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Milledge on the Move?

Aa_avatar_tiny by Eric Simon on in Rumor Mill

WFAN is reporting that the Mets have traded Lastings Milledge to the Nationals for Brian Schneider and Ryan Church. This is a rumor right now; more as it unfolds.

UPDATE: Newsday is reporting it now.

UPDATE: Church and Milledge are very similar hitters right now, though Church is six years older and will cost more. The Mets essentially traded the age and payroll flexibility difference between Milledge and Church to get Schneider. Questionable to say the least.

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Huh???
That's all they got for Milledge?  Doesn't sound like a good trade to me.

I liked Milledge and I am not sold on Carlos Gomez although I guess I had better get used to him.

by millsy on Nov 30, 2007 1:38 PM EST   0 recs

Retarded
Is the only way to describe this trade. Retarded.

Like you said Eric, we replace Milledge with Church. Lastings is cheaper, younger and has a lot more upside.

Schneider is slightly worse or the same as Estrada and much, much worse than Lo Duca, who I don't even like but now looks like Piazza in comparison.

This is terrible. We have been getting progressively worse since the Nady trade.

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 1:40 PM EST   0 recs

bizarre, to say the least
I'm not sure what the purpose of this trade was.  Yes, Church is good, but what on earth do the Mets need Schneider for?  Furthermore, if Milledge was going to move, I would have hoped it would be to Minnesota/Baltimore/Oakland for Santana/Bedard/Haren.  Now the Mets no longer have arguably their most valuable trading chip in the pursuit of an ace.
Let's Go Meters in New York!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on Nov 30, 2007 1:44 PM EST   0 recs

Wilpon
BTW, if this was Freddie's way of getting rid of a "clubhouse cancer", he deserves to have his team eat Atlanta's dust for the next decade.

Congratulations, Fred, you let the fucking New York Post run your team for you.

Let's Go Meters in New York!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on Nov 30, 2007 1:53 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

yep.
I have to say, considering the way the Mets have mistreated Milledge, that I am almost eager to see him kick the shit out of them for the next ten years.  This is a bad deal from any perspective: it didn't need to be made, it brought back little in return for a key young player, and it seems to have been driven by media nonsense rather than on-field needs.

by anonymous on Nov 30, 2007 5:13 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

I don't think it's THAT bad...
Schneider is a LH hitting catcher who is stronger defensively than Estrada and LoDuca.  The catching market overall stinks, never mind those are available.  He makes a nice platoon partner for Castro IMO.  

Church had a nice year last year, although his numbers would be much stronger in CF...

Which leads me to believe he isn't long for NY.  Isn't it possible that another team liked Church better than Milledge?  Couldn't they package him with Heilman and Pelfrey to take a run at someone like Bedard?  Or even trade him to someone like the White Sox for Vazquez?

by SQUAD on Nov 30, 2007 1:53 PM EST   0 recs

It's not a bad deal really...
Schneider is not Estrada at all. He's an oustanding defensive catcher and he's got a nice arm.  He calls a very good game.  We have a good offense defense combination behind the plate now.  Everyone knew we needed another catcher.  Milledge is not thought of as well as he was in the past. Church is a very solid OF who is consistent and gets a fair amount of extra base hits.  Plus it's a left-handed bat which we need in our lineup.  Delgado is our only threat from the left side of the plate.

Milledge could always make this one blow up in our faces but have you really seen anything to make you think he's going to be the player people thought he would be originally?  I've seen flashes but nothing substantive really.

by Willence on Nov 30, 2007 1:54 PM EST   0 recs

I obviously agree...
Even though I think Milledge has a shot to be a Dodgers era Mondesi.  

by SQUAD on Nov 30, 2007 1:57 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

holy shit
This is insanity. This will come back to haunt the Mets for sure.
We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!

by kingcritical on Nov 30, 2007 1:58 PM EST   0 recs

Not So Bad
Schneider does help a little behind the plate based on his defense.

I don't really like that we got rid of Milledge since he seemed likely to start in the OF this season. Church is a good player, albeit slightly older than Milledge. He is an OBP-machine, which I like (Moneyball-type fan here). The question I pose - "who is going to be our 3rd OF? Is Church going to start or Endy Chavez? I guess they might be sufficient, or similar to the production Milledge would have produced but I would have liked to see a larger upgrade here!

by SeanNY on Nov 30, 2007 2:01 PM EST   0 recs

Hello?
"Slightly" older than Milledge? Try 7 years older!

Church is not an OBP machine by any stretch. He OBPed at .349 last year, that's solid but it hardly makes him exceptional (he was at .361 in '06 which is good but not outstanding either).  Church is definitely nice player and a legit Major Leaguer, but Lastings could have ben invovled in a better trade or we could have hung onto him and let him play next year and see how he looks with a full season under his belt all the while getting more HRs and better defense than we can expect from Ryan Church.

by Nick T on Nov 30, 2007 2:37 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

bad trade
Milledge was a piece you could deal for pitching. Church has no value.

by dbloom on Nov 30, 2007 2:02 PM EST   0 recs

Not So Much Value in Milledge
If you have seen the recent reports, Milledge did not have as much value as he had in the past. Last year, a Heilman/Milledge deal would have gotten us Blanton, but Billy Beane did not see that as a sufficient trade now! So, it seems like Carlos Gomez is one of the pieces that will bring in pitching if we do make a trade, but I still think Minaya will go after a free agent rather than make a deal for a SP. I still like the idea of getting Jon Lieber for the year and then looking at a stronger free-agent market next off-season!

by SeanNY on Nov 30, 2007 2:06 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

No
Only reason Milledge didn't have value was because of idiot stuff that they peddle on talk radio. The guy is going to be way better than Church in a couple years, maybe even in '08. This is a digusting trade and I am switching teams. Omar and Willie are old losers who play-it-safe. Manny Acta is cool and takes risks.

by vonhayes on Nov 30, 2007 2:30 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

People overrate the value of Milledge...
Church will be good in our outfield next year.  We need the LH bat!  We now need to find our other corner OF and get a starting pitcher somehow.  We still have the chips to get a guy like Haren.  The hot guys we have now is Gomez/Martinez anyway.  If we want Bedard or Haren, it's going to take one of those guys plus a couple more top prospects to get one of those two.

We're just not in a strong dealing position now because our minors suck from AA up vs. other teams like Boston and the Yankees.  We must put a lot of effort into rebuilding our system.  At this point, we're going to have to liquidate our system to get the pitcher we so badly need.  This team must win next year or maybe in 2009 because the window is closing fast!

by Willence on Nov 30, 2007 2:07 PM EST   0 recs

Left-handed bat
We already have Chavez, Gotay and Anderson. Unless Church is starting, we have too many lefties for the bench.

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 2:22 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Milledge was a prospect
"If we want Bedard or Haren, it's going to take one of those guys plus a couple more top prospects to get one of those two."

Umm, like, say, a Lastings Milledge?  If we didn't love Lastings why not throw him into a deal along with other prospects for a top flight starter.  Why did we foreclose that possibility and remove a chip from our sucky minors system to get Ryan frickin' Church!??

These are all reasons we should NOT have made that trade.

by Nick T on Nov 30, 2007 2:47 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Wow
That's fuck-stupid.

by Josh on Nov 30, 2007 2:14 PM EST   0 recs

Don't like it
The article seems to suggest that Schneider and his sub-.700 OPS is going to be the starter.  And you don't trade away one of your top prospects to add depth, you sign a cheap player like Easley for that.

by Josh on Nov 30, 2007 2:34 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

blows
suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks

i have one good thing to say about church.  i enjoyed heckling him at RFK.

castro must feel like a real chump.  omar is doing everything he can just to not play him.  

by kendynamo on Nov 30, 2007 2:35 PM EST   0 recs

Really?
You don't think Castro is going to play?

And were you comfortable with handing the every day job to an overweight catcher with an arthritic back who has never played a full season before?

Don't get me wrong, I don't question Castro's ability.  I think he has the talent to be better than most team's starting catchers, but Minaya needed to have a capable insurance policy.

Plus, I think Schneider/Castro makes for a nice platoon.

by SQUAD on Nov 30, 2007 2:40 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

A Nice Platoon
Did we just trade a 22yo guy with a great arm, very good speed and a quick back to get back a "nice platoon" at catcher?  

by Nick T on Nov 30, 2007 2:49 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

WAKE UP MINAYA & SMELL THE FARTS
What are the Mets thinkin.  Homestly, if there was no market for Milledge then hold him.  We kept him this long and wouldn't trade him in past years - I even recall holding him and not trading him for D. Willis.  Go and resign Lo Duca if you are not confident in Castro or Estrada.  Milledge would have been a nice option starting in the OF.  He has power, speed and a good glove.  This makes no sense - I will go and throw hot dogs on the field next year.

by Sollie on Nov 30, 2007 3:07 PM EST   0 recs

Kazmir Part II
Milledge isn't a sure thing, but this is a terrible, awful, godforsaken deal.  The right approach to Lastings's stock having fallen would've been to play him in MLB for a couple years and take advantage of already having on the team a player who's better than anything he'd bring in trade.

by anonymous on Nov 30, 2007 3:25 PM EST   0 recs

Its the ages that gets me
Once again were getting older. Back side of their careers. Even if milledge ends up being slighty above average they get that for much longer and as of right now he has much more promise.

What we'll get maybe one or two good years from these guys each.

Would have rather only taken one of them plus a very good graft pick. We need to stay young at all times even if only using for trade chips.

by sincethebeginning on Nov 30, 2007 3:34 PM EST   0 recs

Church just turned 29 last month.
That's not "old."  In fact, he's probably in his prime right now.  And he's only been in the majors for 3 years, so he doesn't cost that much more than Milledge would (especially given the Mets' resources).  My only concern is that he probably needs a RH platoon partner because his #s against LHs are underwhelming.  

Schneider at 31 is considerably younger than PLD (the relevant comparison), much better defensively, and, one would hope, less of an A-hole.  I would expect him to get 100-120 starts, Castro to get the rest, and Estrada (if he isn't moved) to become well-acquainted with many of New Orleans' finer restaurants.  

by madisonmetsfan on Nov 30, 2007 4:32 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

The sad fact is
Church in his prime is .272/.349/.464
Milledge years away is .272/.341/.446

How can you justify that?

Talkin' Sports

by BlackOps on Nov 30, 2007 5:34 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Trade
I'm surprised a Saber-guy like Eric doesn't love this trade.  Church is controllable for 3 more years at what should be a reasoable wage.  Especially considering Church was number 35 in OPS in the NL last year playing in a pitchers park and plays pretty good defense.  I think his bat fits really well into our lineup behind Alou.  Not a bad when your 7 hitter can get you 65 extra-base hits if plays a full slate.

Scheider is what he is, but there's nothing wrong with having a guy who calls a great game and nails runners like Scheidner.  Maybe his bat is a bit light in the SLG, but a 330-340OBP isn't atrocious.

I think people declaring this trade a mistake are really overrating Milledge.  Sure he has great tools, and may well be a star someday.  But, if you think he could've brought more back in a trade, your kidding yourself.  Obviously he wasn't a key to any deal for an ace, or he'd still be here.  That's obvious on his face.  But Church is a better player for the Mets in 2008 and Omar whether we like or not is win now mode.  Because if we flounder next year, it won't matter to Omar that Milledge shines in 2009 if Omar gets canned in the winter of 2008.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 4:08 PM EST   0 recs

wha?
Obviously he wasn't a key to any deal for an ace, or he'd still be here.

So your argument is premised on Omar's infallibility?

by anonymous on Nov 30, 2007 5:09 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Omar
Do you not think Omar has talked to each GM who might have an ace for sale?  Obviously he did, that much is well known.  And, it's pretty obvious that eachof them said Milledge was not needed to get the deal done.  Omar is not infallible, but if any of those with an ace to deal had said Milledge needs to be a piece of the package he would not have been traded at this point in time.  do you really think any of them said we'd like to have Milledge and we'll get back you, and then Omar would go trade him.  Omar is a lot things, but a complete moron he is not.  

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 5:41 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

not a complete moron
but somebody desperate to win now or lose his job.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Nov 30, 2007 5:46 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Trade
Yes, that is the idea as far as Omar is concernced. Milledge may be a star one day no doubt. But it doesn't matter to Omar if gets fired.  He needs to win next year, not 'down the road'.  I think Milledge can be a star, but clearly Church is a better fit for this team in 2008, and since their is no real thumper to get to catch, why not have the best defesive catcher around.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 5:51 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

well
if you think he can become a star why not next year and with the Mets. We know that Church won't be. Ridiculous. With the Mets starters and relievers, they will be lucky to finish in 3rd place and Dan Haren (who they won't get anyway) won't change it. I would rather see Milledge become a star. My guess is they end up with someone underwhelming like Blanton and frustrate all of us next year. I look forward to seeing Scott Kazmir pitching to Lastings Milledge in future All Star games. Fuck the Mets
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Nov 30, 2007 5:56 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Star
Because he won't be one next year.  We need a LH bat to protect Alou, and provide solid defense in 2008, not down the road.  While Milledge makes a good CF, he's poor in RF.  His reads are bad in the corner whereas Church is a solid RF'er.  

While I'd like to hang to chips for the future, when you're the GM in NY the future is always now.  The reaction to the trade is certainly expected, b/c fans only see their prospects as future stars, not future Ochoa's, and Escobar's.  GM's know better, and when you need to win like we do in 2008, better to ride with a guy who you know can give you 275/355/470/18/80 then a guy who may one day go 290/360/500/20/100.  

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 7:45 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Church
Church did not play a single game last year in right field, and in a four year career has only played 41 games in right. Milledge has played 52 games in right in his short career. Hard to understand how you feel Church is a solid right feidler.

Last year in 59 games Milledge had a .272/.341/.446/7/29 line.

Of course, how would we know what he could do in a full season? Willie always wanted to see Shawn Green play.

And it's like this trade is the "fix" for 2008. We're still way far away from a championship, and downgrading at one position and carrying three catchers doesn't help.

Talkin' Sports

by BlackOps on Nov 30, 2007 11:00 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Why is Church better?
Please prove it to me.

Schneider is the best defensive catcher in the majors? News to me.

Talkin' Sports

by BlackOps on Nov 30, 2007 6:16 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Trade
I can't come to your house and prove it to you, but if you can read a scouting report you'd know it too. He throws out runners, he calls great games, and blocks balls.  Read any scouts take on the guy.  SLG pct, eh not so much.  But a 330 OBP is no worse than PLD would throw up there.

Church is a better fit for us in 2008.  He's lefty, he's a better RF'ers than Lastings by far, and he has pop.  You don't place number 35 in OPS playing in DC w/o being a good hitter.  Sure, exstrapolate Milledge's numbers out all you want, but he's far from a proven commodity.  Church may never be a star, but neither is Lastings at this point.  If you want potential, Milledge is your man.  But, if you want a hitter who will draw respect from RHP's who will have to Mitch to Moises, and somebody who plays good defense in RF it's Church.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 7:38 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

He calls great games?
I'd like you to show me that stat please. It's like saying he has a lot of grit and hustle. Maybe he does, maybe he doesn't, but there's certainly no way to prove it so we shouldn't base a trade around it.

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 8:08 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Calling a game
Really there is no way to prove it.  Hmmm, that's a lot of money MLB teams are pissing away on scouting then.  Maybe they're wrong, but the consensus is Scheidner can do it all defensively as a catcher.  Maybe you don't agree with the scouts, but since they get paid and you don't, I'll go with their opinion.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 8:16 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Okay
Show me a SCOUT who said so. Please. Show me where a scout said he calls a good game. I've read a few media reports that claim he does, but no scout. (and a media guy citing "scouts say..." doesn't count. I want an actual scout.) Otherwise it's just conjecture (on the media's part) and we don't really know.

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 8:31 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Scout
Sorry, you can't just find detailed scouting reports on the internet.  MLB teams don't spend the money they do in order to make them public domain.  I too am going by what I've heard scouts say, what the scout I know has told me, not to mention my own eyes.  It seems weird to me, but I guess you can choose to not believe scouting consensus saying he's a great defensive catcher.  All those teams spending all that money. and they can't convice you. What a shame.

But tune in 2008, and you can see with your own eyes what great defensive catching is all about.  Though, you may want to tune out when he steps to the plate.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 9:01 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

I wasn't questioning his defense....
I was questioning his skill at calling a game or to be more specific, how we could know whether he is or isn't good at calling a game.

Regardless, I hope you're right. And I hope Church has more upside than we are giving him credit for. I feel like the trade is a complete disaster, but if I'm wrong I'll gladly say it and be smiling the whole time.  :)

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 9:17 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

More Omar
it's just simple deduction to know Milledge was not briging an ace.  Omar wants an ace badly.  He's willing to give up plenty.  If Milledge was a chip to land an ace he would NEVER trade him.  So no matter how great we Met fans, or Keith Law, or WFAN may think Milledge is going to be, nobody was willing to give up the ace we need with him as a centerpiece.  

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 5:48 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Even if
Even if Milledge wasn't going to bring an ace, alone (duh) or as part of a package, that doesn't mean you need to trade him for crap.

Manny Acta must be fucking LAUGHING at us right now.

by Josh on Nov 30, 2007 6:01 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Ace
Duh, who said he'd bring one alone?  Certainly not I, and obviously he's not even worth being a part of a trade for one according to every GM who has an ace for sale.

If you think Ryan Church is crap, then you don't know baseball.

by whynot on Nov 30, 2007 8:22 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

"Duh"
No, my point was "duh, of course he's not going to being one alone"...  I'm not sure whether it was in the realm of possibility that he was going to bring one was part of a package obviously, since I'm not part of these trade negotiations.

Church didn't get to the majors until 25.  Since then he's had one good season and it took him until he was 28 to have that happen.  Unless he starts taking steroids he's not going to improve drastically at this point in his career.  And even at 28, he had almost exactly the same batting line as Milledge had at 22.  Church strikes out a lot more often than he walks.  So does Milledge at this point, but Milledge is young enough that he can learn plate discipline.  For next season, PECOTA puts Church at .271/.354/.475, Milledge at .289/.361/.475.  In other words, even before Milledge is done developing and Church is in the best years of his career, Milledge is better.

Church is 28 and he's had one productive year in the major leagues.  Maybe "crap" was too harsh but there's no way he's worth one of our best prospects.

by Josh on Nov 30, 2007 10:45 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Steroids
And what makes you think he won't start taking steroids and make monster improvements? See, maybe Omar has suggested he do so, whereas Milledge was unwilling...

There are too many "HUGE MISTAKE" and "GREAT DEAL" posts. Its not that bad, but not great either. We may be better off, but we probably parted with a bit much or got too little in return.

Maybe Omar plans to use Church off the bench, start Schneider at Catcher, and go after Kosuke Fukudome (Japanese RF) in free agency! I like that idea!

by SeanNY on Dec 1, 2007 7:29 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

No
It just goes back to the idiocy of the Mets franchise re: Milledge. He should have been starting RF in '07, he should have been allowed to develop. But they wanted to go with an old crappy guy instead. And if they wanted to get rid of him all along, there was a problem there - mainly that, since he didn't play much in '07, we couldn't get dick for him in a trade. If he'd have played and posted big numbers, his trade value would have been higher had they not desired to hang on to him.

Now they're doing the same in '08, going with old crappy guy Ryan Church, except they don't even have Milledge waiting in the wings, ready to blossom. Just a terribly run team.

by vonhayes on Nov 30, 2007 4:27 PM EST   0 recs

Omar on WFAN
Even he can't seem to explain the trade.

By the way, this is not the first time Omar has traded for Church.

by JC on Nov 30, 2007 4:48 PM EST   0 recs

a stupid assed trade
when will this organization learn not to trade away young players with great upside for older, marginal players so that they can win now. Omar has the same problem as Harazin, Macalvaine, Duquette and Phillips. Well, they won't win now and they won't win later if they continue to make the same Kazmir-Milledge mistakes. I'm sick and tired of this shit.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Nov 30, 2007 5:43 PM EST   0 recs

I'm throughly digusted
Keep Lastings Milledge Free

by DoctorK16 on Nov 30, 2007 7:11 PM EST   0 recs

I was wondering where you were Doc
I was imagining they were talking you off the ledge. This is becoming a hard team to love
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Nov 30, 2007 9:13 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

I'm with you, Doc
The kid was never given a fair shake, and it makes me sick. I hate to say it, and maybe I'm not in a position to, but I feel there is a racist facet to this deal. Fuck the tabloids and fuck the Mets for this trade. Part of me hopes he kills the Mets for years to come.
We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!

by kingcritical on Nov 30, 2007 9:22 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

yuck.
We've got ourselves a ball club, the Mets of New York town!

by kingcritical on Nov 30, 2007 9:42 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

be careful
We've all spent the last 24 hours howling about how bullshit published in the papers got Milledge run out of town, so lets not jump on Church because of some other bullshit published in the papers.

I remember when that story broke, and it was a case of Church being a) dumb as a post, or b) never having met a Jewish person in his life before he started dating that ex-girlfriend, and thus actually listening to the words of Jon Moeller, the fire-and-brimstone loon who told Church that Jews are condemned to damnation.  Church was likely just too dumb to keep his mouth shut about what Moeller told him.

Had Church dug further, he probably would have found out from the good rev. that gays, Catholics, members of the ACLU, Democrats, Ron Paul supporters, etc. are all damned as well. ;-)

So let's not condemn Church as an anti-semite any more than we'd condemn Milledge as a gangsta.

Let's Go Meters in New York!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on Dec 1, 2007 11:23 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

give me a break
I don't get your analogy to Milledge. I think putting someone down for excessive high fiving or cutting a rap song is a far cry from a guy condemning a group of people to holy damnation. Stupidity doesn't excuse anti-Semitism just like it doesn't exclude racism. I just wonder why the Mets organization didn't consider this baggage in relation to Church but considered Milledge's personal conduct an albatross. Hey, I don't think that Church shouldn't play on the Mets because of the conduct, but neither should Lastings have been banished for his statments or conduct.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Dec 1, 2007 11:49 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

the analogy
It's that newspapers in both instances made a mountain out of a molehill.  Milledge is not a gangbanger, and Church is not an anti-semite.

I'm not happy with the deal, but let's not pre-emtively hate Church for no reason.  I'm cheering for the guy in 2008.

Let's Go Meters in New York!!!

by Greenpoint Ian on Dec 1, 2007 1:53 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Wow Ian
I didn't know you had this uncanny ability to know that Church isn't anti-Semitic. It must be a great gift. I'm not saying he is but you can't deny that the statement attributed to him is clearly anti-Semitic. You are comparing apples and oranges.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Dec 1, 2007 3:10 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Who Cares?
I'm not condemning Church because he is (or isn't, I don't know or care) an anti-Semite, I'm condemning him because he's a a mediocre baseball player.

by Josh on Dec 3, 2007 11:28 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

its kind of relavent
because the rationale for this trade is that Milledge is a problem child, so now you trade him for someone who has anti-Semitic comments in his past?
Keep Lastings Milledge Free

by DoctorK16 on Dec 3, 2007 8:04 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

thanks Doc
you got my point. I don't assume that Church is an anti-semite nor do I assume that Lastings is a problem child. However, we all know that Milledge's perceived personality issues was a major reason they dumped him.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Dec 3, 2007 8:54 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

you're in every position
to. Call a spade a spade. Milledge treatment here was mired in the worse kind of racism. I'll be addressing  all of this in a diary, but IMO Omar did a very bad thing today that he'll live to regret. He let the writers decide who's allowed to be on his baseball team.
Keep Lastings Milledge Free

by DoctorK16 on Nov 30, 2007 11:03 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

I sure hope
I hope the media gets its act together and starts reporting truth with regards to these players, because from what I can tell, Milledge never really [i]did[/i] anything wrong. He high-fived some fans, made a rap song a few years ago, and pissed off some veterans.

This week, one of my favorite football players, Sean Taylor, was shot and killed in his home as you probably know. He was always labeled as a trouble man for an incident on the playing field stemming from when he spit into an opponent's (Michael Pittman) face during a game, and from being charged with assault and brandishing a gun. (of which the charges were proved to be false lies and he was never convicted of anything) These things happened years ago, but he was always labeled. He was a quiet guy and never really let the media into his life at all. When he died, every player who knew him and friend or family member or coach of the Skins said he turned his life around since that incident. Well, the moral of this story is that I really hope people get to know the truth about Milledge, whatever it may be, before he's [b]dead[/b]. These things happened years ago.

This past week I've been so crushed about Sean Taylor's death and now Milledge gets dealt away, and the first thing many people point out is his "troubles." I think it's a very sad deal that we don't get to know these guys really are until they're dead. From this point on, I vow to tell people who these guys really are without assumptions from the media and paranoia from the media.
It just sickens me that Taylor can be glorified once he's dead, but a guy like Milledge who has been looked at similarly by the media is still crucified simply because he's alive.

A long rant by me letting out a big steam of anger from Taylor's death to Milledge's trade, but the moral is that the media blows. They're all looking for a story, that's all they care about. It's sad that we only learn about a guy when he's gone.

I look forward to what you have to say, doc, because at this point I can't really express my feelings well. It's been a long week.

:(

Talkin' Sports

by BlackOps on Nov 30, 2007 11:29 PM EST to parent up   0 recs

Amen
I applaud you for your comments, BlackOps. I am 99% certain that there was racial motivation behind this trade, and it's a shame to hear today that Sean Taylor's death was a random shooting after 72 hours of completely unfair speculation that he somehow instigated it. The media is bullshit. Lastings Milledge did nothing wrong during his tenure with the Mets, and is now part of yet another trade which I'm sure will haunt the Mets for years to come. I still have the SI issue with the cover story hailing Omar Minaya as a melting-pot GM. I now feel that the story is tarnished, just another postcard from the season that went to Hell.
Together we mourn.

by TheFlushingKings on Dec 1, 2007 12:31 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

very well said
it is not fair to blame Minaya entirely since he must deal with the Wilpons who want to convey a certain image. I have seen several morons in the media state that Lastings trade value went down and this was the best they could get for him. Well, what about holding onto him. That's where the racism comes in. I am confident that, like Kazmir who played the radio too loudly, Milledge will thrive on his new team as the Mets fade quickly into mediocrity.
Save America. Impeach Bush

by elifriedman on Dec 1, 2007 12:41 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

uhhhh....
"Milledge will thrive on his new team as the Mets"

tad dramatic, no?

by SQUAD on Dec 1, 2007 1:07 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

bbcode
That generally only works in forums. You have to use html, like <i></i> for italics, <b></b> for bold, etc.

by Eric Simon on Dec 1, 2007 12:37 AM EST to parent up   0 recs

the media
Again, I'm sure we'll talk about this some more i'm sure, but the reason the media is so bad at letting us know who the Sean Taylor's and Milledge's of the world are is that so many of them are a poor position to know themselves. In the last few decades a couple things have happened to changed the landscape of sport in America. The athlete have gotten richer through free agency and they're many more athletes of color The same hasn't happened in sportswriting though. Is their a major NYC paper employing a black beat writer in any major sport? I can't think of any, unless you want to count George Willis boxing beat. All of the papers have their requisite black sportswriter, but he's usually writing a column, not covering athletes day to day. So what you have is a lot of older, mostly suburban white guys covering a bunch of young black males. They like to pretend they leave their biases at the door or don't have any, but we should all know better by now. This is particularly a problem in baseball because it is theoretically possible to (poorly) cover a team without having relationships with black or even Latin players. Try doing that in the NBA or NFL, those writers have had to learn to adapt some, and they still suck at it as you pointed out. Obviously there know easy answers to this, except to hope that the as the older guys retire they're replaced by more open-minded people who are better at it. The reader also needs to get better at reading through agendas and bullshit, if  you looked carefully at the Milledge coverage from the day he was drafted it was obvious that something very wrong was up with how he was covered. He hadn't even signed yet and mysteriously in the Sunday paper there's an article making him out to be a sexual predator of some sort. That proved to be a harbinger.
Keep Lastings Milledge Free

by DoctorK16 on Dec 1, 2007 6:51 AM EST