Feb 18, 2012 6:25 PM EST up reply actions
Same; Mets are my NL team. They're just not very good.
DRaysBay: Home of garbage-level analysis and circle-jerking writers.
Also, to try to curse Moore is folly; that 'failed starter turned to a capable reliever' spot is reserved for Wade Davis.
DRaysBay: Home of garbage-level analysis and circle-jerking writers.
So much mixing between these fandoms, isn't there?
Florida – NY cross pollination I guess? I’ve always dug the Rays too. But watch your tone guys, what goes around comes around… haha. :’(
"I dunno. I never smoked any Astroturf. "
– Tug McGraw when asked about his preference for grass or astroturf
by Terry_is_God on Feb 20, 2012 4:35 PM EST up reply actions

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